#if i got anything wrong in terms of origins/personality/etc. for any of the characters feel free to let me know

[fennelockley]

An analysis of the Toymaker and The Giggle

I'm completely unhinged for this character so this is going to be LONG long. But there's a brief character analysis at the top.

Character portrayal - Perfection. Has exactly all the points and quirks of the OG character while NPH builds upon it in his own way - and everything he does is perfect and in character.

Mannerisms - This feels so bizzare to say, but we barely have any footage of the Toymaker before this episode. So this is essentially all we have to go on in terms of body language, facial expressions, etc. This is all new, but it feels like it's been a part of this character all along.

A character that's portrayed as being full of energy, shifting emotions and tones like masks - he doesn't sit still for a moment, he's constantly shifting even if its just the minutest of facial expressions. And we finally get to see it!!

The explanation - The Doctor always has an understanding of what he's up against, even if it takes him time to learn. But the Toymaker was essentially the very first enemy the Doctor ever meets (ty Divided Loyalties), and he still doesn't have an explanation as to who or what he is, or how he does things.

This was the bit that had me worried about the episode, and I know people like an explanation - but I'm of the firm belief that the Toymaker should always defy explanation and any known logic. The moment you understand him - he fundamentally changes and you've lost all understanding. You can't use the same trick twice.

New canon points:

- Being brought into this realm through a superstition at the edge of the universe. Such a brilliant and poetic way to summon such a character.

- Not having a choice but to accept a challenge. Normally, the Toymaker would accept anything tbh. But he wasn't bound by nature to accept. This episode has made it a fundamental flaw of his character. That does, unfortuantly, make it easier to beat him. But I like it, it fits the character, it makes sense. And, no matter how much I love him being this untouchable godly powerful person, he does need flaws.

This also goes hand in hand with the OG canon about how he can't accept failure. His down fall in Solitaire.

And I'll also point out the tibit about him being incapable of cheating. The Toymakers biggest pet peeve, numero uno way to piss him off.

What I wish was different/could have been added:

- The Toymaker is infamous for his tantrums. We got his show-off personality to the 10s, but we didn't see him register his loss properly. Should have let him had his toddler moment.

- I wouldn't change how it was, but I know what feels so... wrong? With this episode. I think the reason it's not hitting about how powerful he is is because he's not in his own universe, that sheer fear that he controls everything adds an extra dimension to the story. But we got to see a snipit of it when they were lost in the toy shop - so that works for me.

_______ The lengthy episode analysis _______

Opening scene

Firstly, I was ridiculously happy that he appereaed straight away. I've waited so long 🖤

But first up is the Toy Room. Which is about as close as we get to his realm in this episode (and judging by it collapsing later on, I'm assuming it is a smaller form of his realm).

This is what the the original episode would have shown if they had the budget. Classic, old, and creepy toys filling a room to the brim. It looks so childlike and nostalgic until you look closer at the items.

Big Finish have described a very similar setting before, in Solitaire, but to see it visually is amazing.

And he fits right in to his habitat.

Very classic Toymaker in this scene. Reminded me alot of Solitaire when Charley walks into his toy shop, and he's talking talking talking - never ending commentary about his crafts, the theatrical speech mannerisms and near child-like excitement when he's speaking about his dolls.

His almost pouty way of speaking when Stooky Bill is being chosen but not his family, one again a very classic mannerism. This is a character that switches emotions, accents, and tones of voice quicker than light - and NPH does it well. He even drops to mimicking the other guys accent, not even trying to hide his mockery.

And I loved the tibit about taking the hair from a victim - "she will not miss it" - the whole idea that a victim succumbs to his play if they lose (but we will touch on that later).

The street view

Then we move onto the insanity. The Toymaker is already there, practically following the Doctor about. He's there in the background when the Doctor tries to calm that man down, and he purposely bumps into the Doctor a moment later.

"Ooh La La"

Next mockery he makes of an accent. This is purposeful nod back to unfortunate racist element in the 60s. He mocks and copy's, because its funny to him. Humans are just pawns for amusment to him, and messing around with their characteristics like that is a small part of it.

Purely in his element in this scene, he's got that blissful and happy look to his face - a creature of chaos, in the chaos that he caused.

Back in time

First face off between the Doctor and the Toymaker. Loved the little peek-a-boo dance they did through the windows.

In the Doctor goes and the Toymaker doesn't give him time to breathe. His speech is brilliant, and I'd like to think the whole "killing a man with a rock" was a Torvic mention.

Endless sense of humour and quips at the characters expense, that falls flat as they're too tied up trying to figure him out.

The endless juggling balls was a brilliant touch; such a small way to show the Toymakers powers but it gets the point across immediately that something isn't right.

The sheer fear radiating off of the Doctor that you can see leak onto Donna as she steps back and quietens down. Very few characters make the Doctor feel that way, and it's of course aimed at the one that's caused the most trauma in his life. And one that's barely survivable.

The shift in accent once the Doctor has clocked him, his little bow - and of course, the flash back to Michael Gough and the first episode, with NPH nailing his smirk. For someone that didn't know what Doctor Who was until he was cast as the Toymaker, NPH is the spitting image of the original character. Everything up to this point has been how others have portrayed the character, and NPH carries all of that forward in his performance.

Hide and Seek

If its one thing I like about this character, is that he can't stay in one state for longer than a moment. He's constantly moving, shifting states. The moment the Doctor gets steady feet the Toymaker rips the floor from under him.

This is a character where you're barely keeping your head above water with, one that just doing your all to survive against that you don't have time to think about defeating him just yet.

I could be here forever in this scene, but ill cut to my favourite bits:

- The backrooms. Because of course the Toymaker would have an never ending maze of corridors and doors as one of his tricks. The Doctor is immediately fed up and unsure of how to deal with this.

- Telling Donna he might not be able to save her this time :( as I will always say, the Toymaker is a character you survive, not defeat (and this is still true for the ending of this episode).

- "when I was young, I made a terrible mistake" you can pry Divided Loyalties from my dead hands this was a nod to that I don't care what anyone else says.

- The living puppet of his earlier victim. Another classic Toymaker move - death is a nice way to lose to him, because he usually keeps you for eternity to do as he pleases with.

- The God like hovering above the Doctor with the marionette strings. Perfect way to show the power imbalance.

The Showroom

"WELL THATS ALRIGHT THEN"

Puppet master with dolls of the Doctors companions, the whole set, the critique of the Doctors handling of his companions (hello, Divided Loyalties again)

The immediate shift in demeanour the moment the Doctor challenges him. Little creature of his games, the only thing he takes seriously.

And that beautiful surreal shuffling? That was all NPH, whos said to have a natural talent for such a thing.

The casual boasting of what he considers normal activities for himself. Doing such impossibly powerful things and hes just... and? So what about it? Very on brand. The Supernova mention was a nod at Nightmare Fair.

Trapping the Master. Hysterical. That's 3 people from the Deca that have lost to him now. Did Koschei learn NOTHING from Divided Loyalties?!?! Also trapping the Master within his body, similar to Rallon 👀

"The one who waits" and him supposedly being scared of it? What the ever loving hell could make the Toymaker run? In terms of Who lore, he's the most powerful thing out there. I'm intrigued.

The whole unraveling of the plot with the human race. Making everyone think they're right. Toymaker, that's low hanging fruit, but I respect the lesson.

And his little switch from calm to excitable the moment he wins. He's a big kid.

"He'll cheat" favourite bit of canon of all, and it's stood through all of the characters stories. The Toymaker hates cheating. He'll find loopholes that look like cheating, of course, but cheating itself? Big no no and an automatic failure (how the Doctor lost in Divided Loyalties).

"I'm already running" pretty much all stories end with his realm collapsing, interesting that it's his choice this time.

~ Spice Girls ~

This is where it stops becoming a homage to the OG character, and NPH makes it his own variation.

The only way I can describe the Spice Up Your life scene is that - it was in character, but its a side we haven't seen from him before.

That's such an interesting thing to happen, it's completely and uniquely NPH but it adds and makes sense to the character.

An all-powerful entity that taunts his power by dancing circles around his victims, both sinister and bizzare. An antagonistic move to make people uncomfortable and flaunt that he's untouchable. Extremely him, I'm upset that we haven't had this until this moment. But NPH killed it 🖤

The Doctor just before it happens looking all grave and at a loss "oh, I think he's here". Such beautiful juxtaposition.

