#stop lying about anti endos

[thestarseersystem]

I have something for endos.

thank you.

[antiendovents]

Endogenics, stop calling us “ trauma-scum ”, when in fact — you're all projecting because you know you're lying about a serious illness that needs distressing and traumatic events to even develop.

Stop claiming systemhood and get genuine fucking help.

Stop bending over backwards twisting resources to say that science has proved you right, when in actuality, you have shit reading comprehension.

Stop threatening actual victims of abuse by saying that you'll “ traumatise us further ”, when we call you out on your fucking shit.

Safe to say — you're the scum you so proudly call every genuine system.

Get a fucking grip, please. — 🩸

^^^ literally. Stop saying people with trauma are lucky. Stop spreading misinformation. Stop threatening anti endos for calling out your bullshit. Stop acting like being a system is fun and games. Stop denying science.

[sysmedsaresexist]

I spoke with Colin Ross again.

The original post, for those who missed it.

This is going to be really disjointed and rough. I've been put in a really weird position and I want to just... talk about it. This is okay to reblog, I'm sure there's pro/endos that have been waiting for this. Unfortunately, it's going to be attached to a vent.

Sadly, talking to him brought up a lot of bad feelings. I'm still so sad to see so many people turn on me. I'm disappointed that there was so much pushback. I'm disgusted by people's hypocrisy.

People wanted to know why I wasn't posting my side of the emails to Colin Ross, they tried to say he didn't believe those things anymore.

So I emailed him again, recapping our previous conversations, and asking him if he still believed in non traumagenic plurality.

And he responded that he does.

I thought I could post it, and that would be the end of it. Proving we had spoken before, confirming the topics discussed. But in my email to him, I shared what I've been doing since I last spoke with him, what prompted me to reach out to him again. The same thing that stopped me from posting my side of the emails originally. I wasn't entirely honest with him, either. I don't think I would have gotten a response if I had talked about tumblr.

And I'm simultaneously so excited and so scared.

This is a man that, in a very vague sense, formed a mentor/professional relationship with me. Our interaction overall was brief, but it was exciting to discuss his work with him, ask him questions that had been bothering me-- I told him about myself, my educational and work background. I used my real email and name. My real school. He's Canadian, we talked about it. I shared real details of my life, and while it wasn't necessarily in confidence, I don't think he would appreciate knowing that I've shared his personal thoughts and emails on tumblr, of all places. I'm not lying or hiding anything in my side of the conversation.

I'm scared.

I'm terrified to post anything that could be linked to me. Even posting this, I'm like, "can people like... reverse edit my picture and get my email?" I genuinely don't know.

I worry about posting the full screenshots with his email, knowing people won't believe me if I don't, but not wanting to have these ridiculously immature people in his inbox. I have encouraged people since day one to find his email themselves and reach out. I figure that the only people who would put in that work are the people who genuinely want to learn.

But then I realized that there are people that could ruin the relationship I made with him.

People that could make it so that I can never contact him in this way again.

People could use this to find me, if they get Colin Ross talking. (The rational part of my brain says he's smart enough not to give someone else my name, but goddamn, some of you people are actually dangerous)

There are people that want to do that to me. People that hate that I even brought a professional into this conversation. And I get it. I sat on the original conversation for almost three years, remember?

It's really scary to admit you're wrong, that you've been close-minded and hardheaded. It's scary to confront your bias and actions.

But having him respond to me... I feel so lucky? Not that Colin Ross is a saint, but how often do you get to meet someone like him? How often do you have a chance to take advantage of a professional contact that seems willing and happy to have these kinds of conversations with you? Three years later and he remembered me. He took the time to answer me, again.

I don't want to fuck that up.

So I thought about reaching out to certain people, showing them the entire set of emails without any blockout and having them vouch for the authenticity.

Then I realized that I wouldn't trust any of you anti endogenic systems with any of my information after how you've all behaved.

And I realized that none of you are going to change your minds, no matter what I show you, and I'd rather to maintain my professional relationships than put any more effort into any of you.

And I know if I wait too long to post this, people will call it fake, so I either need to go ahead and make this post or just kind of let it disappear into obscurity.

It's so important, though.

Isn't it?

I can't tell anymore.

