#also does steph's story make sense

[bobbinalong]

Bro I am SALIVATING over your SIKTC au

There shall be more eventually! Next year, probably, but there will be because I love it a lot, too. For now, have these thoughts on the SIKTC!Browns, copied right from Twitter. (Too many of them are about the baby, but that's just something everybody here will have to deal with.)

Arthur and Steph got their injuries/scars in the same incident when Steph was about seven. Bruce killed the monster responsible -- Steph and him have not been free of each other since.

Crystal and Arthur have been seperated for. A while. They're not officially divorced, though.

Dean is still Allie's father and he's not around here, either. ?robably not even in the same city.

Steph might be the closest thing to a vigilante this AU has because Gotham is still a hellhole. She's not a(n official) Monster Hunter, she can't even see monsters anymore, and Bruce is conviced she exists only to give him a headache. Cass kind of likes her. Tim has a crush on her (they've never met).

Arthur still sucks tremendously but maybe. Marginally less than in canon.

Crystal has been clean for ~4 years. She's of course still a nurse.

Steph's working part time jobs, looking after allie and avoiding getting murdered by things she can't see. She also volunteers at Leslie's clinic occasionally. Her plan is to eventually study to become a nurse like her mom. She doesn't sleep much.

Cass has met allie, more on accident that on purpose; Bruce hasn't. This will be held over his head endlessly.

All of Allie's clothes are at least size to big because they buy them for her to grow into (but she's growing like a weed so they're never too too big for too long).

I'm also thinking about giving Arthur his ponytail back but then he just looks so silly with his lil curls.

Also! Because I think I haven't like. "Announced it" on Tumblr yet, the polls made Dick and Bruce Black Masks (alongside Cass, who I decided on) and Duke a White Mask (along ... or well, after Jason, since the kid's dead and buried. Along with his We Are Robin buddies, though). Babs and Tim are Azure Masks. Damian is training under Bruce (or Dick, if I decide to kill of Bruce, we'll see) and he'll probably become a Black Mask, too. Alfred was the easiest after Babs, he's a Scarlet Mask.

Other DC characters I know exist in this universe: Dinah Lance (aka Black Canary, a Black Mask) and the Kents (not affiliated with the Order but Lois is always one step behind Bruce). I've been thinking about making Clark, like, ... the orphaned son of decimated House the Order lost track off or something. I don't know yet. The other Birds of Prey probably exist, too.

Also, just to have them in one place, the three things I've drawn for this AU so far.

[roseworth]

Tim really is the easiest Robin to get rid of narratively and the sooner people realise this the better society will become

REAL. rip tim but it is so much more fun when you replace him !! people bend over backwards to put tim into aus when really you can just get rid of him <3 plus by not making him robin you’re actually decreasing his trauma bc most of the bad things that happen to him happen because he’s robin whereas if he’s not robin he just gets to live his normal ass life

[jupiters-galaxy]

I've seen some people criticize how quickly Peter and Steph fell for each other (to the point of being the thing they treasure most), and while I do understand some of the criticism, I think there are a few key things that some people aren't picking up on.

-Treasuring each other IS NOT strictly romantic. While it's true that Peter is in love with Steph, and Steph with Peter, it goes deeper than their repressed love story. They ARE friends. They do genuinely like spending time together, although their connection is relatively new. They care about each other as people first; neither of them seem like they NEED to be in a relationship with the other. They seek each other out even when they're just friends.

-It's also important to remember that the lords in black only want treasured things in the metaphorical sense: they can't give up OBJECTS. It presumably has to be a person or a concept.

-It's important to remember that both of them have been through an unbelieveable ordeal. Peter's closest friends were murdered. Stephanie lost her DAD, and although they weren't close, that can't have been easy to stomach. I cannot stress this enough; Peter and Steph quite literally have no one else left. Peter has no other friends. It logically tracks for him to be attached to Stephanie, as she is someone who experienced the same traumas as him. From Stephanie's angle, she doesn't really like her friends, and since objects are out of the question, Peter is the only person who she feels truly knows her. He's really the only option for her, even if her feelings are confusing.

-I also want to point out that you can really kind of feel them falling for each other, although it is admittedly subtext. Peter is weak to Steph as early as the opening number. He does out of character things to make her happy; a compliment from her makes his day amazing; he faces his biggest fear in hopes of seeing her at Pasqualli's. Stephanie cares for him from the first day they meet, although her care is a lot more ambiguous. She teases him about how he's into her, but at the same time, she's protective of him, feeling horrible that he got beat up and wanting to stop it. Even beyond that, she's inclusive towards him, inviting him to hang out with her simply because she likes his company. Her attraction to him makes sense: we know that Steph has a thing for funny and smart guys, and Peter's geeky snarkiness ABSOLUTELY fits. Their relationship is one that just makes a lot of sense!

-Their relationship is actually portrayed really realistically near the end. They're not intense about their love, nor are they overtly sexual. In NPMD, they don't even kiss! The furthest they go is dancing close together and having conversations, cautiously stepping into a new relationship that they mutually want. Despite the heavy nature of their confessions in As Cool As I Think I Am (Reprise), the payoff is not drastic. The confessions were likely only so heavy because they both thought Peter was about to die. Of course he would go out detailing how he loves her, and of course she would say it back; their last memories together should be good ones. When faced with normalcy, they progress as most teens would.

-At the end of the day, they're two traumatized teenagers who already liked each other before the trauma. It makes sense that they feel like the other is the most important to them; after all, Grace is the only other survivor from their group, and they're thinking about her in a less than favorable way past Richie's death, if not sooner than that.

This is not to say they're perfect, but I think their portrayal was really sweet and a joy to watch. I think the implications are extremely interesting idk!! I love Peter and Steph, I think they're more nuanced than they're getting credit for. I love to see cringefail nerds getting badass and amazing girlfriends, let me have this!!!!!

Anyways yeah that's my hot take. One of many. NPMD is consuming me someone help

[mattiebluebird]

Yk that post that's like ‘signal is the spiritual successor to nightwing’ bc I DO & IVE BEEN THINKING ABOUT IT NON-STOP.

And the comics pretty much confirm it (To Me) in Grayson #15.

So in this issue each of the Robins, minus Steph (RIP Steph) get paired off with one of the We Are Robin gang and give them their own advice on what it means to be Robin.

Tim—whose main problem with this whole thing is that they don't know these kids, how can they trust them?—gets paired with Andre Cipriani, a mob kid whose dad was murdered by a rival gang when he was eight years old. Tim trains Dre by having him fight blindfolded. He tells Dre that being a Robin is about truth and investigation, which makes sense, right? Tim became a Robin by figuring out Batman and Robin’s secret identity (keep this in mind, all the Robins’ advice links to their origin).

To be a Robin, you have to understand what you don't know. And then you must seek to know it. You must always ask: how can I see into the dark? Batman once told me, being a Robin can be summarized into one word: investigation.

These two were an interesting choice to pair up. I would've thought they'd put Dre with Jason, given their violent tendencies—Dre is smart, but at this point in the comics doesn't strike me as particularly investigative. Then again, right after this arc he goes undercover in a gang, so maybe he learned something?

Speaking of learning something: at first I thought they should've paired Dre with Steph (#teamcriminaldads lmao), and while that would be an interesting team, Dre did learn from Tim. If Riko were present in this issue, she would've been a good fit for Steph, as she idolizes the Batgirls and Steph was both a Batgirl and a Robin. Plus, Steph and Riko are both brave & have mean streaks, something that Riko has trouble showing because of her shyness. Steph’s advice probably would've been along the lines of “being a Robin is about defiance”.

Besides, if Tim and Dre weren't paired up, we never would've gotten this interaction.

— You like Liszt.

— What?

— Franz Liszt. The composer. You play the piano. I looked you up. People who play the piano like Liszt.