Trapping peoples souls in bouncy balls - yes.

The rose petals - A mockery and I love it.

Dancing with people - me next please.

He turned up, was unnecessarily camp, and left again. No reason for him to have done except that he wanted to *chefs kiss*

His heart hands as he leaves, I did it right back.

Also his best outfit in my opinion!

The Laser

"I think they're still falling" that was sinister, my good god man. I shouldn't have laughed but I did.

"All that exists is to win, or to lose" his mentality and existance boiled down into that once sentence.

The whole part where the Doctor proposes to him, lmao. Actually a nod back to the OG episode...

The Toymaker doesn't like being told no, so he's probably remembering this moment.

His speech about humanity, and all the games they play within their existance.... 🗣🗣 SOLITAIRE 🗣🗣 such a brilliant and sinister speech in that audio, and this is very similar and uniquely different. Love it love it love it. "You make me dizzy"

Catch

The Bigeneration possibly being his doing, brilliant. Although I have my own seperate feelings on that topic.

Loosing to a simple game of catch. Others would say that's over whelming, but when it comes to powerful complex characters - simple is the way to go, they're too in their own heads to foresee the simple defeats.

The Toymaker is bound by winning and failure, that's always been the same. But he wasn't in his own realm this time, so him being booted from existance instead works out.

This wasn't a defeat. This was a singular win. He's had his soul scattered, he's been collapsed into a singularity, he's had his realm collapse around him multiple times. But you can't touch him. He's like a boomerang, you can throw it as hard as you want but it's never truely gone. You can't kill him, and you can't defeat him completely.

100/10 brilliant portrayal, excellently brought back to modern audiences. Beautiful beautiful episode I have it on repeat.

If you've made it this far, you're probably as unhinged as I am - so hi, welcome to the madness, and thank you for reading.

[b2319-always-commissions-open]

Commission Info 2024Latest ver.

※Private commission OK

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[kqltlc]

Terminology clarification for OC and FC because I keep seeing the terms being misused and it makes it very difficult to browse tags when a majority of the time the tags are applied wrong.

This is gonna be a long post, buckle ur seatbelts and take out your spiral straws bc ur brain gonna be as mush as mine when I'm done.

DISCLAIMER: This is my point of view and doesn't apply to EVERY scenario. Every scenario, or character, can have nuances that make them an anomaly. This is more of a generally-speaking post. I'm also really bad with words and my brain dies immediately at long posts so feel free to cut me some slack if there's mistakes or inconsistencies. LOL.

"OC" stands for "Original Character."

This is a character made entirely by you. No influence or strings attached.

You might take bits of inspiration from things such as objects, personality, outfits, or ideas - perhaps you were introduced to these through a fandom - but none of these things are inherently fandom as they exist outside of fandom as well.

Lets use dragons as an example. Dragons are a part of mythology that can't be traced back to any specific source and, for the most part, are simply a combination of existing animals like lizards and bats.

Imagine a dragon based on the long-nosed whipsnake but with a pumpkin vibe: A goofy noodle of a dragon with a slender orange body, green horns pointed backward, green vine-like wings, green belly scales that reach until the green tail that eventually ends off in vines.

This would be an OC as you created it with no strings attached to existing media. You took a few ideas you liked and created something new out of it, something original to you. If anything similar exists, it's purely coincidental and you most likely aren't aware of it.

Other examples in popular media include the sources of fandom, the Original worlds in which fandoms follow such as Sonic, Mario, Spiderman, Next Gen, Murder Drones, etc.

Sonic is a blue hedgehog that can run fast and has to save the world, Mario is a plumber out to save the princess, Spiderman is just a dude who got bit by a radioactive spider, Next gen is about a broken girl who befriends a broken robot and learns the meaning of friendship and moving on from the past, Murder Drones is about different kinds of robots initially pitted against each other but starting to realize there's something else afoot.

These were created based on ideas. There might be some idea-taking from existing media but these guys function entirely on their own, in their own world, with little to no relation to anything else.

extra notes:

an OC would be able to pass in a court of law if someone tried to claim copyright. It's why original media HAS to be original.

everything you do is canon lmao.

"FC" stands for "Fan Character."

This is a character made in relation to existing fandoms - or as I'm going to call them, the Original (OG) World, a world not made by you.

Whether it's taking a lot of visual ideas from the OG World, being related to any of the characters or plot in the OG World, or just being in the OG World, this character has strings attached to something already created by someone else. Perhaps what you create is unique on its own, but it still has relations to the OG World.

Bringing back the dragon example. You decide to make a dragon loosely based on that long-nosed whipsnake and pumpkin combo. The difference here is that you're making them a Hivewing from Wings of Fire, or a Skydancer from FlightRising.

This would make them an FC as they end up being connected to an OG World. You can have a Sonic FC who is a rainbow stag beetle that you use in any setting, a Murder Drones Worker Drone with no relation to the characters or story since they have their own but still follow the Murder Drones vibe, perhaps you have a Spiderverse character who got bit by a radioactive rabbit so their entire aesthetic is more rabbit-y.

If you're a participant of an open or closed species, then they'd fall under this as well, unless you're the creator of the species ofc.

You are a fan of an OG World, created a character inspired by it and, depending how strong the connection is to the OG World, may not be able to function outside of it (without it being obvious they stand out too much in other worlds, original or otherwise).

extra notes:

would not be able to pass in a court of law if copyright claimed as the character would share too many traits with the OG World.

anything you do is not canon in the OG World.

Can my character become an OC (or vise versa)?

Yes! It's absolutely possible for your character to start as one and evolve into the other!

You can have an FC that, over time, gets so much original ideas added to them and fandom ties severed that they can stand on their own. Perhaps you made that little snake-derg in a fandom first but eventually loved it so much you decided to make it more of its own thing!

I originally adopted a Wings of Fire design from a user a while ago and turned it into an OC by adjusting and stylizing it to a point where it's just a dragon in a world I setup for a dragon roleplay (I also know nothing on WoF so that kinda helps boost originality, lol).

You can also have an OC that you decided to drop into a fandom because you love the fandoms OG World so much! You end up giving them traits and ideas more relevant to the OG World so they fit in and function better~

(I don't have many examples of this as I'm not big on fandoms, lol)

Conclusion + Extra Notes

Please consider what's been said and tag accordingly. Although words are words and communication can be pretty loose, in the ways of tagging they're very crucial to get right.

It's really unfun to browse the OC tags and get bombarded by FCs because no one seems to remember what the terms mean, just as it's unfun to browse tags for fandoms and get unrelated posts.

Extra Notes: Although not specific to OC and FC, kinda related.

This is kinda why some creators are vehemently against being given ideas. It becomes less original, especially the more detailed an idea is.

This also plays a roll in companies trying to claim words and ideas, copywriting anything that's even remotely similar. "Monster" is a word/idea that cannot be claimed, and yet the Monster Energy Drink brand still tried to claim it. The idea of platformers or battle systems is not something inherently owned by Nintendo and yet they're getting aggressive with claiming it as their own.

DISCLAIMER: This is my point of view and doesn't apply to EVERY scenario. Every scenario, or character, can have nuances that make them an anomaly. This is more of a generally-speaking post. I'm also really bad with words and my brain dies immediately at long posts so feel free to cut me some slack if there's mistakes or inconsistencies. LOL.

Also at this point I haven't ate dinner yet and I'm really hungry so brain is 110% dead. Ya'll have fun, I'ma get some chimken nuggiez.

[the-missann]

I just remembered something I wanted to do.

Essentially, I grew up reading and watching yaoi (and also self-identify as a fujoshi) and it's always been a dream of mine to have a queer show go on for as long as something like Naruto or SpongeBob. You know, just longer than three seasons as is typical with shows that have queer main characters.

So, I'll share some of the stories of mine that either have MCs that are gay, have queer characters, or have a plot related around something LGBT.

Also, I wanna use this as a way to detail special cases in my stories as well.

! I am but a simple ally. So if something I say is wrong or there's a better way to phrase it, please kindly let me know. I truly mean no offense by anything here !