[snowglobe-system]

Hi! Feel no pressure to answer, but I have a few questions (regarding DID)

So I'm aware of what an endo system is, but I'm a bit confused on why it would be considered valid since the condition is directly caused by trauma, which is the thing that endos lack. Could you please explain your perspective on it? And maybe your perspective before you became pro-endo?

Hey! I've been sitting on this ask for a few days now. I do want to start out by thanking you for reaching out to me and asking about my perspective. Please note that you are not obligated to agree with me, or to change your mind just from my answer to your questions. I like having you as a mutual, and I will continue to do so regardless of your syscourse stance.

I'm going to grab a term that some of my mutuals in the DID community have used, and say I'm really more pro syscourse conversation than I am pro endo- pro endo is just the easiest way to communicate my basic stances.

I think the most important thing to understand here is that a lot of the time, the "are endos real" debate suffers from both sides fundamentally misunderstanding what the other's stance actually is. While there is a small subsection of the endo community claiming that DID isn't trauma based- which I vehemently disagree with, DID is absolutely trauma based, and that's backed by all of the research- that's not the majority.

Most endogenic systems are not claiming to have DID. They are claiming to experience themselves as more than one. I am by no means an expert on this, but I know that it is a very western-centric view to assume that everyone subscribes to being one singular self. If you want to learn more about non-western views on the self and on plurality, I would recommend looking at @system-of-a-feather's blog. They make great posts on the subject!

And- here's a real kicker- not everyone with a CDD- CDD standing for complex dissociative disorders and including the likes of DID, OSDD, P-DID, UDD, etc- actually identifies as plural. Not everyone with even DID identifies as plural. So if someone with a CDD can identify as one, what's stopping someone who doesn't have a CDD from identifying as more than one? This post puts it pretty well, so I'm just going to link it here! And if you're looking for scientific backing on endo systems? Dr Colin Ross, one of the very well known DID researchers, believes in non-traumagenic self states.

Basically, I'm choosing to believe people when they talk about their subjective personal experiences.

Now you did also ask about my anti-endo days and I will also gladly talk about those. I will admit, I was the worst kind of anti-endo. I was the type of person who would throw even other CDD systems under the bus as fakers because I wanted to seem more legitimate. Everyone who didn't present the "right" way was a faker. And endos, my goodness. They were the worst fakers of them all.

It was an extremely reactive position to take. I was suffering from my plurality, therefore everyone who wasn't had to be faking. They were making a mockery out of me! At least, that's how I perceived it.

And then I started interacting with endos, and pro endos. I realized that they were also real people, not just an abstract concept to make fun of to make myself look more legitimate. And I started reading blogs that had the rawest, realest content about CDDs that I'd come across thus far... and they were pro endo. And the arguments as to why were really good.

Somewhere along the way, I realized that the things that were leading me to being anti endo were the same things that made me into a transmed when in the 2010s. I believed that people had to meet a minimum quota of suffering to be real. In a way, I was defining people by it. And ultimately, if they are lying? It costs me nothing to believe them. I'd rather believe some liars than not believe people who are telling the truth. I've had enough experience with people not believing me. It sucks. I didn't want to keep doing that to others.

That's about the end of this yap session! Seriously, thanks again for asking, I really enjoyed writing this post. I hope I answered in a way that makes sense to you!

[anti-lies]

Real Fact: The only way to be plural is by suffering severe childhood trauma according to the theory of structural dissociation

The theory of structural dissociation is currently the most accepted theory for how DID forms. Children naturally have less integrated personalities, and when someone undergoes severe trauma during childhood, it prevents their personality from fully integrating.

This theory is clearly explained in this Carrd.

As this Carrd says, there is no other way one could possibly be a system according to science.

This theory was created in 2006 by Onno van der Hart, Ellert R. S. Nijenhuis and Kathy Steele in the book The Haunted Self, and has remained the main theory for how traumatic dissociation forms for close to 20 years.

These authors are top experts in their field, and this theory clearly proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that the only possible way to form dissociative parts of the personality is through trauma.

Any endos who say otherwise are faking and lying. All their so-called sources are outdated or written by themselves or are ableist.

Please, trust the science. Trust the doctors. And trust the Carrd about what those scientists and doctors say.

Anyone who would argue with the doctors who wrote made the Theory of Structural Dissociation are science deniers, no better than flat-earthers or anti-vaxxers.

Now that you've been properly informed, please reblog and share this accurate and true information so you can inform others.

And don't bother clicking underneath the cut. There's nothing important there.

