#when El did that

[kedreeva]

Was thinking yesterday about how Billy died. About how Billy was always going to die. Not, like "Always" but lowercase always, by the time they got to that scene. He was one of the flayed, still. When they cut off the head to kill the body, Billy was going to die anyway. There wasn't time to save him, then. There were no resources to heat the mindflayer out of him. He was always going to die by that point. They tried to save him, in the sauna, and they failed, and from that point on, he was always going to die because they had no time, no resources, no additional chances.

And I find his arc... interesting, to say the least. Curious, maybe would be a good word? He was pretty terrible as a human being - there's no real arguing that, his actions were his own no matter how badly I feel for the circumstances that brought him to that point. He was faced with a mundane Bad Guy (his father's abuse, being taken from his home environment, being thrust into a social-familial relationship he didn't want at a young age, etc) and turned that into anger and lashing out at people that didn't deserve it. His learned behaviors are aggression against the people who can't fight back. He backs off Max when she does fight back.

Now, in most situations in media where you have this kind of character, if they are presented with additional power, the aggression would just.... scale. No more feeling powerless, once they have power. And having More Power means there are more people who have less power than them. This is where you get the jump from bad person to bad guy to villain. Except... Billy never really made the leap to villain. I'm not even convinced he made it to bad guy, except by force.

Because, and here is where it starts to get interesting to me, when faced with being handed Power by the mindflayer (and granted, there's control involved as well, but fuck man, look at the difference between Henry and Billy when both were there to collect power for the mindflayer), instead of becoming a worse person, instead of becoming a monster, Billy fights the mindflayer every step of the way. He's in there screaming the entire time, and we see it several times. We see him breaking down and exhausted in the sauna, crying for Max (and yes, I think that was genuinely Billy until it wasn't) and trying to tell her he's fighting and doesn't want to be doing the things he's doing. We see him fighting when he's sitting in the car outside the mall; if he wasn't, he'd have rammed into Nancy's station wagon right off the bat. We see him, even REALLY early on, snarl at Karen to get away/stay away from him because he doesn't want to hurt her.

And that's... interesting. It's fascinating to see a character that's faced with mundane evil become a bad person, but then when faced with supernatural evil, they balk and try to become better. Try to become good, even.

And listen, I don't approve of the "sacrifice as redemption" trope in general, I think it's OFTEN a cop out so writers don't have to deal with the intricacies of a bad person/guy/villain becoming better (or at least doing so believably). But at the same time, the kids tried to save him. They actually had a really good plan to try to save him, they gave it an earnest shot, they were very resourceful and clever in their attempt to lure him into the sauna and smoke out the mindflayer to protect Billy. They ultimately failed, and the mindflayer would have killed them for it if Mike hadn't rescued El, but they DID try, and once they had failed, there was no real going back. Billy was going to die from that point on.

And I can't help but think that, you know. Did Billy understand what they were doing? Did that attempt give him any hope? Did he think they would try again, or at least hope they would? At what point did he realize they were out of time? At what point did he realize he was going to die, no matter what? Whenever it was, we see him fight even after that.

Because he fights the whole time. All that time, all the terrible things he did anyway, only for El to touch his cheek with infinite gentleness - and please, remember with me that he has been subjected so far to the raw mind of the true villain of the story so far, the villain that sees El as The Enemy, she is the single strongest force the mindflayer is fighting against, the one enemy he has focused all of his efforts against as the Only One who can stop him, which means that Billy must be aware she is powerful, but after however many days of a fight for his goddamn soul, after witnessing unfathomable horrors with no comfort anywhere, after repeatedly attacking her and then offering her life up to the mindflayer, the kindness with which she treats him, the gentleness, the forgiveness, the utter recognition that she understands this is not him, and perhaps most importantly the knowledge that she thinks there's still time for him to be Good... fuck, man. I'd choose her, too.

He's gotta know he's going to go down, but he's going down either way. They tried. They failed, but they tried to save him. He's repaying the effort. I know it's easy to see what he does, the way he dies, as an attempt to redeem himself through sacrifice. But the more I think about it, the more I think maybe it wasn't. Maybe he was repaying El's kindness- the first genuine act of kindness directed at him from someone that had literally been inside of his head and seen everything he is. How must it feel, to know someone has seen that, seen all of you, the good, the bad, and the ugly, and still touches you gently? Touches the good in you and says that is who you are.