Stories with gay MCs

Tales That Were Told (Not written)

So, this is a story that's pretty much done but I haven't written one bit of it aside from a random scene I had to get out of my head. But, originally, this was just a story where two highschool kids were dealing with highschool shit. A slice of life story with two cuties. Then, it got turned into this new story (Tales That Were Told) that is a sequel to another story I'm still currently writing (Tales That Were Lived). It's hard to summarize, but essentially the main story is an adventure dealing with three characters and a fantasy world where they're all coming to terms with finding themselves and learning to love who they are despite where they may come from. In Tales Told, I intend for this story to have like relationship shit, but the relationship is two men *gasp*. It's not gonna be some weirdly specific thing; no, they're just two kids who have a crush on each other while other shit in the world is going on. Revolutionary concept I know.

Unnamed erotica (unedited, 40k wc with a planned sequel at 10k currently)

it has a name, but I don't really like it :(

I was a little iffy about writing this one at first because I'm the type of person who's extremely tired of queer media just being softcore porn. I just want a good story and the characters happen to be gay. But, I also know it's important to write stories like these as well to show all the different sides and to show people that there's not much different about anyone who happens to be lgbt. In this story, my MC Kit is a famous voice actor (like Johnny Young Bosch) and is a total asshole that everyone is scared shitless of. His soon to be boyfriend is a lovestruck puppy boy childhood friend who is desperate to be with him. He's so sweet it's almost sickening! They deal with normal relationship issues, societal problems, workplace harassment, as well as their own personal issues and some of their issues are even from each other. scandalous. Kit as the MC has a million and one issues within himself (including some from his family), but his loverboy is right there to help him! Also, here's another summary I wrote for this on my website that better explains the origin of the story.

Stories with queer characters

Orange Perfect (unfinished at 21k)

This is had a few mentions of queerness in it. A quick summary: this is a coming-of-age story where three kids (Cassie, Lucius, and Shay) are forced to become friends after all getting targeted by a gang. The MC named Shay is discovering himself. He doesn't know if he's gay, bi, non-binary, gender non-conforming, etc... and is conflicted about his various feelings as he wishes he had a simpler answer for how he feels. Another important character is a trans man (Gabe) who acts as a physical representation of Cassie's own realization of who she wants to be. It's tough for her to live as herself, so Gabe eventually reveals to her that he is a trans man. That his struggles to realize who he really was changed once he accepted himself. As well, he wants her to be different from himself as he's still living partially in the dark since very few people know he's trans.

Any story that has one character named Ren in it (too many to count)

Ren is my MCs twin brother (whenever I want her to have a twin brother) and he is always in a relationship with another character named Mari who I originally made as a trap (I was like twelve). Now a days, Mari is just best described as a twink, but I like his name too much to change it. So that part of the "trap" still exists. Ren is full on gay and screams it from the rooftops as he expresses his interest in men quite often. He's not a flamboyant gay, but he will openly tell people he has no romantic or sexual interest in women and isn't shy to kiss his boyfriend in public. Oh and bonus that women often like him and he has a ton of female friends.

The Entire Fourth Dimension Reality series (total wc of ~100k)

Aside from this story being one long shit post I thoroughly loved making. One of the secondary main characters is suppose to be pansexual. Why this is, is because she only interacts with the other three main characters because she finds them cute (one girl and two guys). Now, she's actually pan for a reason. It's mainly due to her family that made her desire to be loved by everyone around her. This manifested into her just liking anything that would show her affection. (dw Mandy, I love you💗) One of the villains I made to be feminine presenting because he was really pretty in my head when I first developed him. He was going to be genderless, but I decided to make him more feminine and most of that is just with his appearance, but he is defined as a man and acts as so, he just happens to have traditional female attire and mannerisms :)

All The Screams (unedited at 61k)

So, the main point of this story is about Cassie who ends up finding out that she's cursed, but she only does so after going on a mission to escort the prince of her kingdom to his lover. This mission is kept secret and why lies in who this lover is. It's a prince from another Kingdom. Kyo, the prince of Cassie's kingdom, is a little selfish brat who wants what he wants. He fell in love with another kingdom's prince and immediately chose him over his kingdom. With the other prince, his parents are actually gay as well and I made this story around the time I was heavily into yaoi and BL so that may have been an influence as to why tons of characters in this story are gay or why there's major plot points relating to it.

Characters that are iffy/I didn't plan to be queer

The State of Quandary (unfinished with ~60k)/ Before the Reignfall (finished with 45k)

Technically this involves two characters. One of the MCs (Fang) and the MCs friend (Dani) are in the same boat. Originally, Dani was suppose to have a crush on the other MC (Cassie), and that was suppose to explain why Dani even interacts with her in the first place and why they have such a close friendship. However, it felt queerbaity and I felt gross having that as a plot point when it's so obvious Cassie will never even get close to having romantic feelings for Dani. Then, I thought to have Dani be a lesbian because she has trauma with men and dislikes most, if not all, grown men in the world. Fang was the remedy with that as I thought to make them be in a relationship as Fang would be the first guy she ever met who isn't a total loser. However, Fang was originally going to be involved in a love triangle before I realized there's a bit to many conflicts in the story and got rid of it. So, I ended up in a gray area where Fang also doesn't show any interest in women (the result of the love triangle being removed) So, this was my fix. People can either think Fang and Dani are cute together and he manages to break through her trauma, people can think they're both gay and just show no romantic interest in the opposite sex, or their romantic feelings for anyone just isn't important to the story whatsoever. And tbh, I don't mind any one of those options. It's cool when there's different ways to interpret character relationships and it won't lead to fans fighting each other if even I don't really know what it is.

Tales That Were Told (Unfinished at ~90k words)

This villain is a doozy. Their name is Gage and when I first made this character, I pretty much was going to make a woman. However, when I started writing the story, she turned into a he and not even in a way like I intended to change the gender, but even now whenever I write Gage, they're a he. When I think of Gage, they're a she. I don't know what that's about, but even my mental image of Gage is that of both a woman and a man. (If anything, they're comparable to Leo from Tekken). So, to fix this in my head, out loud I refer to Gage as a he. I think of Gage as a she. In the story, the narrator doesn't use any pronoun and characters have conflicting usage as most characters refer to Gage as a he, but there are some who see Gage as a she or simply they/them. Oh, and no, just because Gage might be non-binary, that's not why they're evil. It's not even a plot point in the story. No vilifying personality traits over here lol

Unfinished/unplotted stories with queer plotlines

Unnamed romance (Pink and Brown)

I showcased a snipit of this story (also thanks for everyone who liked it 💕), but there's more to it than what I shared. Back when I actually had a friend, I used to tell him about ideas I had, then he would pretty much allow me to figure out what I wanted to do with it. I told him I wanted to make a story with these two girls I made in a picrew because they were so adorable and they ended up as a couple. I couldn't think of a name so they were named Pink and Brown based on their hair colors. I also couldn't think of the official story I wanted them to have. So, I simply came up with two of them. The first story is a slice of life where Brown and Pink are both in college (for IT and Art respectively) and Brown has a huge crush on two girls--one she knows through mutual friends and another being the artists of a webcomic she really loves. (I'm sure this isn't obvious at all). So, one day, Brown gets a call from Pink and she's really stressed out about something. Eventually, she explains she called her since an IT major could help her with someone hacking one of her social media accounts. Brown agrees and when she finds out what the account is, she's shocked to see that Pink is the artist of the webcomic she's been reading for years. I don't even have a damn conflict in this story so it is dead in the water. I'm sure I'll get some idea for it, but knowing me that'll be years from now, unfortunately. Oh, and the snipit I shared is suppose to be the comic Pink is drawing acted as an AU of the original story (if that makes any fucking sense)

Unnamed romance (Idol x non-idol)

This one feels like a fever dream because I don't even remember why I came up with it. Anyways, this is suppose to be a slight extension of the erotica. This is another famous person who ends up falling for an accountant after a random encounter he had with him after a concert. The accountant doesn't want to be involved with this celeb for several reasons, but mainly because he's known to sleep around. The celeb is determined and pretty much forces them to have a relationship by hiring him as his new money manager. He pretty much gets him fired from his old job and... that's all I thought of. It's suppose to end up being really cute as the celeb eventually reveals the kind of person he really is, but what that is, I'm not really sure.