Oh, you're still here?

I thought I told you to leave?

Go on. Get.

There's nothing to see here!

Oh... That.

What's that doing here?

Yeah, don't worry about that. That's just some article written by pro-endos to make it look like you can form dissociative parts of the personality without trauma.

Don't trust the pro-endos and their sources!

Oh... You saw that too, didn't you?

That the source for that happens to be the same exact people I told you to trust earlier.

Fine. Let's deal with that.

First, this says "may." That means that it isn't definitely true. And by rearranging those words, you'll realize that means it definitely isn't true according to the theory of structural dissociation.

Trust me when I say that this still supports us and that these doctors are on our side.

Second...

Endos are stupid

There. I said it.

Endos are what I call half-thinkers.

Endos will try to tell you that if someone is a valid source in one context then they need to be a valid source in all contexts to be consistent. That if you're using the theory of structural dissociation as evidence that the only way to have multiple dissociative parts with their own consciousness is through trauma or a disorder, you should acknowledge that the creators of that theory have entertained other possibilities.

But you who are reading this are smarter than any of those half-thinking endos. You're 4 times as smart as these half-thinkers. You can think double what any endo can at least. That makes you, at minimum, a double-thinker.

And as intelligent and critical double thinkers, you can understand how important context is.

In the first context, the Carrd that referenced the theory by Onno van der Hart and Ellert R. S. Nijenhuis is supporting True Science.

In the second, their actual words from their paper are going against True Science. They're stating something may exist that we know is scientifically impossible. Something we know is scientifically impossible because of what we've heard other people say about the Theory of Structural Dissociation. And that proves the creators of the theory of structural dissociation wrong!

So don't let endos use quotes like this to brainwash you. Remember that you are an intelligent and critical double thinker.

Stay smart and hold firm in your beliefs and values, and never stop double thinking!

<3

[sawyer-is-eepy]

as a punk, its the least fucking punk thing to call someone a poser. what 90% of anti-endos want is for endos to stop calling themselves systems (its a medical term) and to get the fuck out of our spaces. calling yourself a system (short for system of alternate states of dissociation) when you dont have did/osdd is ablist. ablism is NOT punk. listen to actual fucking trauma survivors instead of circlejerking every other ablist around

hi, sorry, i've mostly got it okay but i don't have my glasses right now and can't see very well. trying to still type properly but it's a bit hard, so i'm sorry for any typos ! ^^

i get why anti endos are wanting a space thats exclusively for cdd systems, but terms can change and adapt and evolve(and they are!) the thing is, more and more research is being done on endogenic systems and a lot of said studies are referring to endos AS systems. medical studies and such!

plus, not trying to say you're lying or anything because i can't prove you wrong, but i'm, not even entirely sure system was ever ACTUALLY just exclusively for cdds because it's just that previousloy, there was no research on endos so maybe now that more stuff is coming out about them? but if you do have stuff about the original usage of the term i'd be glad to check it out! i

and about your spaces, again i do understand why youd want a space sepcifically for traumagen/disordered systems. but the thing is, a lot of times those spaces completely exclude a lot of traumagen systems ANYWAYS!! yall exclude proendo traumagen, and exclude traumagenic systems that aren't disordered! and because a lot of those spaces have become "haha funny lets just h\ate on endos and fakeclaim a ton of them!" and also putting "proendos dni" on a lot of your posts you exclude anyone who could benefit from resources and/or potential friendships, as well as fakeclaim "real" systems! you create spaces that are filled with hate and anger so people don't feel safe expressing themselves.

tumblr is usually better about fakeclaiming stuff from what i've seen, but literally everywhere else(ESPECIALLY reddit tiktok and yt) are all incredibly hostile toward endos, and often how that manifests itserlf is fakeclaiming literally any system, ever. INCLUDING traumagen ones.

my MAIN issue with anti endos is how yall want a safe space but your spaces are so filled with hate and you consistently bar yourself from actually ever receiving any criticism. you create echo chambers, basically

safe spaces are no5t places for people to post hate without having to get called out. safe places are not for you to go "there's no science to back endos!" and then ignore any attempts to share science behind endos by saying "youre invading our spaces! you broke the dni!"