Points to Tim for the most autistic small talk ever. ‘You like this, which I know because I researched you in a totally non-creepy way.’ Amazing. 10/10.

Dax gets paired with Jason. They're interesting parallels. Dax is the inventor/mechanic of the team, but also sort of the wild card with very strong morals, like Robin!Jason in a way. Like Jason, Dax’s father is (implied to be) a crook, though they took different moral directions because of that—Dax is completely opposed to gun violence.

Anyways, Jason's main reservation is that you can't have Robin without Batman. And I guess he decided to solve this issue by just becoming Batman & making the WAR crew relive his origin story by stealing tires from the mob.

Y'know, kid, Batman once told me, being a Robin comes down to one word: confidence.

Jason Todd, the Crime Alley street kid who had the balls (and the skills) to steal Batman's tires and get away with it. Sort of. Confidence, indeed.

Damian's problem with the Robins is, of course, that they're weak, and strength (according to him) can't be trained; you either got it or you don't. He gets paired with Izzy, who probably has the toughest home life of the WAR crew. Her brother's in a gang (that he regularly beats her up for not joining), and she's failing all her classes because she's too busy working night shifts at her mom's restaurant to sleep or do homework.

So Damian's advice to her is pretty apt:

Batman told me that there is one word that captures the essence of being Robin. Suffering.

Damian and Izzy are both outwardly surly, stubborn characters who have had to fight to survive. Notably, Izzy is the first of the crew to almost resort to killing/guns (in WAR #6). She's also probably the best fighter in the WAR crew after Dre and Riko. She does dancing, gymnastics, judo, and kick-boxing.

And, finally, we reach the point of this whole post: Dick & Duke.

Duke deduces Dick's secret identity in like .5 seconds.

— I've solved a lot of hard in my time. This ain't hard.

— No. No, it wasn't hard. Not for you. Again, Duke Thomas?

Dick: You discovered my secret identity!

Duke: What? Like its hard?

After scoping out their strengths and weaknesses, Dick sends the Robins on individual assignments: Dre and Tim to investigate, Dax and Jason to cause a distraction, Izzy and Damian to apprehend Robo-Batman/Gordon.

Dick brings Duke on to a roof for a stake-out, where they have this exchange.

— You think only the originals understand how to be Robin?

— Nope.

— Yeah. Me neither.

Then it turns out that Dick actually turned them all in to the cops because he wanted them out of harm's way. He's been watching Duke for a while and he knows he's scared of heights, so he led him onto a roof he knew he couldn't get off of. Just before they part ways, Dick imparts his Crucial Robin Advice:

Batman once wais to me that being a Robin is about one thing. Family.

(I find this whole thing super ironic considering Dick's whole aside concerning the Robins was the fact that it doesn't matter if people know you're manipulating them as long as it works.)

The point of Robin? Family. Dick and Duke are alike in this way. Dick only became Robin to get justice for his parents’ murder. Duke only joined WAR to find his parents.

Their origins and motivations are similar, and so are the characters themselves. Dick is often called the world's second-greatest detective next to Batman himself. Duke is a child prodigy—one of our first introductions to his character is when he tried to solve the Riddler's riddles in Zero Year. He loves puzzles. He's an amazing detective.

And, of course, one of the things we know and love about Nightwing is his inherent kindness, something that's present throughout Duke’s entire character arc. Even their hero names, Signal and Nightwing, are parallels of each other (light and dark). Batman’s first sidekick and his last. And, like Nightwing, Signal formed his own team (WAR) with no help from the others (except Alfred ig).

Of course, the entire point of Signal’s character is that he's not just a Robin. He's something different. It reminds me of that post that's like—’poor dick grayson, originator of a legacy he never meant to be a legacy, crushed with guilt and jealousy when he looks at all those who came after’. To me at least, it makes sense that Nightwing’s successor would've never been a Robin at all.

[random-jot]

Ok so there’s 5 Black Altar’s in Hatchetfield…

There’s also 5 Lords In Black…

Could the Lords In Black each have a stronger link to one of these places above the others?

Three of them are easy to place based on the stories they appear in:

Pokey — The Starlight Theatre

Wiggly — The Lakeside Mall

Tinky — CCRP Technical

That leaves us Nibbly and Blinky as the remaining Lords In Black and Hatchetfield High and The Waylon House as the remaining Black Altars - These two are harder to place since neither one are directly involved in NPMD or interact with those locations

It’d be tempting to say the Watcher World theme park was Blinky’s, except we know now that’s not one of the Altars — for my money Hatchetfield High makes the most sense; we all know high school is a cesspit of misery and pain, sadistic Blinky would love to watch all of that

That leaves Nibbly as The Waylon house… which, to be honest I can’t think of a concrete connection beyond process of elimination, but I also can’t really think of a connection between Nibbly and Hatchetfield High other than like. The school cafeteria. Lot of consumption going on there I guess? Idk Blinky for the high school just makes more sense to me

So:

Blinky - Hatchetfield High

Nibbly — The Waylon House

Although, I just thought of the other way: the nerds & Steph set up the house so record their prank on Max: to view his suffering… which now I think of it does sound very very much Blinky’s wheelhouse. In which case, Nibbly for the high school… ehhhhh, I still got nothing except the school cafeteria.

Either way, this is fun to think about!

[violet-catsarelife]

red hood Tim aus get me so bad bc in why on earth does this privileged dead guy care about crime alley? what weight does it hold to him???? it only makes sense to have steph be the second robin realistically.

It kinda feels like I'm inviting discourse by replying to this, so lemme just do an obligatory disclaimer: people are free to create what they want, and they're allowed to have different tastes and interpretations. That's what fandom is. Okay? Okay.

That said.

Personally? Red Hood Tim is... yeah. Does not spark joy. Aside from the Rich Boy in Crime Alley aspect, I guess I'm just not a fan of people making up trauma for Tim so he can be the Saddest Boy, especially when they're taking traits from Jason (which, actually this might be a gripe that spilled over from other fic tropes and not something I have against rr aus, specifically.)

In my opinion, reverse robins is a great setup for us to explore not only the differences but also parallels between the Robins. In that sense, Steph, with her background similarities to Jason, has so much more potential for a Red Hood story.

I wanna know how her morals would play out, how they'd differ from Batgirl!Steph's or RH!Jason's. What are her views on criminals and crime? Does RH!Steph hold the same contempt against her dad like Spoiler!Steph did? What ties her to the city and its community? I wanna see what her dynamic with Batman is like, when she isn't pushed into the shadow of another 'failed' robin, but is instead the First Robin Who Died. How would the effects of her death differ from Jason's, given that she's neither an orphan nor adopted by Bruce? I'm also curious about her relationship with Damian, if it mirrors the mentor-sibling style Batgirl!Steph had with baby Dami. Do they bond over being the few people who knew Batdad before the Tragedy, as opposed to canon where they only ever got to know the post-robindeath version?

So much story potential!

In short, Red Hood Steph is an awesome concept and I wish there are more fics with her. Thanks for coming to my ted talk I guess

[nerdy-prude]

‼️SPOILERS FOR HATCHETFIELD LORE AHEAD ‼️

Let me introduce you to what I like to call The Lords in Black theory

Notice how in NPMD during The Summoning each of our remaining main characters are told something by a lord in black.

Blinky says: 'We've been watching you, Gracie. Someones been a naughty girl'

Tinky says: 'Oh boy! A Spankoffski! I'm gonna have the whole set in my toy box!'

Nibbly says: 'Stephanie, yum yum!'

Now, as we already know, Hannah is kinda like 'The chosen one' of the Hatchetfield universe. She plays a major part in BF, from the very begining she hates Wiggly. Wiggly on the other hand, is kinda like the leader of his brothers.