Random Tangent

Now that I'm writing this, it does make me think about an abandoned story I wrote where a failing manager falls in love with a client who essentially saves him from losing his career. The erotica and it's extension are already related, and this other unnamed story (I'll call it The Client for now) had a connection as well. Real quick, all these stories are connected to Orange Perfect through Cassie and other relationships. Without giving away major spoilers (just in case) Cassie ends up as someone very influential in the media world by the end. As a college age girl, she's meeting with the Celeb and the Accountant; and, at some point in her journey, she meets and works with the Manager in The Client. Kit knows a ton of people in the industry and knows the Celeb, the Manager, and Cassie who he has a business relationship with. So, it's easy for me to add Pink. Pink could eventually be offered a contract to a major publication, and cross paths with Cassie through some means. There's even a chance for Kit to voice any character in her webcomic, the celeb to make music for it, and even the manager could help her somehow. Sometimes I get really good ideas for things that just are not possible. I would love to have these five stories apart of a collection in this "reality" I made up for them. Ugh. It sucks to not have this as my actual job. Anyways, I thought it would be kind of cool to have all these stories be related.

That might not be everyone, but I often use queer elements in my story so, who knows, maybe I'll update this in the future with more!

But, thanks for reading if you did~🍂

[space-blue]

I love reading your opinions! What about 13, 17? (for any fandom) and 19 for Avatar?

Oh, well, you're making me blush there... (and also sigh with relief, as work was very quiet, and having a long ask to craft was a great distraction, so thank you!)

13 — worst blorboficiation

Mmh, this is a tough one, because I think there's no bad blorbofication. Like I touched on when talking about homogenization, people taking blorbo on crazy trips isn't an issue to me. Maybe a better term here would be woobifying

The best example I can think of within my fandoms is perhaps Thrawn? I'm going through a renaissance with him I guess... I'm watching rebels at long last and I can't wait for him to show up and make the Empire half-competent.

He's a very compelling character, but the new canon gives him an anti-hero slant, which I think is a little unfortunate, as fandom multiplies that into a bit of 'Thrawn did nothing wrong' and 'he's just a cute smartass doing his best'.

But Thrawn shines as a villain. Which he is. He aligns with the Empire for his interests. For the plans he designed. He does orbital bombings and closes his eyes on slavery and is mostly annoyed at the Death Star for being a stupid waste of resources and taking away from his own, better optimised death squadrons! He's. Not. A. Good. Guy. In legends he has a guy killed on his bridge for being incompetent.

And yeah it's the same bridge where this happens:

Now I know my own original First Fic™️ is Thrawn on holidays, and that I put it on hiatus before I got to the War Crimes™️, so it definitely looks like I'm part of that problem. It's just a general trend. Thrawn being cute with Eli. Thrawn being a harmless hottie. Thrawn being relatable. Thrawn saving his people with some hard logic and art appreciation.

Not enough Thrawn being the bad guy he canonically is. There is that out there though and it's great!! So it's not an actual complaint either.

17 — there should be more of this type of fic/art

For fic, actually gender-neutral readers, not fem readers hidden under a "GN Reader" tag. Your reader is not properly gender-neutral if they have curves, lush hair, full lips, etc. sometimes people try and it just slips past them. Sometimes you really feel like they just slapped the tag on without another thought.

It's hard when it comes down to smut, but it's not complicated to be fully neutral when you're dealing with gen fic. Which ties into another thing I'd love more of : second person GN reader fics that aren't smutty/horny but rather gen. I write them because I rarely find them, and I think they're fun. There's definitely an audience for it!

I don't have anything for art. I'm always happy to see people's work and don't have anything in particular I'm searching for when browsing a fandom. Just curious to see what's up, and happy with whatever I get.

19 — you're mad/ashamed/horrified you actually kind of like...

Nice try. I'm not. I like what I like and I don't waste my time with any sort of misplaced shame.

It's not a diss at you! And I understand what prompts this question too. 'Oh no, I never meant to ship it, it's kind of icky, but...' is a common enough sentiment.

Not with me though. If I ship I ship, if I like I like. It's fiction. There's no room for shame or horror.

Thank you for your ask, it was a fun part of a long and empty shift x'D

[divinerivals]

Idk if you're ever gonna see this but did you ever end up writing the Elucien full fic you wanted to make back in April? The one where he meets and startles her late at night. I just couldn't find the link and I really wanted to read it. No worries if it doesn't exist! Just thought I'd ask :)

*Sorry for any typos. I can’t find my glasses and my vision sucks lmao

Hey Love!

I've been sitting on this ask for about a week unsure how to answer. (I didn’t mean to have it sit that long I was busy with Halloween.)  Even though it's a relatively easy answer I wanna take this opportunity to state why my answer is what it is. I made a post a few months back but I can’t locate it.

Wouldn’t be surprised if I upset some people with this response but I need to get it all out. To be honest and transparent (blame the trauma and anxiety hooray!) I’m going to preface this by saying when I say acotar fandom, mention shippers or character stans I don’t mean all of them. I’ve met some amazing people within this fandom who I love to bits, it’s just better to use broader terms. I don’t mean to offended these are just my personal thoughts and how I feel as an individual. If anyone reading this does get offended well that says more about you than me doesn’t it?

Short answer: it’s in my docs. No I don’t have plans to finish it at the moment.

 And here's why aka the long answer:

I am taking a huge step back from acotar. To put it simply, since acosf especially it hasn’t been a good fandom. There's been so much toxicity and immaturity within it. And Its honestly exhausting to see. No matter what social media you're on people are just...well they're ugly about alot of topics. Whether its ship wars, characters, or the story itself. It's just this circle you know? It's not just the E/riels or the Rhys can do no wrong stans. There's negativity in every corner of this fandom. Yes, all fandoms have this. Were all human and we wanna defend what we enjoy and what characters we like. However with the length people go to in this fandom to attack one another is shocking. People will literally chase someone on social media to drag them because of their opinions. I've seen this type of behavior in Harry Potter, Supernatural, Star Wars, Game of Thrones, a little in Stranger Things etc. Name a fandom I’ve seen it. I’ve never seen it to the magnitude that is Acotar. I mean I got dragged for posting a vote for overlays that I’m buying, people have poked fun of Sjm’s kids, bullying artists on insta, fic writers to the point they don’t want to be active anymore, commenting/reblogging fics with how much they hate the ship, among other things. 

Around the time I began working on this fic there was more E/riel, Gwynriel, Elucien drama. On top of my recent experience with the voting this just added to my unhappiness and cause me to realize that I had fallen out of love with this fandom. I didn't wanna write for it. I didn't wanna make edits or posts for it anymore. Because why? Why dedicate my time and energy for such a hateful fandom? You’d think the toxic fans would be tired. But no. It’s always the fans that wanna be active and enjoy the space that become tired. That’s what I am. Tired. I’m over it. I know I’m not the only one. 

I would really love to finish that fic and perhaps one day once I’ve distanced myself for some time and feel good going back I will. I do know what happens and it gets bad before it gets better. Because your ask was so sweet if you want the breakdown/outline of what happens I’d be happy to answer that. Aside from that consider me on hiatus from the acotar fandom. (You can still send me asks about acotar or anything sjm. but as far as original content it’s gonna be a long time.)

[the25thviolence]

Writer Interview Thing

So this weekend I--- Lets roll this back a tad. So the beginning of this week I got super motivated to be creative but I work 4 day weeks of 10 hour shifts.  So I didn’t really time to do anything till now.  I want to finish 3 bits of writing this weekend and this is one of them. 

1. When did you start writing?

Actually writing in this form?  I’m not sure honestly.  I remember as like a teen writing poetry a little and writing my mom like a nice mothers day poem I made up.  She was convinced I took it from somewhere.  

Early writing was based on just too many feelings and or emotions inside of me and just needing a release.  Writing after that was because I could write to someone I cared about.  Which led to the early stages of this kind of writing.  

I actually pushed more into this because way back in the day when people rode around on dinosaurs a guy found some of my very first stories on a blog website.  He thought they were funny which is why some of my stories are the way they are today.  He also hosted my original website and writing for a few years back than. 

2. Favorite story you’ve written?

As the person who picked most these questions I don’t know why I fucking picked this one.  

I’m not sure, I really enjoyed writing the Summer Time Madness part with (Captain) Sean and the Kraken.  I have a huge soft spot for any part of a story where I use the ocean as symbolism for washing someone away.  

3. Favorite character?

I don’t think I remember all my characters to be honest.  It would be an insult to my own creation to not say Sean and the Girl/Princess/Ashley.  They’ve been in my head for over a decade now. 

Currently I really do enjoy Claire and the Baristas though. 