youre right, ableism is VERY not punk! but you claim to protect trauma survivors when you ignore the proendo traumagens and the endos WITH trauma!! what about the endos who had to go through trauma and want to speak about their trauma but are silenced because its "sCiEnTiFiCaLlY ImPosSiBlE!111!!11" ? what about the traumagenic systems who just waant a space to be able to communicate with other trauma survivors but they arent listened to because they support something else???

you create hateful spaces, we're gonna call you out on that bullshit.

i'm sorry about the endos who invade other tags but i feel like this time it's at least a little justified.

edit: i can see slightly better now so i fixed some of the typing errors. sorry if i still missed any

[t4lon]

siiiiigh. there are so many variations of anti-endo it's almost impossible to identify one particular crux of the issue, but i AM seeing a lot of "i have this experience (DIDOSDD) that is so profound and damaging that someone with a superficially similar experience (in this case, endogenic plurality) is INSULTING me by comparing them"

and i see this a lot in other places too, it's also part of the transmed mentality. basically, people take immediate offense at the idea that someone "different" who has it "easier" could relate to any of their More Profound Experiences.

Fictives also do this to fictionkin. Can you please explain to me what makes fictive exomemories inherently different from the kin memories of a singlet? "Well we have both and they're different for us so.." alright, but what about the people who have both but can't tell them apart, or just consider them the same thing?? And why when sharing experiences do you feel so angry when a fictionkin goes "oh, I also experience that." You don't need to immediately say "no, obviously you can't, because we're different." You can instead go "Huh, that's neat. We have a lot in common" or maybe Try to clarify if you feel misunderstood, but why so much vitriol over "don't compare me to you"?

anyway, if it's not already clear, this is a large aspect of the endogenic issue. for those who finally figured out all the layers of misconceptions and are STILL mad, it's mostly from a standpoint of "i have nothing in common with you STOP insinuating i do GO AWAY i am SUFFERING and you are NOT" which is presumptive and also just a little silly to me.

even singlets also have severe mental disorders, can dissociate and otherwise be made miserable by circumstances. Why do you assume every endogenic system has a perfect life and psyche and are all lying to you when they say "hey me too" about one of your struggles

[sophieinwonderland]

Why are people still lying about system hopping???

I've already covered this pretty in-depth in the past. If you want to see the full post with links and sources, please visit this page:

Here are the bullet points:

"System travel" has been in use to describe moving between bodies since at least as far back as 2001.

"System hopping" has been recorded as an alternative to this since at least as far back as 2005.

Another system has reported it being in wide use at least around 2007.

The earliest use of system hopping as a RAMCOA term was a Twitter post from April of 2021. There is no evidence of system hopping being used before that point to refer to moving between side systems.

Anti-endos pounced and started using this Tweet as evidence that system hopping is a stolen RAMCOA term.

The creator of that Tweet later deleted it and confirmed that nobody else in the RAMCOA community called that system hopping.

System hopping didn't become a RAMCOA term until a full 16 years after its oldest recorded use in the general plural community.

This is settled history!

STOP SPREADING THIS LIE!

(Also, since anti-endos keep spreading hate and misinformation in inclusive spaces, and this post is directly about DID, this is going into both DID and anti-endo tags. Especially the tags they spread this misinformation in.)

[didderd]

i've been confused about this for a while now, and i just keep seeing it. people who have "anti-endo" or "non-traumagenics dni" etc. in their bios or posts.

it confused me bc after looking into it, i found that endogenic is just a term for another type of system.

it immediately rubbed me wrong that people are excluding these people simply for what they are.

and after doing some research, i'v realized that it's fake claiming culture...

if these people make you uncomfy, sure you don't have to interact with them, but you do not live in their head. you can't decide if they have a disorder or not.

same shit happens with tic disorders. people with tics claiming that someone else is faking simply because their tics don't look the same, or they happen differently, etc.

as someone who can't fucking stand fake claiming, i have to say something.

fake claiming is never ok

full stop.

someone's system developed differently than yours? works differently than yours? they'r different than you, that is all. don't assume they're just lying.

and if they are lying, they are not doing as much damage as you would be doing by accusing them of such, and it turns out they'r not lying. don't take that chance. i'v heard how much fake claiming can take a huge tole on someone's mental, even ruin their life if it gets bad enough. and usually it's not even true.

if you want to know more about these systems, here is a link too an article, made by the people who proposed the terms. and here is an important part of it:

"The terms traumagenic and endogenic, which are now often used to try and divide the community into “fake” and “real” systems, were never meant to be used as such. We proposed them, and a few other terms, back in mid 2014 just as a way for people to move away from medicalized terms, to help phase out the term “natural system”, and give non-medicalized systems words they could use to better describe their experiences.