I can't help but think that just maybe he has seen worst side of the most evil thing in their world, and been touched by the love of the best force of good, and he just makes the choice to stop fighting against the mindflayer and start fighting for El. And that's why he can resist so fully in that moment and chooses to do so; not because he's trying to redeem himself, not because he thinks he'll be forgiven, not because he thinks he can win, not because he even thinks he'll survive, but because we are always stronger when fighting for something than against, and he was just reminded he had something to fight for.

Anyway. Having some thoughts again.

[breesperez139]

Dc x Dp Prompt #6

“I’m a twin”, Damian said one night. He could feel the narrowed eyes of his family drilling holes on his back in disbelief. Not that he could blame them. Damian had never so much as implied being raised with a companion, much less a sibling.

“I had a brother”. Damian paused to recollect himself. He had not said his brother’s name out loud in over 8 years.

“His name was… Danyal”. Damian hated the way his voice wavered, but he could not help it. Danyal was everything to him, his other half. Their heart beat as one and when one heart stopped beating, the other one died with it. At least until his family put his heart on metaphorical life support without ever realizing.

“Where is he now?” His father asked, voice filled with knowing grief and a hint of betrayal. It had in fact been 6 years since Damian first showed up on his doorstep.

“Up there”. All eyes shifted towards the specific star he was pointing to. “Right before he died, he promised me he’d guide me from the stars. Unfortunately, the stars are not visible in Gotham, so my brother is unable to be of much help unless I leave the city.”

“Your brother is Polaris, the North Star?” Tim questioned warily, most likely in attempts to not offend him. Damian was aware of how stupid it sounded, but Danyal had promised, and his brother never broke his promises.

“Yes. Danyal is with the stars now, just as he always wanted”

[ochibrochi]

metropolis nights 🌙 (kal-el ver. under the cut) original "template" by @/K0TTERl

[gonnadosomethingwmylife]

I’m obsessed with the fact that Neal goes over to Peter and Elizabeth’s house so often the marshals gave up and just made it a part of his ankle radius 😭?? he gets 2 miles + their house???

[marcspectrr]

WHY IN THE WORLD DID THEY DELETE THE SCENE WITH MARC AND LAYLA TALKING THROUGHOUT CAIRO?? They've kept this for 2 years????

The tension between them, being their first interaction in months!!!

Layla saying she likes Steven since "he tries to communicate" as Marc is walking away from her!!!

Layla talking about the blip and meeting Asgardians!!!

I'm not okay ahdjfkgkkg

[codgod]

masochism tango

[nerdpoe]

It's the End.

A huge mission, the world at stake, and in the end only Red Robin, Impulse, Wonder Girl, and Superboy made it to the center to place the bomb that would the alien mothership.

Superboy is injured.

Red Robin is injured.

Impulse is injured.

Wonder Girl is injured.

They know they won't be able to outrun this.

They die in sacrifice to something Greater, clinging to each other for comfort.

They wake up.

And oh shit look at that they've been reborn.

But there's been changes.

Bart is reborn as Tim's fraternal twin. Instead of loving but distant, Jack and Janet are criminal in their neglect. Not even Tim can defend them; they forget to leave food for their toddlers, for fucks sake.

Bart takes control and ends up speeding to Central City as soon as he can toddle to go on food runs. He knows what it's like to go hungry, in the future that wasn't, and he isn't going to let that happen to Tim.

Kon is reborn as Clark's actual, legitimate firstborn with Lois, who Clark had gotten together with far sooner in this new world. They love him so much and he...doesn't believe it. Can't. He isn't who they think he is, he doesn't deserve this, and when they find out it'll only hurt him more if he falls for it.

Cassie is reborn as Wonder Woman's only daughter, and spends her summers with her father, Steve Trevor, before he passes away and all other times in Themyscira.

Now they have to grow up in a world so very different but so very similar.

Cassie still looks in on her other mom, her first one, but has nothing she can say to explain it to Diana.

Bart still has super speed, but Tim is still a non-meta.