In Yellowjacket Hannah is fighting Pokey but she can't defeat her until Lex, a powerfull, MAJOR CHARACTER and her own sister shows up.

It seems as if all of the brothers are somehow connected to one of these major characters. All of these characters are important parts of the story and have shown to be powerful in some way. With Lex and Hannah their power is more clear since they have the gift, but think about it, we don't really know that many people who have had the Black book, even less good people who have had it.

But there is one very much good character who has had and used the Black book. Miss Holloway, everyones favorite witch lady who in every universe fights Wilbur Cross, the guy who has been described as the ultimate bad.

Now some of you might be thinking: "Okay, well that doesn't yet prove anything. There should be bigger evidence if they were actually connected. Their stories should be tied together" Well, funny you should say that! Lets take a deeper dive, shall we?

Wiggly-Hannah

Both are the 'leaders'with the most power. Hannah and Wiggly says to her: "We just keep running into each other, don't we Hannah"

Pokey-Lex

In Yellowjackect it was made very clear that Otho was incredibly powerfull and no one could defeat him. Lex did just that. Also, I am not trying to say any of the brothers are more powerfull than others (well, maybe expect Wiggly) but the thing is, we know that there is a world where Pokey wins. We know his powers. We also know Lex' powers. It would make sense that out off all of them Lex would be connected to her.

Tinky-Peter

Tinky hates Ted with a burning passion, that is why he trapped him. It makes sense that he would be after his brother too. Also kinda unrelated and doesn't prove much but it would be funny that when Peter says: "I have been waiting for what feels like five ducking years and I still haven't gotten my hot chocolate" would have more meaning than just a funny bit. Almost as if he could feel that in another universe five years agohe ordered a hot chocolate and never got it. Like he could sense TIME and SPACE differently?

Nibbly-Stephanie

Whose dad has had the Black book? Oh right, Stephs! And what did mayor Solomon Lauter say abou the black book again? Wasn't it something like: " ...It comes with a price, a terrible price" and "No! I am not touching that book ever again"?

And who has a major part in organaizing the Honey Queen festival? That's right, the mayor! Who has shown multiple rimes they will do anything to keep getting elected? Who has shown to be interested in power? Who has shown to be 'Hungry'?

What if he cast a spell and Nibbly wanted her daughter as a sacrafice? What if he then gave something else. Something that made him bury the book. It might have worked for a while. But Stephanies fate was already sealed. Nibbly still wanted to have Steph tho, he tought she'd be yummy.

Blinky-Grace

Ahh, Grace, Grace, Grace...

I have to admit, she was more of a mystery to me but lets SEE what we can FIND. (Laughs in Jigglypuff)

Grace is the perfect Christian girl. She never does anything wrong! But then she just snaps? She very quickly comes up with a plan on how to hide a body. Then at the end she goes after 'the souls of the pervs'. But to everyone around her she still looks like an innocent young girl. Makes you wonder what else she has hidden. Makes you wonder about the other alternative universes. Maybe Blinky was referring to many different Grace Chasities. He ment the many different things Grace has done bc of her faith and hidden from anyone elses eyes. Only problem for her is that you can't hide anthing from Blinky.

[rubydubydoo122]

What are your opinions on reverse robin aus? For me I think the potential they have isn't usually explored fully. One question I keep asking is why red hood tim? Joker junior is literally right there if you want to give him joker related trauma antagonist origin story. Also why does Tim have to be the antagonist? If you're really trying to go in reverse would- shoot would it be Duke? (I can't remember the order rn my brain is fried).

I feel like there's so much potential in characters and how they would change based on their order but many people just want to give one robin a different Robin's trauma. Or something along those lines.

EXA- FUCKING-Ly WhAt I'M SaYINg.

Most Reverse Robins AUs completely ignore Duke, Steph, and Cass, AND BABS.

I know Duke, Cass and Babs aren't Robins, but they're important to the other characters. They exist.

Also, If I See the "Tim Drake is Red Hood" Tag One More Time I'm Gonna--

It just doesn't make sense. Tim Wouldn't Become the Red Hood. Tim wouldn't even Die in a RR AU. IF you Reverse the Order It would Still Be Damian, Steph, And Jason dyingnngngggggg.

Pleaseeeee. Saveeeee meeeeee. Savvvveeeee meeeee frroooom the REVERSE ROBINS AUUUUUUUU

[cuephrase]

Of the DC comics you've read so far, what would be your top recommendations for people to check out/what have you enjoyed the most?

when i tell you i have been thinking about this all day- i have been thinking about this. all. day.

so disclaimer, as of writing this, i have only read 31 runs from start to finish and 18 arcs/events outside of those runs. on top of, everything i've read so far has been strictly robin-centric, so dick, jason, tim, and damian. (i have read all of steph's robin appearances lol, but i haven't gotten to reading material for her, like say batgirl 2009, yet.) i've also decided not to rec from any run i'm currently reading, so for example, you won't see any batman: gotham knights recs here. because i'm most well-read on the robins, i'm only going to rec for them.

also, i'm going to operate under the following assumption: you've got a basic knowledge of the robins. none of these are where i would necessarily recommend anyone start reading about the boys, but i do think they'd be pretty interesting if you're already somewhat familiar with them and don't want to commit to reading whole character backlogs. does that make sense? i hope that makes sense.

alright, let's do this!

DICK GRAYSON

oh god. this one is actually so hard because he has so much great stuff, but then also i have like a love/frustrate relationship with so much of it. like for instance, i really enjoyed The New Teen Titans, but also lowkey can't stand space adventures so whenever that went down i was like 😀👍. but okay. hmmmm.

i have two preboot recs, with explanations + caveats.

devin grayson's mob!dick arc, so Nightwing 1996 #99-100, 107-117. caveats: it doesn't really get to finish playing out/wraps up weird because of editorial changes/infinite crisis. but!! it's a super interesting look at how dick handles...failure. how he values himself in light of that failure.

tomasi's run, but specifically #147-153. (listen, i love the dick and tim moments in 'freefall' but the whole eternally pregnant lady thing was too weird.) this is classic, hyper-competent dick, okay? he's such a bad-ass. and an idiot- bro literally flops his severely injured ass over the bars of his glider and rides it UNCONSCIOUS back to the batcave. i can't with him. poor alfred. anyways, he deals with two-face, always a good time. and then at the end, as a treat, he cries because bruce is dead. so fun!! what was my caveat here? oh yeah, he has a girlfriend. i don't remember her name, she serves like...very little purpose, the whole relationship is very minor/background okay, but like it was so unnecessary. he can be single, dc, it's okay.

for post re-boot, just read tom taylor's run!! it's the best thing ever!! zero complaints!!

HA. yeah, just kidding. that run is very like/frustrate for me lol. oh man i'm struggling here. it's not all bad okay, i'm just really picky, and i haven't re-read any nightwing n52 and onwards since my first foray into comics (8 months ago) so my memories of these are the foggiest and i'm not sure how i feel about all of it in light of what i've read now. yk what, i'm just going to...not rec anything. sorry!!

JASON TODD

his comics either go so hard or they're absolute ass, why is there no in between. istg, i can't figure out why writers struggle with him so much?? well. i mean, i do have theories. but you didn't ask for those!

pre-boot:

detective comics #569-574. robin!jason in the hands of writers who like him is so much fun. which, don't get me wrong, i don't flat-out hate how starlin writes him, but i think you get a more well-rounded view of jason as robin when you also see him in 'tec. jason and bruce tangle with the joker, scarecrow, + mad hatter, and all of those adventures are...idk if they were intentional foreshadowing okay, but reading those and knowing where the story goes? oof. especialllllly #574. caveat: #572 is pretty light on jason, but he is great when he's on panel!

reboot:

probably a very basic answer but rhato rebirth (2016) #1-13, annual #1. i abhorred n52 rhato so i almost skipped rhato rebirth since it was still written by lobdell, but i'm really glad i didn't. i really enjoy jason's relationship with bizarro + artemis, but especially with bizarro because i think jason struggles a lot with feeling like a doomed creation, so yk, parallels. i want to say more but i know i'll get too wrapped up in discussing jason so i'm just going to stop myself.

i actually really enjoyed task force z, too. i think about tfz #8 so much, jason is such a manipulative little shit and i love it. he's so- i can't. i can't get into this rn, it deserves its own post(s).

overall for jay, i need people to read something other than utrh/lost days/b:ul 1-6. i love those, i do, but they aren't the only good pieces of jason content!!