Endogenic simply means, a system not formed from trauma or other negative life experiences. It doesn’t mean they never experienced trauma, just that it isn’t what formed them. It doesn’t mean “healthy” or “non-disordered”. Endogenic systems can and sometimes do experience amnesia, dissociation, distress, and dysfunction. There are quite a few hypotheses out there for how endogenic systems form, but in the end, we just don’t know how the brain works in regards to plurality. It could be psychologically, physiological, spiritual, who knows. The point is, endogenic systems exist and are a completely valid expression of plurality."

lastly, i want to say, if you are an endogenic system, i believe you. you are valid. you deserve to exist.

and if you'r a fake claimer, DNI. unfollow. get off my blog.

[syscourse-confessions]

📬

I'm of the opinion that anti endo, pro endo, and endo neutral people could just coexist in peace and like, share resources or talk about the weather, but instead someone will harass someone else because they really have nothing else to do all day

so it's "you are not a real system muh muh!! no knowing about what is wrong with you until you're 69 with 3 kids, 2 part time jobs, and at least 420 major life events that happened this last month that broke your psyche for good so you can't cope anymore and you're ACTUALLY disordered now. also provide your entire trauma and medical history so I can make sure you're not lying" or "well AChKTUALLYh I can appropriate words that are explicitly not for me because my friend who is conveniently whatever I'm talking about said it's okay :) I don't care if you ask not to use it in your presence because it's disrespectful to you. I love crossing boundaries it's a nice hobby to have I can function well with other people"

I've seen some shit being in pro endo spaces that discourages me from talking about my disorder in the first place, despite being pro/neutral myself (it's nuanced)

when I'm these spaces I try to talk about anything but my polyfrag DID, because I'm either not taken seriously, or someone will find some excuse to invalidate my experiences and make things more confusing by using terms I've explicitly said not to use if you didn't have these experiences, such as polyfrag (it's not just a big system!!! jesus christ!!!)

meanwhile, anti endos also have hurt me, by indirectly hating on undiagnosed systems while masking it as being against systems who are too covert for their liking or "making symptoms up" which are often just signs of being polyfrag really

I know it's hard to hear it but disorders actually have different manifestations in different people, and my DID is only covert online because I let it

every space has its problems and we could just come to an agreement that plurality is plurality, traumagenic and endogenic plurality are inherently different, while also coming to an agreement that some terms are exclusive to traumagenic systems and some subsets of traumagenic systems, and that there are better hobbies than harassment. you know. peace and love on planet earth and all that, your syscourse stance doesn't necessarily mean you HAVE to be a fucking asshole

or if you can't stop being an asshat regardless of where you stand, you can always talk about something else. crazy weather out there these last few 40 years innit

📬- Syscourse replies encouraged

DISCLAIMER: Posts may or may not reflect accurate information. More info here: https://www.tumblr.com/syscourse-confessions/728819621058232320/disclaimer-treat-posts-here-like-you-would-any

[marbles-for-breakfast]

I don’t identify as endo, btw. I just get lumped in with them bc I don’t have any memories of child abuse and I don’t like origin labels. I may very well be “traumagenic”. That’s not a useful distinction to me. I don’t care why I’m like this and I don’t think other people should care either. Even if I discover that I have significant childhood trauma, I won’t feel the need to say that was definitely the sole cause of me being plural. It’ll be intertwined with it, yes. Of course it will. But why should I be forced to assume it was the reason?

But because of all these things, your anti-endo posts feel targeted at me too. I don’t identify as endo, but I know that’s how you would identify me. Just because I’m not confidently traumagenic with no evidence of trauma. And just because I don’t hate endos for being confidently who they are.

When someone tells you they exist, believe them. Believe them until or unless you have actual evidence that they are lying. And “they’re lying bc that’s impossible” is not a valid reason, because guess what? You can’t just assume that something is impossible because it doesn’t fit into the story of OSDDID that people usually tell. You don’t know what’s possible and what’s not. No one does. Especially when it comes to brain stuff. The only way to know what’s possible is to LISTEN to people. If you think endos are all lying weirdos who want to be special and think that your trauma is a fun game, you’re not listening.