Kon struggles with the Clark he's seeing growing up and how much it clashes with the Clark he knew in his past life.

[whynotimtired]

The best part of Will saying he wants forever with Mike so blatantly is that he isn't the one who brought it up, Mike was. In an act of projection he asks "What did you think? That we'd actually get to be together forever? When we're both boys?" and will says yes. He says yes, and Mike immediately regrets it.

[holyvirgilscriptures]

me as a "will has been in love with mike since s1" truther and jealous will byers enjoyer:

[will80sbyers]

Rental solutions... Ohhh so it's not yours forever!

this never fails to make me laugh and y'all can add it to all the other parallels between Milkvan and Stanxy

[hhhhleb]

Hi, I love your little!jake art and such

so I wonder how would Little!jake react to holding a new born baby or a cat?

OOh thank u so much!!🤍💫 I think he would be super gentle with it(both baby&cat)! And would be curiously scrutinize it, like a new mechanism - interested in it's working algorithm. I don't think he would be very good at taking care of it(that's more Marc's thing) BUT he would be very eager to play with it!

about this specific comics(yeah i turn everything i see into narrative this is my superpower): in my experience pets rarely harm kids in contrary to adults, so this kitten scratches, bites, destroys everything/everyone she sees, but never Jake, with him she's always very obidient and kind!

She loves everyone just shows her affection very differently:)

pt 1 pt 2

[chirpsythismorning]

Can we talk about how Jonathan might've been able to clock Mike simply because of what happened with him and Nancy in season two?

This will be a long post, so you might want to strap in or save it for later.

In Will and Mike's case, it would obviously be much different from Jonathan and Nancy's situation, given that you know, they're gay. But we still have Jonathan arguably going through a similar experience as Will, while Mike is going through a similar experience as Nancy.

In s2, we see Nancy confront Jonathan about how she waited for him before getting back with Steve, which is a revelation to him. Then they're at Murray's and she's struggling to say she loves Steve, after a handful of moments between them that felt like she might return Jonathan’s feelings. And you can clearly see it in his eyes, listening to Murray imply that they have feelings for each other, with him looking back and forth sort of in awe of what's happening, like he's starting to question if she might actually like him back.

Will doesn't have that same affordance as Jonathan to really hope, at least not anymore. Which is why these relationships in s2 and s4 end differently for these two brothers.

Based on all the signs he was seeing that Nancy felt the same, Jonathan decided to take the plunge to admit to Nancy how he felt, and at that same moment Nancy had the courage to show how she felt. In Will and Mike's case, Will wasn't ready to take the plunge to admit to Mike how he felt, at the same moment Mike didn't have the courage to show how he felt.

What's so painfully hilarious to me about all of this though, is that Jonathan arguably starts the season in the same shoes as most of the audience, where from his perspective, it's becoming obvious to him now that Will like's Mike, but that Mike does not feel the same way.

First at Rink-O-Mania, Mike appears a little uncomfortable upon hugging Will. Then as the happy couple continues on their adventure into Rink-O-Mania, he watches Will lagging behind moping. And then unfortunately he's out of commission for the rest of the evening...

But once he's sober and back to being an attentive brother the following morning, we see him watching them at breakfast, with Mike barely sparing Will a glance, all while Will is blatantly staring, almost like he's waiting for Mike to look back, only for Mike to get up and walk away.

All of these instances gotta be SCREAMING unrequited gay love to Jonathan. He's already gotten signs for years that Will is gay, these are now just the signs that are instilling his suspicions that Will has feelings for Mike. He could have easily interpreted their relationship in the early seasons as young best friends, with Will seeming to have a crush on Mike, and with them growing up and that potentially including Will's straight friend distancing himself from him because he doesn't feel the same. It's not the most unexpected thing in the world considering.

But then there's a shift.

Suddenly he's creeping up on them talking in his room. And we know he was listening in on the conversation because he brings up Owens when he sits down. As he's eavesdropping, he's probably thinking something innocent like Aww they're making up! And like, hey! Even if Mike doesn't feel the same, which is okay and entirely expected honestly, at least he still cares about Will enough to make things right after acting so out of character. Still, I'm not gonna lie, that sounded a lot like flirting to me--

Then he's knocking on Will's door like 30 minutes or less later only to find Mike and Will back on their bullshit. Mike suddenly isn't going out of his way to ignore or put Will on the back burner. In fact, he's on his bed and they're talking, again! The door is even closed this time, which is interesting. This has gotta be a good sign in Jon's eyes. Nothing to worry about! Right? Right...?