TIM DRAKE

MY BELOVED!!!!!!!!!! in my heart of hearts, i just want to rec his whole robin run lmao. dick was my intro, okay, he is why i decided to start reading comics, but tim, specifically his robin solo is why i'm still reading comics. hooked me fr. and young justice 1998, ugh love. but it has been a minute since i read these as well, so hmm. okay okay okay

pre-boot:

batman: prodigal. short version, tim is robin to dick's batman. super fun. there's a solid amount of dick and bruce angsting too, which, love. tim is honestly just thrilled that jpv is out of the batsuit and even happier to working with dick. very cute.

robin #46. listen. they're all superheroes okay, they all feel pressure to save people. but tim...losses get to him. the amount of times that he gets shoved to a breaking point and then...gets back up. keeps going. *screams*. anyways!! this is not tim getting back up, okay? this is him being shoved way, way down. it's so good.

teen titans 2003 #20. tim's dad has died. he shows up for his weekend at the tower anyways. he is not okay. that's it, that's the pitch. i did not like...mmm at least 80% of this run okay, but a few of the issues HIT and this was one imo.

reboot:

*deep sigh*. look. tim is not tim for like basically all of n52, although there are moments here and there were he feels like himself. i did not like his 2023 solo, the best parts of young justice 2019 imo are the character designs, (except for his drake costume, what was that omg), and i haven't read any rebirth batman/'tec yet. except for zdarsky's run. which. tim is good there! but yeah, not really a whole lot of material to work with + very limited reading experience atm.

DAMIAN WAYNE

god, i love this kid. nature vs. nurture fascinates me, and so much of his story digs into that on top of trying to figure out who he is apart from all of that. i will say, i'm not a huge talia fan and by that i mean, i have no idea who she is "supposed" to be, like i have no frame of reference for that atm, so if you are a huge talia fan these recs might not hit for you because from what i've observed from her fans she is not well portrayed a whole lot since becoming his mother? i think one of the things that is normal is dick absolutely disliking her though, which cracks me up. there's this older batman story (batman #322-335) where bruce works with talia and dick goes running to selina and i was so entertained. what were we talking about? oh! damian!

preboot:

batman and robin 2009 #10-12. damian is struggling, with a lot of things. the fact that bruce might be alive, what that means for him and dick, and his mother's puppeteering. there's this line that kills me: "can't you just love me for who i am? not what you want me to be?" and the thing that gets me, is the use of who vs. what. because he could have said, "not who you want me to be", but he doesn't

reboot:

batman: shadow war. this is post-alfred's death, and honestly, most damian stuff post city of bane is pretty juicy, but there's this specific moment in shadow war: alpha #1 that had me speechless. just like 😧 i love bruce, but that man has some of the most chronic foot-in-mouth disease. oh but fair warning, for whatever reason they don't draw dami's mask connecting?? it's so- it drives me nuts.

JUST FOR FUN

these are just two issues that i enjoy for the brother content!

nightwing 1996 #25. dick and tim's relationship makes me ILL. *ahem*. this issue is mostly just super cute and fun, (there's like 0.2 seconds of angst when tim asks dick if he ever thinks about jason 😭) and i adore it sm. fun fact, it's actually one of the first comics i ever bought!

batman 2016 #16. unfortunately, tim is not here for this, but duke is! jason and damian's interactions in the background of bruce's Very Serious Speech are excellent. bruce is so dramatic and his kids are so unserious.

what i've most enjoyed

i've enjoyed the majority of what i've read, even titles/events i wasn't particularly looking forward to but had on my tbr for whichever character. i'm going to break down most enjoyed into two catergories, arcs that i loved top to bottom and then the guilty pleasures. this is not an exhaustive list, just what immediately came to mind.

top to bottom

bruce wayne: murderer?/fugitive. shocker, ik. but it's just, it's just so frickin good. i've said before, and i'll say it again, gotham war could NEVER. this right here is peak batfamily drama. the tension? the mystery? the angst? i knew nothing going into this okay, and truth be told, when i started it i was like "oh joy. another event." because i was just trying to read the 1996 nightwing run, but i'd committed to reading in full all the events it crossed over with. but i was invested so quickly. and like, i loved how the narrative supported the possibility that bruce was the murderer, because like, you know there's no way, but the more that comes out the more damning it is, and so you're like really dying to know what actually happened and i feel like the reveal was satisfying.

batman: city of bane. i'm going to cautiously put this here, because there might have been something i didn't like but i cannot recall it for the life of me right now. something about me is i love when the heroes lose. infinity war, empire strikes back? love. and ik bruce takes back gotham, but they lose alfred, okay, they lost. i also didn't expect to like this arc, i decided to read it because i wanted to know how alfred died. and first of all, i was shocked, even though i knew it was coming because i expected it to like happen towards the end. but nope. just *snap*. and then later when bruce is back in the manor and is confronted with alfred's body and his good-bye message? oh. my. god. i was bawling. despite my penchant for sad narratives, i don't tend to cry that much, but this got to me so bad. like i had to pause because i couldn't see. amazing.

red robin. his cowl is so ugly, but i really do love the run. i see a lot of discourse about it and also a lot of...interesting fanfic takes, so i don't really talk about it a lot here because it feels like most people are kind of tired of hearing about this run, which fair. i really enjoyed it as a sequel to his solo robin run. tbh, i almost put this in the guilty pleasure catergory, because there are a couple things i don't totally love, but like if the others are 10/10, this is 9/10.

young justice 1998. i love this comic so, so much. i don't even know what to say, i get so overwhelmed with joy when i think about this comic. nothing has hit the same way with this group since either, which is a crime. i need a title with this team so badly.

guilty pleasures

these are all runs/events i know some/most? people cannot stand and i totally get why, and i have problems with them, so i'm probably never going to rec them in good conscience but also like i can't lie and say i don't like them. these are not recs, okay? okay.

robin war. is it a hot mess? yes. but there is not a whole lot of canon content out there with all the boys working together, okay? so much of that event had me banging my head into a wall, but for me, there were a handful of pearls in there. i mean honestly, if i listed out pros and cons the cons list would be way longer but those pros are very precious to me.

batman and robin: eternal. very similar reasoning overall to robin war. plus cass finally came back!! i missed her. i love robin!dick and batman content, and the kids working together. this is probably my least favorite guilty pleasure though, okay, it's on thin ice.

grayson. listen, i love janin's art sm. i'm pretty neutral about spy stuff, so like i don't engage with it a whole lot. meaning, although i've heard it's tropey af in regards to the genre, i'm not familiar enough with the genre to be like trying to dig my eyeballs out with blunt spoons at the cliche of it all. the constant sexualization of dick got old super fast, and her name may have been helena but she wasn't- my list of dislikes is lengthy. but idk, i had fun with it. and imo it does have some genuinely great moments, i love dick in the desert with the baby, the ache i felt when dick wanted to come home and couldn't get ahold of bruce, issue #12 stabs me in the heart- the dick and dami reunion? stoppppp. i feel like this run and the ric grayson era are dick's most out there lmao

so yeah!! thank you so much for this ask, i had sm fun answering it. if you have any recs for me, feel free to drop them :)

[yourlocalabomination]

i need your opinion. jeff blim tinky or curt mega tinky

Oh this is such a good question!