And I understand why you’re not listening. The narrative that trauma made you like this is important to you. And you know what? That’s okay. No one’s trying to take that away from you. We just want the freedom to have our OWN narratives about why WE are the way we are. Some of us (like me) want the freedom to be unsure. Or to simply not care. I don’t feel like I need a reason. And I don’t feel like I could ever really know for sure. But I understand that the reason is important to a lot of you. And I do respect that.

You can have your own spaces if you want. Stop talking shit about us (especially in shared spaces like the plural tag), and we’ll leave you the heck alone. I certainly think we should be allowed to have some separation between different communities based on origin. I mean, my experience is very different from willogenic systems. And I’ll admit that I sometimes have negative instincts towards them. It’s natural to feel some level of resentment towards people who got to have a choice where you didn’t. It can be confusing when they make the choice to be something that you worked hard to come to terms with, seemingly while skipping all the hardest parts! It’s not fair. But that’s also not their fault. It’s not their fault you were abused. It’s not their fault you never got a choice. It’s not their fault that being a system is so hard, and coming to terms with everything is such an overwhelming process. It’s not their fault it’s easier for them.

I don’t want to be friends with a bunch of willogenics. Maybe I’m not ready for that, maybe I never will be. I still think they have a right to make a choice that I was never given. I’m happy for them, that they got to do that. I’m happy that it was easier than what we’re going through.

I know that it’s possible to become a system through paths other than severe trauma because I have not seen any evidence that that is not the case. And the hundreds of people claiming to have arrived at this point through a wide variety of methods is all the proof I need that this is possible. Because I have no reason to doubt their own interpretation of their own experiences. How arrogant or stubborn would I have to be to do that?

Just let systems be ourselves, please. I want community. I want understanding. I want empathy. So let’s stop worrying about so much about why we’re like this, and focus on what we are, and who we want to be.

[momentsofamber]

Hey uuuuh did you know... Ur big swaggy and hella stronger than ur demons? 😉👍 You've overcome them in the past to make it to today, you'll overcome today's with the lessons from the past, and the future doesn't know what it has coming to it 📣👏😁

Anon, this was so nice to wake up to. 😭 Thank you so much!!

I'm so sorry it took me all day to respond to this and I'm about to ramble so feel free to skim this, I'm gonna dump it under a read more. ( Do people even still use these in 2024? askdjhf )

I never directly attacked anyone in my time while pretending to be an anti. I was just completely silent on the matter, letting my morality complex and p.edophobia ocd wage war on my well-being.

It's ironic, I've been on this site since about 2010; and in 2012 when I started to be at my first most active point on tumblr and had a friend group on here, I would blog about Wincest (SPN) on main and no one said anything or thought anything of it, they just kept scrolling. That was the norm. People just SHIPPED whatever they wanted.

Flash ahead to like 2018 and suddenly everywhere I go there are now neon eyesore banners on posts, including fucking stimboards and whatnot with 'p.roship d.ni' and 'a.nti-a,ntis d.ni' ( I'm censoring that just so this post isn't blacklisted from proshippers because that is NOT my stance ) and I was like 'I don't even know what these terms MEAN?? where did these come from??' but I was too afraid to ask anyone so I just. Stayed silent and promised myself I'd only reblog "safe" content and that I was "happy" I'd "become a better person since then". ( spoiler: I was lying to myself. )

And over the years any time I made new friends who had never seen that content on my blog back then, I'd just say I didn't support Problematic Content(tm) and I'd only talk about and rp and reblog ships that were "normal", because I was now so afraid people would reject me at any time because it seemed like the anti crowd was so large and violent and nasty -- my mental health at that time would not have been able to handle that hatred.

-- in fact I had this SAME experience in the plural community with the a.nti-e.ndos for identifying as a median system. ( we know now that we are a bpdgenic osdd-1b system, but we still prefer most median terminology to describe ourselves. ) But the traumagenic DID systems who were pro-endo were so much more welcome to interacting with us than the exclusionists. And it's the same bullshit different flavor happening here with the proshippers.

How much overlap is there between a.nti-e.ndo and a.nti-p.roship rhetoric, I wonder? It's wild. I wish I had learned how to undo my black and white thinking so much sooner and listen to new points of view instead of just shying away from the unknown in fear.