But then suddenly this shift continues, going in a direction he probably didn't expect.

I mean, this is literally an identical jancy parallel we have here with byler on the hood of the car, with Jonathan right there to witness it. Despite him maybe only now subconsciously picking up on the similarities between Will and Mike to him and Nancy here, he's at least taking note (I mean he's even got his gay map out and everything).

It isn't until the van scene happens, that I think Jonathan starts to genuinely consider his suspicions, which is that Mike might actually like Will back.

EVERY time we get a shot of Jonathan looking back at Will and Mike in the van, followed by a shot of his POV from the rearview mirror, we're faced with Mike looking at Will while Will is looking away.

As Jonathan is hearing Will confirm his suspicions about his feelings for Mike, he's simultaneously witnessing Mike not looking at Will with disgust, but something more akin to reverence. All of those moments in the van that we witnessed, including all the ways Mike looked at Will and everything that was said, Jonathan was right there.

And what's even more insane about this scene, is that it circles back to Jonathan as a character himself.

I remember when people were talking about how odd it was that we never saw Jonathan with a camera in s4. After 3 seasons in a row of making his passion for photography a big part of his identity, that part of him was apparently absent entirely this time around... But was it really?

This is the same guy that said, "Sometimes, people don't really say what they're really thinking. But you capture the right moment, it says more."

Jonathan might not have had his camera in s4, but this was without a doubt one of those moments where he captured something more.

Something that I also think get's highly overlooked about this scene, especially when it comes to Jonathan looking back at them, being followed by a shot of Mike staring at Will, is that he could see both of their reactions the whole time, from beginning to end. Will nor the audience had the affordance of knowing because Will was facing the other way at the end, while we on the other-hand were blurred from even having the chance, despite Mike literally being in the frame. But not Jonathan. He even lets us see what he sees, a few times, but not at the very end, which would have been nice after they didn't let us see Mike's reaction seconds before this.

Let's just stop right there for a second though and circle back to what I consider to be the first time Jonathan really picked up on Will's feelings for Mike, which was at the end of s3, in a sequence that is a little too relevant to the van scene if you ask me, given that they are almost direct parallels.

While these parallels are pretty spot on visually, they are also near spot on narratively when it comes to the evolution each of these characters are experiencing.

For Will in the first scene, it's sadness that he's moving away from his friends in Hawkins and also feeling like he's losing Mike, after what looks like him and El making up, which makes him scared he'll distance himself again. For Jonathan, it's sympathy for his brother who appears to have some very deep feelings for his friend, feelings he can't quite grasp yet but soon enough will.

For Will in the second scene, it's heartbreak that he has to accept that Mike will never feel the same, knowing that supporting his relationship with El (encouraging it honestly) will likely turn out just as it did last time, with him losing Mike all over again, for the last time. For Jonathan it's sympathy for his brother who has now confirmed his suspicions that the feelings he has for Mike are more than just that of a friend.

Given that this parallel reinforces the same feelings Will and Jonathan had in s3 to now, why would this not also reinforce those same feelings that Mike had in s3 to now?

In the first scene, Mike was visibly distraught, with dialogue from Hopper in the background applying a little too perfectly with what he was feeling in that moment, which was scared. He’s apparently back together with El now, despite them doing just fine as friends for the last 3 months, as well as him and Will just having finally gone back to them being on good terms again. But now, it’s like he’s right back where he started at the beginning of s3, feeling obligated to be the perfect boyfriend to El, and as a result, having no choice in his eyes but to distance himself from Will. Mike then walks into his house looking like a zombie, almost emotionless stepping into his mother's embrace.

Now, I say almost emotionless because it looks like Mike was trying to hold back showing how he truly felt in this moment. He's not crying like he did in s1 when he lost Will that first time. Time has passed and things have changed (he doesn't want things to change). And he's trying his best to keep it together. But the in-focus close-ups make it clear that he is definitely not okay.