4. Best hidden message in a story you’ve written?

Hidden seems to be an abstract thought to me.  When I feel something is hidden it is apparently very obvious.  And when I feel something is obvious it is not noticed at all.  I think for now my favorite hidden.... You know I haven’t really fleshed this part out, written it, or come to a concrete thought on the matter.  But a certain character mite have connections to the girl from the star character from a very old story of mine.  Well Claire mite have that connection.  I’m not sure yet.  But the stars themselves mite be coming back to my stories. 

5. Why so many spelling and grammer errors? 

Short, because I can.

Long, hmmmm.  I didn’t like grow up smart.  I didn’t really start reading till like the 4th grade but than by the 5th grade I was devouring books.  Do to many personal issues in life (people dying and being extremely poor etc) I didn’t really try to do anything in school.  I graduated high school with one of the lowest possible GPAs because I thought I was going work at mcdonalds after I graduated.  Turns out I was so poor the government gave me money for college and I was able to attend community college and get an associates for free because of that.  The only and most depressing silver lining to having a parent die when your 12 years old. 

Basically I have no real education on the matter of writing.  

Also I can’t draw for shit. 

I can’t sing or make music for shit.  

I can’t paint. 

I can write, anyone can write.  I view writing much like someone would view painting.  Each word but a stroke on the canvas.  And every error or mistake but a drop of paint misplaced.  Now apart of something greater and beyond my control. 

I know its wrong but I heavily prefer my writing be a one shot.  Written once and released into the world.  I have slowly, very slowly, come to terms with editing and proof reading and all that nerd shit.  Its a process I am still heavily refusing to this day. 

Yes, grammer is spelt wrong on purpose you heathens. 

6. Any sneak peaks or future plans for writing?

Hmm

If the Moon can be apart of the story.  

A vessel of power. 

A weapon. 

A dramatic bit of symbolism. 

What of the sun than? 

7. Can you explain “The Void” and “Post Void”? 

Many parts of my life have shoved there whole hand into my chest and squeezed.  Every time it happens it feels worse than the time before.  I would call my high school years a void and everything after a post void.  I would call some years after losing someone I cared about in my twenties a void than post void.  And this rehash of loving people and losing people another void than post void.  Depression is crippling.  Depression has ruined every single tooth inside my mouth.  To the scars on my body to the tattoo on my wrist.  

Simply a void is when life wraps its cold star ridden hands around my neck and holds me still till I either die or stand back up. 

And post void is everything that happens after.  Consequences and all.  Standing back up always comes at a price and I pay it greedily each time. 

8. Does anyone in your family know that you write?

No? I guess some know I scribbled at one point as a hobby.  But no one for sure knows about Once Was A Stranger.  

If anyone is curious as to why.  I don’t trust my family with the deep bits of my existence.  As the youngest of 6 kids nothing I do will ever have a strong meaning. 

9.  “Why am I not a main character?”

I can’t tell if this a question from my good friend twchh or from Sean himself.  Sir, I could never capture your essence in simple words.  God could give me the canopy of the night sky and I still wouldn’t be able to put you into mere words with all that space. 

10. “How much of Once Was A Stranger is actually inspired by/based on reality and how much of it is me misreading it as that.”

Warning: A friend/peer/tortured proof reader asked me this question so I up chucked a metric ton of words on the subject.  This is the last question here and its full of non-organized words. 

This is going to be a really really really long answer and I will try my best to make it as coherent as possible.  I’ve reread this story multiple times to better answer this. 

Its so hard to explain everything without shoving 86 links with 86 different stories down your throat.  Once Was A Stranger was every bit of writing I ever tried to write in my life.  I was finally able to reign in my scatter brain and write a complete story in the style I desired.  I have some small regrets still on some parts.  I had really big expectations for the market scene where the Stranger gives his big speech.  I tried for a really long time to write that part and just couldn’t do it.  Which is why the scene is so.... off center and cuts off.   It works just well enough to fit its role in the story but I wanted so much more from that section of the story. 

I am already off track. 

I’ll start with the characters. 

Sean

Sean for all intensive purposes is my first character.  Like my first character ever.  Sean is a major carry over from my first stories I’ve written.  Why the name? Because I liked it.  Sometimes it reminds me of the Shawn meme from that one video game (SHAWN!).  Sean’s shtick is that he was a thought, a happy little day dream, a fantasy trapped in some girls head.  And he was used by the girl to make herself happy.  But one day he started slowly growing free will and becoming alive.  He would turn against the girl in her dreams trying to escape.  The girl would often “reset” him back to a basic little fantasy but suddenly it didn’t work.  I never finished this story, I knew how it was going to end, but I never finished it.  

Princess

Princess is just the---the girl---every single girl from every story.  Most precisely the girl from Beads that used Sean as an escape inside her own head.  I used to know a person a lifetime ago.  A very very very long lifetime ago.  This character was based off of them and the relationship I had with them. 

Jim

Now this one is funny.  While rereading the story I didn’t realize that this mite be read as a problematic name for people who knew me.  I’m not sure if this was a separate story or a part of Beads (Beads was my first too much for me to handle large scale failed story attempt).  

But Jim is named after an old one off character.  His full name was Jim the goldfish.  Jim the goldfish lived on an alien planet full of goldfish.  Jim’s wife left him and he was drafted into the army to fight in non copyright infringing battle suits (much like gundams but totally not gundams).  In this story the ruling class, the Kardashians (yes, those ones) were battling revolutionaries to keep there power.   They got this power  by abusing the exchange rates between there planet and earth.  And they used that money to get amazing plastic surgery and become famous on earth.   The “Sean” character, a guy in a pair of white nikes drifting thru space (was and still am a huge kid cudi fan) was drifting past this scene in the story.  

Stranger

Once Was A Stranger.   Not much in the story really takes inspiration from my life till the end.  But the title.  The act of writing this story.  The life I breathed into it and the immortal bit of lightning it threw back at me.   The title is very strongly based on events from my life.  Thus he was titled.  For he was a stranger.  Much like myself. 

List of all the references:

Stars: I have a great personal desire to escape life, all of it.  And stars are about as far away as you can get.  I once wrote a story about a fallen star who met a strange boy.  Boy and girl.  Sean and princess, etc.  Boy obviously had problems at home.  Girl was a star exploding with life not wanting to go back to the night sky.  Not that bad of a story I think this still exists and is readable somewhere.

Succulent plants:  A small reference to a person someone tried to make me friends with and the interaction of wanting to own plants but not being capable of keeping them alive so they were suggested to me.  I thought they best fit the character for this story.  Kind of like a foreshadow to Jim having a darker bit of torment inside of him. 

The Actual Moon

Honestly, I have no real clue.  I wanted something great to destroy.  I have more to explore and write about in future stories so I won’t get into too much detail.  Big kid cudi fan (man on the moon).  Its in space and away from here.  Big and bright and in the sky.   Also completely crazy concept to try and fight it.  

King/Princess/Royalty

The girl is referred to as Princess as like an emotional show of importance.  The way the girl from the star story was a star.  And in that same story her father was the morning star always searching for her till the last moment each morning.  The princess had a king.  Someone of authority who did not like the stranger.  What? A girl with a father who didn’t like the boy.  Crazy.  That’s totally never happened to anyone before.  

The napkins in the end scene.

Unicorn/Bear/Mysterious monster

These are all references to old bit of writing pieces or short stories I’ve written.  Sean even notes his white sneakers aka the white nikes story. And this is all a deeper reference to the fact all those stories have long been deleted.  I had a...

I had a. 

A blackhole void consumed my life.  

An irl friend had to come grab me out my house one day to make me move.  

I deleted almost every single part of my online presence because of that.  

Many references in Once Was A Stranger are from long deleted stories. I think I wanted to acknowledge them and pay my respects even though I was the one that deleted those stories.

Repeated phrases/bits

Because I find them entertaining and this was my story.  The telling time by the stars or sun.  Repeated phrases.  Etc etc etc.  My favorite part of Once Was A Stranger was slightly noting the writer was apparent to the characters.   It wasn’t breaking the 4th wall in my opinion because the writer, myself, was in fact also a character in this story.  

Sliding between Sean and Jim and different parts of the story

This was a major shoutout to Beads and to what that story could of been if I was a better writer at the time.  To make it seem like the Princess was trapped between stories.  A turn on the original Beads where Sean was strapped between stories.  

Sean/Jim 

Were they the same?  Different sides of the same coin.  Not to spoil future stories yet to be written too much.  They represented the split between my long time main character. I’m not sure if there any really parallels between nice Jim becoming angry and angry Sean becoming nice.  I think I was in too deep of an emotional space at the time of writing to really know. 