But this is a new year, and this is a new me. This blog is going to be a source of love and positivity and learning about other people's experiences. Any discourse or negativity ( even the validating kind ) will remain on my sideblog. I don't have to like or even agree with everything I see online, but I am going to support people's right to say it, do it, make content of it, as long as all parties involved are consenting. ( Fictional characters, animated or live action, do not have the autonomy to consent or not consent so people can do anything they want with fiction that makes them feel happy and fulfilled, full stop. Yes, this includes RPF and selfshipping. As long as you keep your content in your safe space and no actors/musicians/etc involved in the creation of that character you're using are able to see it - I will support your right to make or consume any content as you see fit. )

[sysmedsaresexist]

I sent this ask to a different blog but I don't think they're going to post it... I'm so sad, I'm screaming into the void. I'm scared. I'm sending to you because you're where I learned so much of this

Did i say anything wrong? I put so much work into this ask, I grabbed a screenshot partway through, so this isn't EXACTLY the same ask, but it's very close, I had to rewrite some.

from one DID system to another, please, hear me out, I'm desperate to be heard

Literally NO endos claim to have DID

There's like two, and they still say it's caused by trauma but they were systems first and later trauma made their system unstable

If endos want to demedicalize CDDs, why would they claim to have it? It's a roundabout way to achieve the same goal, it's just extra steps

Endos are literally fighting to get away from CDD spaces, do you actually see endos in the DID tag? The cdd tag? NO

They're in the plural tag, a word they choose to separate from the more clinically associated "multiple" of MPD, they're in the syscourse tags because they're allowed to participate, syspunk is less than a month old and it should be a meme at this point because they already had anti endo as a tag

They are literally saying they are systems that are UNRELATED to CDDs, not that they want to demedicalize being a system System doesn't belong to DID, look at IFS, psychological anthropology, or multiple theory of self, jungian archetypes, or does that mean we should be angry about "computer system" because it dehumanizes us?

And stolen terms? We know who came up with system hopping, it has never been used in RAMCOA. Do any of you actually know where tulpa came from? Like the actual word? Do you know who Alexandra David Neel is? The white woman who invented an imaginary practice that didn't actually exist (What she wrote about is not the same as Buddhist emanation), and created the word tulpa based on another white guy's mistranslation to entertain more white people during the Vietnam War?

So they have new words, they're trying to create more new words, there's so much real, actual research by real doctors into this phenomenon of nonpathological multiplicity in ways that exist outside of clinical psychopathology

The only overlapping word is "system

Plurals tend to get really upset when you use words like alter for them, they don't want to be medicalized at all, they understand what DID is and say, "| don't fit that description", and they're allowed to say that

If I, a DID system, feel I'm healed and integrated and choose to drop the DID label, no one can stop me, and we can't stop people from not picking it up to start with

Why can't anyone have actual conversations about this stuff, I'm so anxious because it seems like people are purposefully trying to misunderstand and lying about how bad the problem is

"Existing" isn't enough to qualify as misinformation, and it seems the only incorrect and unverifiable facts are coming out of the anti endo community.

I'm just so scared and sad.

I just want to know it's going to be okay

First -- I'm glad we can post this for you. I highly recommend screenshotting asks you send to people! It's helped me a lot with my paranoia in the past (did I send that on anon? Did I send that at all??) and it's a good record of your words for later.

Second.

I agree with you, I really do. This is so frustrating, and the self-described anti-endos who have recently flooded system spaces on tumblr are completely unwilling to look at the facts. They're obstinate and stubborn as mules, and unfortunately, that is not going to change. Most of them, if not all of them, are either children or caught in a current cycle of abuse with no way out. Most if not all are currently fighting for survival. They are not in a place to accept others; they can barely accept themselves.

People are purposefully ignoring information. People are purposefully avoiding it.

And it is not, and never has been, your job to fix their issues.

These are people who have always been unwilling to listen. They are children who cannot, for their own reasons, listen at the moment. For whatever reason, they are not in a position to accept endogenic plurality exists, and the more they are pushed, the more they will spit up their vitriol on the puke towel that is syscourse (or, worse, "syspunk").

It is sad. It can be scary. But it's not on your shoulders to fix them.

At the end of the day, you have to ask: what is most beneficial for me in this moment? Next, what is most beneficial for my family in this moment? Then, what is most beneficial for my followers in this moment? Then, and only then, are you getting to "beneficial for the tag to see," if you get there at all. The ask you sent them is lovely, and needed, but they are not ready to see this sort of thing, I can guarantee it.