What's so impactful about these parallels is that it presents the inner struggle both of these characters are having, both queer and experiencing doubts, but in different ways and for different reasons.

Will is the one who covers it all up with lies, hiding the tears in his eyes, because boys don't cry.

Mike is the one who has never cried to them, just to his soul (RUN AWAY! TURN AWAY! RUN AWAY! TURN AWAY! RUN AWAY!!!).

If you actually try to get a gage on Mike's in-focus emotions in that first scene vs. his out-of-focus emotions in that second scene, well they're not that far off from each other.

We go from Mike smiling vibrantly at Will, to him now slowly turning away to look back down at the painting, with whatever the hell emotion this is...

It's near impossible to catch because of how out-of-focus it is, but looking a lot closer, it honestly appears like Mike is feeling something akin to sadness that he's trying to mask. For a moment it even looks like he turns his head to wince emotionally, only to correct himself.

And call me crazy, but these shots also low-key parallel each other. Mike looking down trying to keep his emotions in check and failing miserably, only to look up and meet eyes with someone whose witnessing it.

With each shot before this of Jonathan observing Mike looking at Will, with him showing all the emotions Will never got to see and everything else in between, I wonder what Jon saw this time? Probably another thing he didn't expect.

Can you just try to imagine the silence in this van, accompanied by Will's muffled sobs, and then try to imagine Mike turning to look down at the painting, only to sneak a glance, and then go right back to looking at the painting, IN SILENCE, and then try to tell me how the assumption that Mike didn’t notice Will crying makes any sense, like realistically?

Yeah me and Jonathan are confused too.

Right now, Jonathan's probably wondering why Mike was acting a little fruity and repressed during the painting reveal. And that although he may have a penchant for being able to 'capture the right moment', Mike is sticking with his story (despite all the stalling and doubt). He is 100% straight!

And so maybe this is where Jonathan tries to accept what is being presented to him as the truth, despite the contradictions in front of him. It's likely that despite the way Mike looks at Will and acts around him, in ways he would have assumed coming from Nancy in s2 would've been evidence that she felt the same, it probably doesn't apply to Mike.

Maybe Jonathan's ready to accept that it's a lot more likely Will is experiencing unrequited love as a gay kid growing up in a small town, the most predictable experience a gay kid could go through, and in contrast Mike just feels too bad to let Will down easy.

Or who knows, maybe Mike could still be a little bit gay too...

But it doesn't matter anyways. Mike seems to be adamant about this and so there's really nothing else Jonathan can he do besides tell his brother he'll be there for him no matter what. And so he does just that.

But then Mike just has to surprise him one last time.

For those that don't know, the line Mike gives here in his monologue was in part pulled from Will's monologue in the van. Most don't know this because this line didn't make the final cut for the van scene, but in the official script the writers posted, what we find is an almost a direct parallel.

Which makes the reaction shots of Will and Jonathan directly after Mike says this all the more epic.

From Will's end he was probably hearing Mike say this and just thinking 'Damn. Well, that's what you get for using your feelings to inspire Mike to profess his love to El.'

But from Jonathan's end, I don't think his outside POV of these events overlapping was nearly as naive as his brothers understanding of the events. Because why the fuck would Mike need to use Will's feelings to inspire him to profess his love to El in the first place? Is this what Mike has been struggling with? Really? Why before every moment Mike takes action in this scene, is Will's hand literally pushing him into it? Why is Mike being so dramatic about saying I love you, stuttering and rambling about her being a superhero, not saying nearly as meaningful of things as what Will said in the van?

And then it hits him.

Mike is reminding him a little too much of another Wheeler right now...

Nancy Wheeler, who was afraid of what would happen if she accepted herself for who she really was, leading her to retreat back to the safety of Steve. Because Nancy liked Steve, but she didn't love Steve.

And now here is Mike Wheeler, who has went from being incredibly distant with Will after reuniting with El, something that is very unlike the Mike he knew in previous seasons, to something more himself again after they make up, with him looking at Will with adoration after hearing his words in the van, only to turn away and look heartbroken. Mike who is now struggling to simply tell El he loves her with Will right behind him literally yelling at him to do it.

And now it's like all those little moments are starting to add up to Jonathan.