Baristas

I have no idea.  That just sprouted in my brain.  They became apart of the story than proceeded to get there own “spinoff” story.  

Late game writing

Yeah yeah yeah yeah

Yep

You read these parts

I guess I should spell this out. 

Knife.

The void

This all hurts to talk about honestly. 

I’ve been kicking the words for this around in my head lately.  Hoping to write something that would relieve the pain a little.  

I was in love with someone.  It was unrequited.  And it caused a forest of stars to sprout and take root in my heart.  And it made someone very very very close to me hate me.  Hate me so much.  It felt like they stabbed me in my chest with a knife.  Trying to kill the forest of stars inside my heart.  To kill that love.  That unrequited love.  A deep bit of selfishness shared all around.  All because we loved the same person.  

As far as the story is concerned.  Sean, The Stranger, twisted and turned.  And now the knife was in there hand.  New name and all.   

The Ocean

As far back as Beads I have always used the ocean as a way to cleanse.  Clean.  Restart.  Change.  Give birth to.  The ocean is as much life as it is monstrous and uncontrollable.  The ocean cleansed this story and gave a rebirth to the boy and the girl.  Or a death.  They walked purposely into the open arms of the ocean.  

Ashley

This is the shortest answer.  Big fan of Halsey. 

I’m not very good at putting things in order.  Jesus H Christ that much is obvious.  I hope they shined random bits of light on some things. 

This is the end of this bit of writing.  And I am completely open to follow up questions.  I know only one person mite have them but you know how to contact me and scream insanity into my ear. 

[addictedtostorytelling]

CSI Vegas Season 2 is getting 21 episodes. 🫠

Kind of feel hard done by here as a GSR fan - I feel like the reason so many people watched s1 was for Grissom and Sara.

If S1 had as many episodes the whole hodges storyline could have been done so much better - it was rushed towards the end. Not to diss on S1 too much but from what we got I don’t think the writing is worthy of 21 episodes 🫣

hi, anon!

warning: here be salt about the writing from s1 of the reboot. read at your own risk.

__

i think you hit the nail on the head when you said that the writing from s1 wasn't worthy of twenty-one episodes.

like.

i'd be more upset about grissom and sara being "shortchanged" of time in s1 if i actually thought that having more episodes throughout the season would have resulted in better storytelling surrounding them—but the thing is, i don't think that it would have.

they were, a few cute scenes/interactions aside, pretty much wasted in the ten episodes they appeared in, not due to lack of screen-time but due to weak storytelling.

considering that at a most basic level, during s1, the reboot writers didn't even attempt to develop any of their characters, new or old, to say nothing of the fact that they dropped plot threads and created plot holes left and right, they just seemed to lack mastery over the fundamentals of their craft, to the point where i'm not actually sure that even having twice as many episodes to work with would—or, i guess, now will—help them.

like.

even having all the runway in the world won't allow a plane to take off if there's no gas in it.

the writers of the first seven seasons of the original csi could have done all sorts of wonderful things with grissom and sara over the course of twenty-episodes, using the same basic premise of the hodges case.

but i get the sense that even with all of the time in the world, the reboot writers just don't know how to tell a good story.

their instincts just seem poor.

they focus on the wrong things. omit crucial details. fail to achieve any kind of dynamism.

take grissom's landsickness, for example: that plot point was the closest thing either grissom or sara got to experiencing any kind of "personal development" throughout the season, and it was essentially both introduced and resolved in the course of a single episode—not because the writers lacked the time/space to expand it, had they wanted to, but because they literally had no idea where to run with it. there were plenty of scenes where it might have made sense to raise the issue again, showing it getting worse before it got better, actually affecting the course of the hodges investigation and challenging grissom and sara in new ways, etc., but after episode 01x03 "under the skin," it never came to bear in the narrative in any significant way again. it was a totally wasted beat.

—and even if they'd had eleven more episodes available to them, i'm not sure the writers would have done anything differently, just because they didn't seem to know how to "dig in."

having more episodes might help with some of their pacing issues, but it's not going to (necessarily or absolutely) help them write dynamic characters or develop good instincts in terms of what aspects of their narrative merit focus. that's a skillset unto itself, and it's one that, so far, they've not proven that they possess.

i mean, i guess there's a chance that the writing on s2 will be leaps and bounds better than the writing in s1 just because there's more "room to breathe," but i kinda doubt it.

and i'm not watching s2 to find out.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

unless the writers change their general praxis, it's just gonna be more of the same: flat characters, incohesive plotting, and lots of missed opportunities.

/end salt

thanks for the message! please feel welcome to send another any time.

[juvederm]

oversharing, being mentally ill possibly

i genuinely don't know if this is a legitimate phenomenon or not, but i have friends who "IRL" characters (call them delusions at times), and i kind of don't get it. it kinda seems like kinning to me. i described how i felt about my attachment to josh, and my friend related to a T but still called theirs a delusion. and correct me if im wrong but like... aren't delusions something that u don't know is happening... like ur not aware ur being delusional. but my friends seemed very like, aware. complete opposite.

so they tend to get upset when you "double" (meaning like, you kin or "IRL" the same character as them), or shit talk the character in any way. i kind of related to that aspect, just being overly protective of a character. but since my friend related to me, i assumed i had like a safe space to vent abt my actual frustrations with like, having this heavy of an attachment so i'll get into that now.

because josh is like my most liked loved admired character in my arsenal, i always projected onto him. when i was 14-15, i didn't call him a kin, because i didn't exactly relate to his canon version. instead i made a version of him i related to, and he was Literally me at that point. but also not. and comically as time went on, i noticed i was becoming more like his canon version, but also staying like the projection version of him (bc he literally had the same interests as me, same music taste, same fashion sense, same everything). this all snowballed into a weird thing where now he's become apart of my brain. he has like his own thoughts and feelings and opinions, sometimes i say things that he thinks and it gets me in trouble at times. i worry that like he might take over? and that i won't have any original thoughts? even tho this version of him is a mix of canon and projection. like we have to share some of the same thoughts but sometimes it doesn't feel that way. like i differ from him in some ways, for example, he's like a different type of intelligent from me, he likes castlevania and fighting games, etc.

along with this, i also have a sort of gender envy for him. i always wanted to look like him, be socialized the same way he was, have all the same friends as him, like i really wanted to Be him. so i took his name as a start. and it's always been a smack in the face to look in the mirror and not see That. being confronted with a girl reflection.

so i coped pretty hard. it became somewhat dissociative? i don't know if that's the right word, but i genuinely departed from my physical self whenever i'd do my "rituals" (i say this tentatively because i know this is a term used for OCD, which i'm not entirely sure i have or not), and my rituals always had to be the following thing: between 1-4:30 AM, at least an hour long, they had to have a Story, and they had to be Useful. and another thing, absolutely NO LIGHT. and it wasn't like i wanted to do them (i sometimes did), i HAD to do them. i've been very irritable the past few days because i've been missing them (literlaly bc i fixed my sleep schedule loool) and it's just been upsetting me.

it became hard to do anything, i've had these rituals since i was a kid. they always had to do with something i was currently obsessing over. always at night too. nothing really changed there. when i got to high school, i realized i was never going to be josh, or that ideal projection of him. because he was Me but he was also Me If I Did Anything With My Life. but i got to school, i wore the same black hoodie everyday, i didn't talk to anyone, i had my headphones on 24/7. and talking to people physically made me ill. i actually could not do it, because i would have an out of body experience where i would see myself through the eyes of whoever i was talking to, and see myself as who i ACTUALLY was, rather than the person i became during my rituals. and it stressed me out every single day i went to school, and on top of me just being a very slow worker (i cannot do deadlines), having dysphoria and depression, i couldn't Do school anymore. so i dropped out.

and nobody got why i did, i'm still very much judged for my decision but it was for my Own good. i've not been Great but my quality of life definitely improved a little bit after i dropped out. and i hate socializing with people as who i physically am, i hate being perceived when i can't control what i look like (can't start T, can't cut my hair, can't dress masculine), so i'm just a Girl to everyone which isn't necessarily a bad thing. i just want to CONTROL when i feel like a girl, i don't want it to be my natural state because i want to be Both. a girl and a boy. during my rituals, i always feel like a boy. to be honest, i feel like josh. that's the best i can describe it.

and back to my original point, i basically said all of this (although more condensed), and admitted that i disliked that disconnect i had by looking in the mirror and not seeing josh, i think my friend got upset by that? by me saying like, i wasn't who i feel and thought i was, and i think they took it as me saying "ur not (insert character) irl, just look in the mirror" but that's not at all what i was trying to say. i'm not rly defending myself here bc who am i defending myself to? like whoever's reading this is not like, thibking im the villain hopefully

but yeah. anyway. did you pray today

[autisticcassandracain]

ok disclaimer I’m new here and it’s completely possible that I missed some comic that refutes all I’m saying here but like. I just really cannot get over how bad of an identity Black Bat is. I just CANNOT get over it.