While I do have aspects that I love about both portrayals my overall favourite is undoubtedly Jeff’s.

In Time Bastard we get to see Tinky be absolutely deranged when it comes to fucking around with Ted, and Jeff manages to protrude that sadistic energy entirely. The laugh alone solidifies that for me. Jeff has such a way with playing unhinged characters (Hidgens in Workin’ boys, Aladdin in Twisted, The father in Trail to Oregon, etc) that I don’t think there is a better Starkid actor to play Tinky.

While Grace, Steph and Pete are acted as being scared in The Summoning honestly wasn’t that scary? For me at least? Idk it was more silly (don’t get me wrong I love The Summoning scene it just didn’t have that scare factor- I mean Curts dancing around in neon yellow). And while I do like Tinky having a more silly goofy side to him I prefer the portrayal of that having a more sadistic streak, as seen in Time Bastard.

I know that in The Summoning the LIBs “hold court in your own tongue and form”, (aka appear as teenagers) makes sense story wise and for a on stage preformance. But I’m a big fan of horror, so even the description Tinky being a:

“A solidarity figure. It wears a baggy, furry body- suit. It’s yellow and matted. Dirty. Stinking. Worst of all is its head. A motionless, demented goat mask. It has glassy, evil eyes, a slack jaw with big crooked teeth, a flopping wet tongue”.

Fuck so hard to me. That shit slaps ok. Tinky being refered to a “The thing”, “This creature”, “The nightmare goat”, in the Time Bastard script? Give me more of that please.

(I know that this isn’t particularly pertaining to Jeff’s portrayal, more of the script writing, but they go hand in hand. The script is only as good as the actors can make it. And Jeff does that description of Tinky so much justice).

All that being said- when it comes to drawing Tinky I prefer to draw him as Curt (plus a few extra things added to put my own spin on the design) due to that being his first human form portrayal. Also because I can’t draw goats.

Despite all this, I need it to be known that “oh boy! A spankoffski! I’m going to have the whole set in my toy box!” has and will continue to rot in my brain for many more months to come.

[eggplantwaffles]

i think a big problem with modern batfam comics is that they have so many characters that kinda just overlap- here’s my ideas for how to give each of them their own “niche” to make them unique. Some of this is canon or alluded to is some way- but a lot is just what i think makes sense for each character.

Bruce Wayne

Bruce retires, it’s the only way to give all his kids / kid adjacents their own chance to shine. i’m sure he grumbles about it and watches from the bat cave obsessively, but i’m the end he’s learned to trust the batfam and lets them take care of things.

Dick Grayson

I actually really like where Dick is at in comics right now, i mean it’s not perfect- but I like the idea of Nightwing being a “better” version of Batman for Blüdhaven. He leads the Titans, which are now on par pedigree wise with the Justice League, and as Dick Grayson he is an active member of the community in Blüdhaven, trying to use all his resources to help people. So basically not much changes here.

Barbara Gordon

This one’s easy, just make her Oracle all the time- in the most bad dads way possible. Give me paralyzed Barbara Gordon who has eyes and ears all over the world and is the center of ALL super hero activity. She leads the Birds of Prey, she’s in the ears of all the bats, she’s IT for the Justice League- she does all of it.

Jason Todd

I liked Jason’s character best when he serves as an antagonist. Jason goes back to being a crime lord, and we bring back his ideals of trying to control the crime as opposed to trying to stop it. Jason has good intentions, but he lacks the idealism of the other bats who are constantly trying to save the city without compromising any morals. I think that Jason often butts heads with Tim and Cass (mostly Cass due to her very strict no killing rule) but is mostly left alone by Steph and Damian, who are more willing to accept his methods even if they don’t love them.

Tim Drake

Tim should travel the world “conspiracy hunting,” kind of like how he took down the League of Assassins, except he probably chills out on the blowing up bases all around the world that might (definitely) have people inside. Tim is supposed to be the best detective of the Robins, so lean into that- I want globe trotting - mentally unwell - detective stories where Tim fights big secret organizations or takes down corrupt governments. He is also still apart of Young Justice, though they are all a bit older and are a less official group, the core four are still close and work together- they help keep Tim grounded and remember that he doesn’t have to do everything alone.

Stephanie Brown

I think Stephanie kind of separates herself from the batfamily after her time as Batgirl. I don’t mean that she give up fighting crime, or even gives up wearing the bat symbol, I just mean that she becomes a mostly solo act. Steph becomes Gothams main hero, she does normal vigilante stuff, patrolling the streets, saving the city, detective work, the typical bat stuff. But she’s far more connected to the people of Gotham than Batman ever was, stopping and talking to kids, handing out blankets to the homeless, doing cool flips and batarang trick shots for civilians passing by. Eventually she is the hero most Gothamites associate with their city, and she represents the good parts of Gotham- giving the people hope that they aren’t doomed to be consumed by the city, but that they will be stronger because of it. I also think that things are kinda awkward between her and the bats (except for Dick, Damian, and Barbara) and she tries to keep her distance a bit, considering she was kinda treated like shit as Spoiler and i think Steph deserves to be bitter about that, for a little bit at least.

Cass

Cass becomes Batman, but she operates globally. She’s not like early-Bruce batman who stayed in Gotham, she’s more similar to later batman. She’s in the league, she goes on funky missions to space or other dimensions sometimes, she fights the world ending threats that someone with no powers really should have no business fighting. She also works frequently with Tim and they do some fun little espionage stuff. And while she does return to Gotham, she’s mostly content to leave the city to Steph now- except for all the times she gets into fights with Jason, it bothers her that Steph rarely messes with his operation.

Damian

I really love the idea of Damian getting more into the magical part of DC, I think he should absolutely end up with a Justice League Dark team and learn to do cool magic shit. He goes on a training montage quest like Bruce did, except he’s learning all about magic and demons and cool stuff like that. He has cool magic swords and is sort of the connection between the more grounded part of the universe and the magic parts. He also does a fair bit of globe trotting, looking for ancient mystical artifacts or magical worlds and stuff like that.

Duke Thomas

Duke also mostly stays in Gotham, he’s kinda doing his own thing as The Signal- he still operates during the daytime meaning he doesn’t cross paths with Steph or Jason too often on patrol. There’s not much to change here because Duke is already unique in that he 1- operates during the day and 2- is the only meta-bat, so I don’t need to make a niche for him, DC just needs to use him more.

Random Stuff

- Duke is starting college and takes night classes at Gotham U, Steph is also still in college and is graduating soon

- Tim is either Red Robin, or operating under a new name (I think the Vulture or Condor would be kinda cool but idk)

- The Batfam does not get along like a real family, they are dramatic bitches who fight all the time and have cannot all be in the same room

- Damian and Steph are super close, she was the first person to insist on treating him like a child, which he hated but now that he’s older is grateful for (but he’ll never admit it)

- Damian also sees Dick as his father figure, Bruce is just kinda also there

- Bruce, Alfred, Damian, and Cass all live at the manor- but Damian and Cass are rarely there as they travel a lot and got shit to do

- Barbara lives in the clock tower, she technically lives alone but usually one of Cass, Dick, Dinah, or Helena will be crashing there

- Steph lives alone in the same house she grew up in, her Mom has moved to California or something for a fresh start as she is finally sober, but at this point Steph doesn’t need her. It’s very sad as Steph never truly had a mother, but she’s happy that Crystal is getting another chance away from Gotham.

- Duke swears he’s seen Jason at night classes at Gotham U, but Jason won’t admit it

- The only ones Jason talks to semi-frequently are Dick and Tim, the relationships are super rocky though. Dick sees Jason as his brother first, and since he’s in Blüdhaven he tries not to concern himself with Jason’s business. Tim and Jason do fight a bit but Tim is more lenient than Cass so he can tolerate Jason’s shit if he feels like it’s for the best.