Suddenly all those signs he picked up on from Will when he was younger are now blending in with moments Will shared with Mike. It was Mike who jumped in after him and his mom's speech to Will in the shed in s2, with tears in his eyes recalling the day that they met (without being asked, let alone pushed to). And it's Mike who is now looking like he's at war with himself as he attempts to give encouragement to El, just like he did with Will in s2, but this time he needs someone to push him to do it, and that person just so happens to be Will. After just finding out about Will's feelings and also while assuming El wants him to love her that way still, Mike is stuck.

I don't think it's takes a genius to consider Jonathan is capable of realizing how fucked they all are in this situation.

As much as Mike isn't ready for a sleuth of reasons, Will isn't ready either.

This provides a huge contrast between the bylers ², because while Jonathan and Nancy went through a similar experience to Will and Mike, them being ready to accept it and act on it didn't involve nearly as many factors and risks. Will and Mike also have the added barrier that is homophobia.

Will's internalized homophobia lies in part with assuming Mike could never feel the same based on some of the words he said in their last two fights, with parts being painfully reminiscent of the things his dad and bullies used to say about him. These are also words that contradict Mike's own words and actions from the previous seasons, things that did once give Will hope. The shame and guilt that comes with falling for your best friend, who you now know will never feel the same after being foolish enough to believe it not too long ago, and who might not even want to be your friend anymore upon finding out the truth, is understandable. He can't have hope like Jonathan can. It's just not the same.

Mike's internalized homophobia lies with assuming El wants him to love her, along with their relationship being expected and socially acceptable from everyone around him. Though unfortunately for her he feels abundantly more in love in the moments he shares with Will. Despite trying to make it work with El as hard as he could, because she's amazing and all any guy could hope for in a girlfriend, he can't ignore the fact that the feelings he has for these two people are different. The shame and guilt that comes with you, a boy, falling for your best friend, who is also a boy, and who is starting to show that he feels the same, all while you can't muster up the courage to break up with your girlfriend, nor can you muster up the courage to tell her that you love her, not when she's begging you, dying or even just simply at the end of a letter, is pretty understandable too. He can't have hope like Nancy can. It's just not the same.

Spoiler: They were not ready.

PS: I'm still not over the fact that they low-key confirmed these events elsewhere in the story...

[wheelercurse]

The Wheelers + Forced Conformity (aka the reason why they are Vecna’s target) 

[gayofthefae]

In a fight with Mike, El begs him to tell her he loves her and calls herself a monster. That fight is not about Mike or their failing romance; it is about her hating herself. It isn't about Mike; she wants it to be from Mike but it isn't about him. She believes that she is an unlovable monster and she just needs someone to tell her "you are not a monster, people have flaws and that is okay. I acknowledge that and still say: I love you." And guess what, her prayers have been answered:

"You speak of monsters and superheroes. That's the stuff of myth and fairytales. Reality, truth, is rarely so simple. People are not so easily defined." "I care[d] for you; I love[d] you."

And it is the most disgusting thing in the show. I have watched scissors in a back, burning flesh, rats explode into goo and eat people's faces. That is the most disgusting thing in the show.

And they know it. Because that's the point. She is disgusted by it. And it causes her to realize what she thought she needed was actually just what she wanted and she doesn't actually need it at all. She is fine without it and she can leave. It is a wake up call for her. And she does just that. She leaves. She leaves knowing her worth and she is lovable enough that she doesn't need him to love her, she can do it herself.

I've talked before about the many usages of "love" leading up to Mike's - Jason to Chrissy, Nancy and Jonathan, Max signing her letter to Billy, Jonathan to Will - but none of those actually matter too much in how it affects his words.

It doesn't matter that other people have already said it. It matters that El has already heard it by the time she gets Mike. And it is exactly what she wanted to hear. And she hated it.

Mike's words mean nothing now. Because if Brenner can say them and believe it, Anyone can. "I love you" is no longer some great feat. It's something you can be wrong about with your whole chest. Because they cracked open the door, made Brenner an easier to swallow gateway and said "Remember: nobody ever said it had to be true. They just said he had to say it."

[muppetbyers]

[givehimthemedicine]

ANGST AU: I'm so, so sorry, El.