That's why I'm glad it's here: so others can see it.

The last point I'll make is... Please make sure that you are valuing the correct things in your life, anyone reading this. If syscourse is stressing you out, please make sure to take appropriate breaks and check your brain. Remember that this is largely an online issue; the real world is quickly progressing to be more plural accepting and more accepting in general, and there are far bigger issues than an idiot crosstagging misinformation in a niche online discourse. I'm not trying to say this isn't an issue, and it should absolutely be spoken out about, but make sure to take care of yourself while you do. Anti-endos and pro-endos who are idiots online are not the end all be all of system activism. In fact, they rarely fit that definition.

Please do not let these places completely wreck you emotionally. You deserve so much better than that.

Sending love to all our followers; good luck staying afloat out there. <3

[systemgoblincore]

Woag. Actual pinned post?? With info?? Haven't done one of these in YEARS!! Erm erm erm...

First and foremost, we are an adult. Use the name Tango for us collectively! Same with he/him, ice/ices, cold/colds + any and all neopronouns. MAJOR trans and queer person!! we're a professionally diagnosed polyfrag DID sys. also autistic an other shit idc disabled go brr

anti endo in the. "The way endogenic people/supporters treat an active trauma based disorder is abhorrent, stop treating a disorder like an aesthetic gender to over-coin. Also, stop using indoctrination and telling blatantly harmful, incorrect, or intentionally misleading information." way. You can only have DID and likewise disorders with trauma. 👍 fight with a wall. https://web.archive.org/web/20220328222747/https://subsystems.tumblr.com/endohistory !!

If ur a pro-endo singlet/non-system, don't interact. Stay out of system discourse entirely, thanks.

i post art under #my art or on my art blog @cryptidseafog !! i only share my fanfic with close friends or on my ao3. which you will never get unless u pry it from my dead hands

you should also check out #yhis au which stands for Your Heart I Surrender Alternative Universe. And you should also ask me about it. I'm very normal about this au. I swear. (Lying)

sys boxes r by @/sysboxes more may or may not be added I dunno yet!!

[transmorolians]

i’m gonna start lying about being an endogenic system so anti-endos don’t touch me with a ten-foot-pole yeesh. 

the world is against systems as a whole and that includes everyone who is a system. 

yes, even if they’re a system in “the wrong way”. 

 as long people are still making movies about systems being serial killers there is no point in caring if someone is a system in “the wrong way”!!! 

the majority of singlets don’t care!!!!! they still hate us!!!!!!!! stop kicking other systems down because you’ll be next, even if you’re a system in “the right way”!!!!!!!!!

[pawfuu]

So Catidol why is it that each time you "apologise" its full of lies 1 after another. You admitted you were not Cherokee yet when I saw your prn.cc I saw Cherokee names. Not even said to be gifted too. Hm that's really interesting. Next up your new apology. Let's dissect this, shall we.

In your first line, you said you said and I quote "yes, I fucked up. Yes i had an old account. I never tried to hide it" Yet in a post from when you started your account you said "I never ran a mogai account till now because of the drama" and "generally I've stayed off tumblr until now". So which is it? Admit it you love lying, you never got help, and most of all each and every single one of your "apologises " has never once had the word sorry. Next up we have you saying you apologised on discord AND tumblr yet guess what momo your apology was deleted not by tumblr but you actively deleted it. You said it yourself in that post you'd make that apology and delete it. Last but not leave my personal favourite lie you love to say is you took a break from tumblr. Hmm, that's really interesting. Didn't it take less than 3 weeks for you to create that new account? Are you sure your therapist really thought that was a good idea? To let a clearly unstable minor who was sent rape and death threats back on the internet.

Secondly, cannifreak you being a white person who claims to be a supporter of POC voices and against cultural approprators what happened? Is it suddenly ok that momo claimed to be multiple races without proof because shis your friend? So all the pain that shi actively have brought to our community means nothing because shis your friend. Let's not forget the fact your sweet dear Momo used the r slur as a slur. But that's never talked about is it? Or what about the fact shi doesn't care for endos and isn't anti endogenic? I thought you were strictly anti endo. Shall I go on?

Momo, as much as you just love running from your problems, does not mean I won't continue to remind you of your problematic behaviour. So how about you stop fibbing at every chance you get, and maybe just maybe I'll stop "harassing" you. - 🐚

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