[the-arkhamwolf]

Current lay out for my random reverse robins Au

-Damian getting dropped off at Bruces's step and forcing Bruce to take him on as a sidekick; Wing (yeah that's the best I got)

-Bruce becomes a more lighthearted Batman for Damian's sake. After all the kid's been through.

-Wally and Damian meet and eventually become friends (They most likely will have a friendship similar to my Falling in Reverse AU)

-Bruce and Damian grow pretty close until a bad fight over the Joker, which causes Damian to move out

-One day he walking home he sees a woman being attacked. He saves her but ends up getting shot by the Joker (All this happens while he's a civilian)

-Bruce finds his son lying unconscious in the middle of the street bleeding heavily

-Damian wakes up in the hospital unable to move his legs

-Damian becomes bitter toward Bruce and the two have an even bigger falling out (he blames Bruce for not killing Joker)

-Bruce becomes a harsher Batman

-Tim appears on Bruce's doorstep with his Batman needs a Robin propaganda

-Tim comes in to stop Bruce and somehow gets pushed into taking Damian's mantel

-For a good while, he spends most of his time trying to get Bruce and Damian to talk to each other

-Damian treats Tim harshly believing he hates Tim for taking his place

-Damian really hates himself because he thinks he's broken and see what he could have been in Tim

-Tim eventually does break through to him and Damian comes back taking up an oracle-type role

-Damians starts to see Tim as a little brother and enjoys having him around

-Tim meets Stephine one night on patrol and through a series of events gets her to join the bats

-Tim works on a secret project called Titan that only Steph and Damian know about

-he plans to leave Gotham to work on Titan so He trains steph to take his place

-Angst coming up

-Tim gets shot in a scene similar to Batman Beyond; he goes to save a woman only for the woman to shoot him in the stomach. Tim gets away but he's bleeding heavily.

-Damian's on the comms trying to help him

-Everyone is to far away

-Tim stumbles through the street before sliding down against a pole

-Damian is on the comms the entire time helpless as his brother dies

-Steph and Bruce fight/She leaves

-Jason steals tires and Bruce adopts him because no one said he couldn't

-Jason trains

-Damian disapproves but comes around for Jason's sake not Bruce

-Steph hates Jason but they become friends later

-Ra's brings Tim back and Tim Scares the heck out of him then destroys his league (This is going to be a what the heck moment as it is revealed Tim was playing Ra's the whole time and I am so excited for it)

-Tim saves Cass from her father and then trains her

extra

-Tim has trouble sleeping due to nightmares. He also has the episode called freeze outs (Yeah I suck at names) where the pit takes over making him very cold and withdrawn (and dangerous to everyone)

-Barbra becomes Cassandra's little shadow and Cass has no idea how to deal with a child (Which just leads to a lot of adorable Cass moments)

-Tim's living room is always cluttered with projects he and Roy are working on

-Rose is like Casse's big sister

-Damian gets conned into taking Jason to the fair and ends up coming home with an extra kid

-another pairing Wally and Jinx not really a big part of the story but may be of use

-Dick is a little monster who will disappear every chance he gets

I know this makes no sense but I love it

.

.

So either Wally will be there for Daian when Tim dies or Damian will push him away for two years (around when Tim comes back) then the two will reconnect and Damian will be shocked because Wally has a kid.

Reason I want the second one

1- I love the angst of Damian feeling guilty as he relises his best friend has a Daughter and he never knew about it

2-I love the fluff of Damian getting to be like an uncle and interacting with a baby

but also I don't want Damian to push away everyone because that is a lot of angst since steph leaves for a while Idk

.

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Original Post

any thoughts? also what should I name this Au?

[mamawasatesttube]

Kon-El questions 3, 7 and 16

3. Least favorite canon thing about this character?

hmmm. how do i put this. it's like... the way karl kesel treated him as a self-insert for his own teenage fantasy self or whatever sometimes. obviously this comes out in the way he gets preyed on by adult women and this is played off as cool and chill, but it also comes out in the way a) kesel writes his flirting. sometimes it's very endearing and cringefail, and other times he's kissing women without consent, and that's played off as chill and fine because kesel thinks it should be and the women in question almost always are fine with that, but also b) he writes off concerns about indigenous hawaiians in kon's narrative (like silver sword or ...man i'm forgetting that kid who gets jealous of him and has powers about it for a minute, but that narrative). and like. yeah. white man in the 90s wrote this for SURE. i don't think it's like, written in the absolute poorest taste imaginable, because there's a lot of ways where it seems almost like they were trying to be respectful of native hawaiian culture, but then there's shit that's so far off the mark it's like. dude. and it's very evident that it just reflects karl kesel's own views much more than any character in-narrative.

7. What's something the fandom does when it comes to this character that you like?

lmaooo that's a toughie!!!! fanon kon at large is just. straight up not my boy. however there's a subset of fandom who leans into him being genderqueer/gnc/trans a lot more than canon ever has and i looove that. trans kon truthers lets go ♥

16. What's your least favorite ship for this character?

LORD. tim/ber/kon is the one that makes me roll my eyes hardest, alongside the rarer but no less irksome ber/kon. it's like... this is 100% not about kon as a character. this is about tim. ber/kon is almost funny in that it's entirely about tim but with tim himself cut out of the picture. but tim/ber/kon is just "let's take tim's most popular two fanon love interests and just shove all of them together!" and i have yet to see Anything even remotely try to convince me why kon and bernard should give a shit about each other. like, MAYBE you could sell it as a loooong slow burn, but i just. i don't see it man. putting the rest under a cut bc i AM gonna ramble about why i dislike it, so if you like tim/ber/kon or tim/ber and don't wanna see that, keep scrolling here👍!!

this is also partly bc i just... man i really wanted to like bernard and tim/ber but there's nothing there. i knew i didn't like rebirth tim characterization going in when i read tdr but i was hoping i'd at least find some crumbs. it's all just ... like there's no substance to it. there's no conflict, no character flaws, no "why do they even like each other???", no particular way they seem to help each other grow. it's just tropey "told, not shown" fluff where megfitz insists they are SO in love and perfect for each other, over and over, without backing that up really at all, and it just holds absolutely no appeal to me. and when it's just tim/ber i'm like yeah ok sure it's not my thing but whatever. but when people start trying to shove kon into there i'm like NO!!!!!! sdjkfhkd like im just SO unconvinced and it feels like such a great steaming heap of Nothing.

the main reason that is is that to me a relationship needs to have an arc. it can't just be stagnant. if there's no conflict, if there's no room for growth, if there's no development, it falls apart in my eyes. it doesn't feel like a real story about actual people. and as far as the tim/ber dynamic established in tdr, there's just. nothing. even the fact that bernard apparently somehow knows that tim is robin, which should be a HUGE source of conflict, is completely glossed over. it never comes up in any way.

like, we know that tim wants to tell people, but holds back out of a sense of duty. in robin '93, he agonizes about this with steph. but when bruce tells her his identity without his consent - which steph tells him bruce did immediately - he flips the fuck out!!!! he panics and runs away and he's furious with them both!!! so you'd ostensibly think that bernard knowing, and then not telling him he knows, would be sowing the seeds for an explosive conflict later down the line. especially because bernard now knows that tim is just. lying to him. all the time. shamelessly and blatantly lying through his teeth. and sure, it's for a good cause. right? but you'd think that in a relationship that's only just been established, just for a few months, that would also be offputting!! you'd think he'd start getting more and more unhappy that tim is just constantly lying to him and he knows it!! because he knows it about the robin secret, but what else might tim be lying to him about??? he knows now that tim has no qualms just lying to his face all the goddamn time, and he's... FINE with that???? there's this giant secret they're both dancing around and it's set up that there's just. N O T H I N G done with that. it drives me up the wall. i found this absolutely infuriating to read. both of them just being so one-dimensionally "oh we're in looooove so nothing else matters" that it erodes not only tim's specific characterization but bernard's ability to react like . idk. a human being? it just feels like running into dead end after dead end.

so yeah adding kon into that mix makes me want to tear my hair out bc it just feels SO surface-level. it's like... how much of him are you gonna shave off to fit him into this soulless, conflictless mold? it's like how i get annoyed when tim/kon fics ignore kon being genuinely really upset tim didn't share his identity with the team in yj98, but worse. because identity shit REALLY matters to kon. kon has never dated anyone who didn't know he was superboy. all of his civilian friends in sb11 know he's superboy. like, he does Not get close to people if he can't share that. it would be!!! a source!!! of conflict!!! but i've never seen Any ship content for tim/ber/kon that isn't just either completely declawed fluff that's just oh hehe tim has two boyfriends, or "kon angsting over tim dating someone else uwu" bullshit, which occasionally leads into completely declawed "tim has two boyfriends" fluff. it just does such a disservice to every character involved imo.