It’s not that I hate the idea of Cass moving on from the Batgirl mantle and going solo or anything, far from it! I think legacy mantles like Batgirl are (generally) made to be passed on, and I think that Cass realizing that she doesn’t need it anymore and is ready to strike out and create her own identity could be a really meaningful arc. It’s just. That the way that was done in canon is. Not It. I’m not gonna get into that because that’s a whole different rant I feel even less qualified to make but it sure doesn’t help me like the Black Bat identity for her.

but even separately from the way she acquired it, the Black Bat identity is bland and says little to nothing about Cass. Like, let’s do a rundown of the other major solo batfam identities (minus Red Robin bc I know precisely nothing about Tim): 

Nightwing: as stated by Dick himself in The New Teen Titans: “What’s strange is that both name and costume are based on other people... both mentors... and friends.” Nightwing is a merging of all the people who have made Dick into who he is, most prominently Batman, who trained him and helped him get the skills he needed, and Superman, who gave him his name. While he costume has changed over the years, it’s maintained a sleek, skin-tight look that’s perfect for doing acrobatics in, which is Dick’s signature. 

Oracle: created when writers tried to fridge her and the Joker shot her, Oracle is one of the few disabled superheroes and is a perfect fit for it. ‘Oracle’ as a name immediately conjures up associations with oracles from ancient Greek myth, so it works extremely well with Oracle’s focus on technology, both in the sense that it subverts the expected aesthetic, and that it accurately describes her role as mastermind and information gatherer. It shows off Barbara’s smarts and ingenuity.

Red Hood: was created after Jason came back from the dead and decided to cause problems on purpose, and it shows. Jason took a former alias of his murderer and made it his own, both reclaiming his trauma and signaling his change from morally good to morally gray/bad (depending on writer/interpretation). His main weapon is guns, specifically chosen to signal his opposition to what Batman stands for.

Spoiler: created in opposition to Stephanie’s supervillain dad, Cluemaster. The name ‘Spoiler’ makes a lot of sense when you remember its origins in ‘spoiling’ her father’s plans, and stands out for that reason. Her costume is maximized to preserve her identity, which again, ties back to her origins. 

Signal: a name that ties back to Duke’s mother’s saying that the morning is the best time to see things clearly. As Duke said in Batman & The Signal: “She considered herself the first knight on the battlefield (...) and another word for the first knight out there is... ‘Signal’.” Duke has a unique place in the batfamily as both the first meta and the first daytime hero, and everything about his solo identity reflects that, from the name tying back to the morning light to the bright yellow in his costume. 

As you can see, all of these identities tie back to at least some aspect of the character they’re embodied by. They tell us something about their goals for their superhero persona, about the character’s personality and/or backstory, etc. Even in the event that Red Robin is a garbage identity (which tbh just going by the name I think it very well might be but again, I know nothing about Tim), that still leaves the vast majority of solo identities saying something about the person who created them.

But Black Bat? What does that tell me about Cass? Her costume design isn’t bad, but it’s pretty standard and not extremely unique (except for her cool cape, I’ll give it that). All the name tells me is that 1) she’s kinda edgy, maybe and 2) she’s part of the batfamily. That’s it. That’s literally all it does. 

Black Bat is very obviously an identity that wasn’t the result of someone sitting down and honestly thinking what solo identity would fit Cass the best; it’s the result of someone haphazardly slapping a solo identity onto Cass so that Stephanie could be Batgirl. 

so yeah TL;DR I think Black Bat is a bad identity because it’s generic and tells you little to nothing about Cass. 

[forcebewitht]

Force's Disney Geek Master Theory: Why Twisted Wonderland Is Called Twisted Wonderland

We have all grown to know and love various Disney characters over the years, correct? Yet, I believe a lot of us can argue that not many characters have the same effect on us even as adults today as the Villains do within their respective movies. In the game Disney: Twisted Wonderland as we all know and love, the select boys to Overblot are supposed to have the "souls" of their Villain counterparts, right? But...why is it called "Twisted" Wonderland, then? The truth may lie within something that has been right in front of us all along, my friends: the meaning of a mirror. Ready to buckle in for this one? If so, then here we go!

We have seen all of these guys share character traits, looks, etc with their Disney counterparts, correct? Well, what if I were to tell you that things in terms of the "main" guys that we are supposed to pay attention to aren't exactly what they seem? This could be analyzed in a few different ways, honestly, yet the most prominent way is this: the differences in their personalities- they are reversed. Let us take this bit by bit, shall we?

Ah, yes. The Queen Of Hearts. The ranting, raging, bundle of red, black, and gold we all know and love. (or else heads would roll, I'm sure) One of the things that everybody knows about her is that she's extremely hellbent on the crazy rules that she makes up and is prone to anger honestly very easily. Yeah, you can connect that to Riddle- but think about it for a second. While that rage and the rule thing is still there, it isn't as prominent with him as it was with her, is it? With the Queen of Hearts, her whole "issue" was that she wished to make everybody listen to her and follow her every command- but Riddle was essentially always following the rules of another- not his own. This seemed to make Riddle a little more calm most of the time in terms of how he handled and oversaw things. It wasn't until he actually Overblotted that the "listen to me and only me" thing came out- buuuuuuttttttt I'll get to that part in a bit.

Next: Leona and Scar. While we honestly didn't get to see a lot of what went on behind the scenes in the Outlands in terms of how Scar even met the hyenas to begin with at all, one thing can honestly be said- Scar worked very hard to get where he was. I mean, it's not like you can get an entire pack of rabid, hungry hyenas onto your side in the course of a single day, or maybe even a week (especially as a lion, no less). No, something to that extreme takes careful planning, wording, and stringing along to ensure that nothing goes wrong along the way. The way Scar spoke to Shenzi, Banzai, and Ed made it seem as though he had known them for a looooonngggg time before this- that's where that behind the scenes planning comes in. And then...you have Leona. Leona, from what we can tell in Chapter 2, planned the idea for the "endgame" alright- but he didn't actually act upon any of the plan for himself. Ruggie did. Even in the Lion King, we see that Scar had no problems whatsoever getting his paws dirty a little within his own scheme to take his "rightful place" at the head of Pride Rock- but Leona quite honestly did not a thing once Ruggie was in motion. See where this is starting to head?

Azul and Ursula. Ursula, the Disney baddie queen of my heart Ursula, the Sea Witch. She was known all around the ocean floor for helping out poor little merfolk in secret, wasn't she? Yet, nobody ever really seemed to catch wind of the whole "her turning those who didn't quite fit the bill into polyps" thing, did they? That was one of the things that made her such a honest threat to Ariel herself- because Ursula was cunning. She did things behind the scenes, and sure- we could catch onto it out in the audience (annnddd maybe Sebastian and Flounder as well), but nobody else really seemed to, right? Azul is the complete opposite in this standpoint. He instills direct fear into his "workers" and those even beyond and within his dorm. Like- basically most knew that this dude was bad news to begin with. Azul, mostly, seemed to hide his cunning facade behind a fake yet still seemingly "soft and genuine" smile and act. But all in all, he didn't really attempt to "hide" anything- hell, he even proclaimed his entire plan of what everyone with those things on their heads were gonna do for him in the open! At least when Ursula sang as Vanessa, she was in an almost perfectly enclosed room with nobody else around.

Jamil and Jafar. This comparison here, given what occurs in the movie Aladdin, is honestly one of the biggest possible indicators of this reoccuring theme I shall clarify in a bit. Jafar, while being sneaky, was known for being a more "out there" Disney Villain in terms of his personality alongside that of his partner Iago in the film. He would smile in a sinister way, he would crack jokes out in the open, and let us not forget his crazed yet oddly interesting laughter. Jamil? He's the exact opposite. Given his past and what he has had to dealt with growing up with Kalim, he is much more reserved and barely releases a chuckle or cracks a smile at all. His personality is a lot more repressed than that of Jafar himself throughout the film. Jamil has been so used to having to hold himself back thanks to his parents in favor of Kalim's family, he doesn't seem to know how to "let go" whatsoever. Yet Jafar, while still maintaining that sneaky side of him as well, has no problems whatsoever letting a little hang loose whenever he so chooses to.