[zahri-melitor]

I think the oddest thing about my whole reading project is discovering as I go what I didn't know about storylines, about how many things are blown out of proportion and out of context, and about how, on average, stories are better and make more sense than people like to claim they are.

Because one of the interesting things when you read back catalogue is obviously that storylines are compressed. You see whole story arcs in just a day or two, rather than 6 months. You miss out on the speculation and elaboration as they are ongoing, but it also means you see situations resolve before you really have time to get worked up about them.

And that can have a really beneficial effect; you experience the story as it was plotted, rather than as it was first read. Weird gap moments are smoothed over rather than become niggling issues that you're waiting for pay off on. It gives proportion and perspective to events. And you can see structural goals a lot more clearly.

In any case, I am now up to 2017.

Recent thoughts on what I'm reading:-

Duke still does not have powers on page, and he's got a lot of character development; it's bizarre reading this when almost nothing going on here is known by the fandom, and the one thing the fandom DOES know is not yet canonical.

Steph and Harper have a better (and more interesting) relationship at this point on paper than Steph and Cass do.

Steph really does feel like Tynion picked up her character and tried to fix some of the issues that had her left on the shelf.

People hugely flatten how complex Kate Kane's background and canon as Batwoman is.

It's really interesting lining up Bruce's reaction to Tim's 'death' against Jason's and Damian's. Part of it is of course the contextual difference (in that Tynion knows Tim is alive and he'll be coming back) but Bruce feels a lot closer to the acceptance he reached after Jason, rather than the rage after Damian's. And there are definitely elements of how it is written that are specific reactions to the fandom's responses to Jason, Steph and Damian's deaths. It's interesting. Bruce doesn't appear quite ready to let go and get completely messy over this, and I wonder how much of it is a broader support network, and I wonder how much it is he doesn't trust himself if he gets messy without Tim there. (He's grieving! But on the scale of Bruce grieving so far it is incredibly tame and controlled and emotionally healthy)

I can't express how relieving it is to see situations recanonised and old dynamics put back into place unless you've worked through stories where they are just missing. A mid run that's reasonably on target is a fun thing to read, actually.

[frost-sama-senpai-san]

Hi! I'd like to break down this Batfam piece by David Talaski!

1. Dick vs Jay: Jason is OBVIOUSLY trying to copy Dick just to prove he can, but the attention to detail in the positioning of their bodies is so incredible.

Dick's toes are pointed, creating a straight line down his leg and a very graceful angle all the way down to his hip. He's mirroring this with an open arm, posture relaxed and very comfortable. This is the body of an acrobat. He is doing it, and he makes it look easy, just like Nightwing should.

Jason? Homie is STIFF. He's doing it, ofc, through sheer strength and force of will, but nothing about his body is relaxed. His foot (🐶) is flexed, and arm is actively fighting gravity. CAN he fly through the air ala Dick Grayson? Teeth and butthole clenched, maybe, but my man is a brawler through and through. Red Hood doesn't CARE about how he looks. He gets the job fucking DONE.

Another small detail, Dick's shoulders are bigger, which makes sense since my guy is swinging all around everywhere. On the flip, Jay's thighs are bigger. Again — makes sense, my guy is taking the stairs.

(Jay is wearing a shirt mayhaps bc of his autopsy scars?? Whoooo knows! Dick is shirtless because he's very aware he's Hot Shit????? Also could be who knows)

2. Tim and Steph: This one is so funny to me bc Tim is, obviously, very strong, but he's the smart one. He tricks baddies into hurting THEMSELVES. He's got the musculature to get the job done, but he's not a Brick Shit House like Jay or Bruce. I don't doubt he is fully capable of supporting Steph's weight, but look at his FACE — he is locked the Fuck in. Steph? She's spinning like a ballerina. Again, this is SUCH a good detail that reflects their characterrrrs.

Spoiler? She gets her shit done with a smile on her face. She fights against difficult, impossible odds again and AGAIN, and the WHOLE time, she's cracking jokes, keeping it light. Never letting them see her sweat.

Robin (Red and Drake), does not give a shit!!! About how he comes off!! My guys focuses in and gets the job done!! I'm obsessed with this!!

3. Damian: His ass is not listening!!! I actually really like the choice to put him in a pose all by himself. I don't really remember when this image was created, but we know early in Damian's story, he was unwilling to change himself to better mesh with the ideals of his new family. His whole life has been 100% about him, himself, his development, and his future as the demon's head, and the fated heir to Batman. He has his back to all of them, even if he IS paying attention (the look on his face HAS to be annoyance idc), he isn't going to let them KNOW that. His focus is on his form and his training. Homie has NOT learned how to have fun yet and that's okkkk king your family loves you

Anyways the image fux and David Talaski does not miss ty

[musicfeedsmysoul12]

where's the rant ???

Alright so rant time: people constantly argue that making a character a transwoman is the same as making them a ciswoman and frankly that’s wrong. I’m sorry but it is. As a small disclaimer: I’m nonbinary and I am in school getting a sociology degree. I will be using sex to refer to biology and gender to refer to otherwise.

Using Tim Drake as an example: the stories you tell with a transgirl or a cisgirl version are incredibly different from each other. Because men and women are socialized drastically different from one another. While the character of Tim Drake (fierce, loyal, hard working, generous, and wanting to do so much good) wouldn’t change so much else about Tim would in either option.

With a transgirl Tim Drake, you have how society would react to her and coming out. I’d also argue that she wouldn’t come out until her teen years because of Jack. No one can tell me that this man would be okay with his kid being a transgirl. You just can’t tell me that. Janet is a toss up because of the limited information we have on her as a character. She however did neglect her kid, and in general I think that as new or old money, whichever you want to use, she would have problems with image, considering that a trans child could go bad for the PR. But even ignoring the parents, a transgirl!Tim would have a totally different story. I expect her story woudl go much like canon for a while until she is able to articulate that she is a girl. Then I expect backlash from people, one of them being Stephanie.

I’m probably in the minority when it comes to my thoughts that Steph is a straight woman who would react to her partner coming out as a woman badly because ‘what does that say about ME?!’ I won’t go into my issues with Steph. Others have done it way better but I do think that she and Tim both messed up their relationship even if frankly most of the blame is on Steph’s feet. BUT ANYWAYS: Tim coming out would cause issues there. A harsh reaction is never great for a baby trans kid and I can see Tim retreating as Steph goes off to complain to someone like Babs. Who I then think would be upset with Steph for outing Tim. Baba then acts as a pillar for Tim who slowly can come out on her own terms. Bruce and Dick I don’t think would have an issue and Jason? Let’s be real: Jason wouldn’t give a fuck in the sense it’s “okay wait, girl? Okay… I’ll still beat the shit out of you”.

The media would pitch a fit and I think that YJ would become closer over this, but I also think that there will be backlash from other members of the cape community. There just isn’t a way there wouldn’t be because while sure a lot are accepting you can’t tell me everyone is. Also the rouges. Unless Bruce asks Tim to pretend to be a guy still which… OUCH. I feel that is on brand and also something Tim would struggle so much with but want to obey while everyone is yelling at Bruce.

Then a transitioning Tim when her father wakes up probably wouldn’t go back to him because I doubt his reaction is a good one, and so she stays with Bruce. Probably becoming adopted. She and Cass would bond and I can see Tim developing further and becoming more confident as time goes on. She is less confident as Robin as she is not allowed to be herself.

The Damian and I’m torn. On one hand: I kind of like the idea that the League are all assholes but they also are chill with queer people cause Ra’s is creepy with canon Tim. In the other this is something he can attack Tim over and I doubt he’d give up the chance the little psycho.

So… Damian would be a thorn but I think that Dick steps in way more here because ‘baby assassin trying to kill Tim since he doesn’t know better’ is very different then ‘a transphobic kid being a shit to Tim’. Sad but true.

Tim’s story drastically changes by being a transgirl and it’s one that is VASTLY different then being a ciswoman because Tim still was socialized as a boy from birth. There is still a level of privilege she got from birth that a ciswoman doesn’t. People would react to her being trans in multiple ways such as denial or disgust.

But a cisgirl!Tim? Well…

People expect different things from the sexes. Women are supposed to be soft, gentle, not to loud and are supposed to be kind. Boys get to be demanding and loud and smart and rough.

Tim as a girl would have Jack and Janet reacting differently. It’s a personal headcanon for me that Jack imposes a lot of his traits onto Tim as a boy because ‘it’s my son and he is thus like me’. A girl though he’d expect to be a ‘cute and soft girl who is there for me to pull out of the closest’ because frankly the guy who willing marries someone not even a decade older then his kid who uses to be his physical therapist is a LOSER who would. Janet is again a toss up but I feel she’d have more of an impact for this Tim as being a woman in buisness or archeology is a field she had to climb and claw her way through. Things she would then pass on to her daughter.

Women are expected to be feminine and gentle. I’m actually fond of a girly fem!Tim compared to others, but I think it’s more of a punk girly then not. Janet totally would have weaponized her femininity in a way Tim tries to mimic. Dresses, soft smiles, doe eyes but a sharp mind about to rip you apart. Her interests in photography would be dismissed as ‘artsy girl’ and she’d be put into ballet or gymnastics with some comments over martial arts.

Women will have people talk about them if they do anything out of the ordinary. They aren’t supposed to ride skateboards or things because that’s what boys are expected to do. They aren’t supposed to like climbing things or other shit.

Tim as someone born a girl, and as either new money or old money, would be expected to have certain traits a boy is allowed to not have. So without a doubt she had etiquette lessons and dance lessons and anything else her mother might have decided were useful because Jack wouldn’t have noticed anything. Even if it’s cause Janet got mocked by people for not knowing I can’t see Tim not having these lessons.

Tim who has a great mask and who keeps her lives seperate this would have her high society mask, her vigilante mask, her public self and her real self because girls are still expected to act a certain way in public. Any interest that deviates form what society expects is brushed off as ‘she’s trying to be unique’ or ‘tomboy’ or ‘fitting in with the boys’.

We finally get to Robin now because Tim is still Tim and I don’t doubt she would do the same thing, fight to become Robin, but with this comes it’s own problems. Threats of sexual assault, comments about being a girl, crude comments about opening her legs or how she fights: all of these would follow her. We can go: some rouges are nice all we want but not all of them are.

Then we have Stephanie and that relationship is already drastically changed because Stephanie again is straight, and I think that Tim would be able to connect to Steph much better as a girl. I still think it wouldn’t be the healthiest of friendships because of everything but I also think that Tim being a girl while having hard lines is very different from a boy with boundaries because Steph knows as a girl what it’s like to have boundaries. She would feel bad for breaking them compared to ‘Tim is upset I found out his identity boohoo why is he upset with me?’.

We have Dick to and I’m going to be real honest: I think Dick is sexist enough to make assumptions of Tim. He doesn’t have issues with women but in general he’s a bit of a douche bag (sleeping with Babs while inviting her to his wedding with Kori anyone?) that he would put some expectations on this Tim related to being a girl. Of course Tim tosses those out of the water and I think he’d adapt but still: Dick is just… I think he’s the guy who puts a lot of stock into blood relations more then we know (ala Damian) and that he’s got a few assumptions about the Robin title along with thoughts on girls.

Bruce is… I think his expectations would be similar to canon with an emphasis on her being a girl. He knows competent women but in his world most of the female heroes are super powered or criminals, with Barbara being a shining example of a non-powered hero who got hurt. He’s going to compare it. I think it would either be worse then canon or he’s going to shove her off on female heroes more because he isn’t sure how to handle her.

Barbara as well I think is closer then canon to Tim being a girl and sort of the Batfam early compared to Stephanie. I actually think Babs would be a lot more posessive of Tim because of this, but this miiiight just be me. I know Tim and Cass would be incredibly close as well much like canon.

Jason and Damian though? Okay so I’ll be blunt: Jason is the kind of guy who is a feminist and supports woman’s rights but has a few issues with women he’s never been able to articulate. Society would press on him women are supposed to be fantastic mothers who put their families first and then he gets Sheila and Catherine. And while Catherine may have loved him society says she’s a terrible mother. Then we have Talia and no matter what the ‘sleeping together’ thing is fucked up. It just IS. So Jason has issues. However I think said issues being thrown into his face would make him stop short. Yet his reaction to a girl taking the mantle is one that would be… tricky as hell.

Damian? Damian is sexist and could go one of four ways: a) canon, b) WORSE then canon, c) dismissive and arrogant assuming she is just there to be trained and would be shoved out of the role as soon as he’s there no need to fight which turns into canon reaction when she isn’t or d) an assumption she’s there as a bride for someone. Because frankly it is something I can see him assuming. Bruce training a girl much like how Dick/Jason was trained so eventually they would marry to be solid heirs. The LoA is messed up and Talia might be a woman but she was raised there so there’s probably a ‘exception to the rule’ mentality with her. And I can see Damian either then: deciding he would be Tim’s groom as the true heir to the Bat or he would go: well time to marry her off now.

Either works. He’d still be violent and cruel towards her but that’s just Damian in general until he mellows out.

I think losing Robin in this world would be much more of a blow for Tim because of the sexism she’s faced. Being the lesser Robin for being a girl, how people reacted to her being feminine, seeing how Dick so easily tosses her aside for a male child. How people probably would go: yes! A good Robin finally! Or how his more violent reaction probably gets praised over her. Mixed in with the dismissal of Bruce being alive which feels worse as women are always getting dismissed by people and Tim lashes out harder then in canon.

We then come back to Babs because there’s only two ways she can react: canon or she goes ‘I’ll listen for real as I know the guys suck at listening to the girls’ and making her decisions that way. (And let’s be real Babs would know. Give me more female solidarity in comics and not the weird catty crap we get otherwise)

We then have canon happen with Ra’s being just as creepy mixed with a lot more sexism on her world tour.

One thing I do think would happen like canon is Tim realizing she’s bisexual when Fem!Bernard comes along and gets her thinking about it because girls are allowed to be touchy with each other so her not knowing is twice as likely.

These stories are VASTLY different from one another and the assumption that they wouldn’t be is insulting. Yes, transwomen are women but there’s still a huge difference in a story about either of them. Both these stories have very different thoughts and reactions from characters.

Just pretending that they’re one in the same is wrong. And pretending there’s a moral high ground when you claim they are is just being a dick.