Vil and the Evil Queen. This one honestly may be a bit more self explanatory than the others- but the difference between these two is their expressions of themselves. The Evil Queen was the very first animated counted Disney Villain within Disney's history- yet, she barely had any lines throughout the film at all. Her ranges of expression were almost little to none thanks to the era in which the movie was released in- but she always looked like she was pissed, huh? Vil is the exact opposite of her in this sense. He is able to fully express himself through his various facial expressions, theatrical abilities, musical experiences, fashion style, and even how he behaves. Vil is able to do so much more than the Evil Queen did or could do within that time period, that it's almost a little staggering if you fully picture it.

Idia and Hades. Now, now. We haven't honestly seen too much of the flaming blue boy yet in TWST, but one thing is apparent here right off the bat- in terms of his personality? He is the exact opposite of Hades. Idia is much like Jamil but to a more "geek" degree- he's extremely introverted, shy, a bit snippy, yet mainly keeps to himself and his gaming tech. Hades is most often renowned as the Disney Villain with the most personality- and the best humor. Hades has no problem whatsoever being "out there" with his crazy puns, sassy remarks, anger, and even mocking behavior. I mean, please, guys- I haven't been this choked up since I got a hunk of moussaka caught in my throat!

Finally, Malleus and Maleficent. Ooooohoooooooo boy. We have to count out the live action movie Maleficent for this one (sorry horned queen fans). One thing that basically everybody even with their toe in the water in that of Disney movies kind of knows this fact- Maleficent is c r u el. She's got a bizarre set of dark powers and an even blacker heart than that. Hell, we basically had to "soften her up" a little bit in Maleficent thanks to just how seemingly irredeemable her character is in that of Sleeping Beauty. I mean, c'mon now- cursing an infant? And we get no explanation for that in the original? C'mon, now. Anyways, Malleus? As we all can tell by now, this dude is the compleeettteeeeeee opposite. Sure, he has those repressed bits here and there too, but it is evident that this dude has a heart crying out for the MC and it is big, bold, and golden to the core once you look past how he looks. He sent the MC a card for winter break, for crying out loud. Yeah, let me know the next time you see Maleficent do that smh.

Now, I have avoided using a certain word up until this point to see if anybody could catch on to what exactly is happening here. Did you figure it out? Reverse. The boys that either have Overblotted already or intend to Overblot soon stop holding out on us, Chapter 6 have had the exact opposite personalities compared to that of their Villain counterpart- until one prime point in their "character arcs". Their Overblot.

Riddle wished to have all bow before him and obey his rules.

Leona led his entire dorm into ruin and nearly sanded away the entire school in the process.

Azul let himself finally free of his personal shackles entirely and "took what was his".

Jamil finally let himself go and opened up more in his personality, almost seeming to be driven insane in the process.

Vil wanted to become the most beautiful one of all and would kill anyone within the way of that goal without any hesitation whatsoever.

The moment that the boys' Overblotted, that was the exact moment when the "soul" of their Disney Villain counterpart took control. Keeping that idea in mind, that should mean that this will happen in the upcoming chapters and their Overblots:

Idia will show off all of the personality, powers, and intelligence that he has been keeping down within this introverted self of his.

Malleus will become so broken by being left out and alone in the cold for the final time that he will turn into a completely cruel Fae and possibly nearly kill either the MC or the representation of Prince Philip within that Chapter in the process.

(Hello, my dear Readers! Guess who is trying to get back into her bigger pieces of writing? This gal right here~ feel free to drop a comment and tell me what you think of this theory- I'd love to hear your thoughts! 💕)

[itsclydebitches]

I keep seeing people calling Good Omens queer bating and a I can't help but ask why? I read the Aziraphale/Crowley relationship threw an Ace lens and they are clearly as close to married as they are probably going to get without stepping on holy ground.... and they love each other... why is it considered queer bating?

Personally, I think it's mostly young queer fans turning legitimate grievances on the wrong target. A case of getting so fed up with queerbaiting in media as a whole that they're instinctually lashing out at anything that seems to resembles it on the surface, without taking the time to consider whether this is, in fact, the thing they're mad at. Good Omens is a scapegoat, if you will. The equivalent of snapping at your partner after a long day. Your friend was an asshole, your boss was an asshole, the guy in traffic was an asshole, and then you come home to your partner who says something teasing and you take it as another asshole comment because you've just been surrounded by assholeness all day, to the point where your brain is primed to see an attack. Your partner wasn't actually an asshole, but by this point you're (understandably) too on guard to realize that. Unless someone sits you down and kindly reminds you of the difference between playful teasing and a legitimate insult - the nuance, if you will - your hackles are just gonna stay up and you'll leave the room, off to phone a different friend to tell them all about how your partner was definitely an asshole to you.

Only in this case, that "friend" is a fan on social media doing think pieces on the supposed queerbaiting of Good Omens, spreading that idea to a) people who aren't familiar with the show themselves and b) those who, like that original fan, have come to expect queerbaiting and thus aren't inclined to question the latest story with that mark leveled against it. Because on the surface Good Omens can look a lot like queerbaiting. Here are two queer coded characters who clearly love each other, but don't say "I love you," don't kiss, don't "prove" that love in a particular way. So Gaiman is just leading everyone on, right?

Well... no. This is where the nuance comes in, the thing that many fans aren't interested in grappling with (because, like it or not, media is not made up of black and white categories; queerbaited and not-queerbaited. Supernatural's finale is proof enough of that...) I won't delve into the most detailed explanation here, but suffice to say:

Gaiman has straight up said it's a love story. He's just not giving them concrete labels like "gay" or "bi" or "asexual," etc. because they are literally not human. Gaiman has subscribed to an inclusive viewpoint in an era where fans are desperate for unambiguous rep that homophobes cannot possibly deny. The freedom to prioritize any interpretation - yes, including a "just friends" interpretation - now, in 2021, feels like a cop-out. However, in this case it's an act of world building (they are an angel and a demon, not bound by human understanding of identity) meeting a genuine desire to make these characters relatable to the entire queer community, not just particular subsets. Gaiman has said they can be whatever we want because the gender, sexuality, and romantic attraction of an angel and a demon is totally up for debate! However, some fans have interpreted that as a dismissal of canonical queerness; the idea that fans can pretend they're whatever they want... but it's definitely not canon. It is though. Them being queer is 100% canon, it's just up to us to decide what kind of queer they are. This isn't Gaiman stringing audiences along, it's him opening the relationship up to all queer possibilities.

We know he's not stringing us along (queerbaiting) because up until just a few days ago season two didn't exist. Queerbaiting is a deliberate strategy to maintain an audience. A miniseries does not need to maintain its audience. You binge it in one go and you're done, no coming back next year required. The announcement for season two doesn't erase that context for season one. No one knew there would be more content and thus the idea that they would implement a strategy designed to keep viewers hooked due to the hope for a queer relationship (with no intent to follow through) is... silly.

In addition, this interpretive, queer relationship between Crowley and Aziraphale existed in the book thirty years ago. Many fans are not considering the difference between creating a totally new story in 2019 and faithfully adapting a story from 1990 in 2019. Good Omens as representation meant something very different back then and that absolutely impacts how we see its adaptation onto the small screen. To put this into perspective, Rowling made HUGE waves when she revealed that she "thought of" Dumbledore as gay in an interview... in 2007. Compare that to the intense coding 17 years before. Gaiman was - and still is - pushing boundaries.

Which includes being an established ally, particularly in his comics. Queerbaiting isn't just the act of a single work, but the way an author approaches their work. Gaiman does not (to my knowledge) have that mark against him and even if he did, he's done enough other work to offset that.

Finally, we've got other, practical issues like: how do you represent asexuality on the screen? How do you show an absence of something? Yeah, one or both of them could claim that label in the show, outright saying, "I'm asexual," but again, Gaimain isn't looking to box his mythological figures into a single identity. So if we want that rep... we have to grapple with the fact that this is one option for what it looks like.

Even if he did want to narrow the representation down to just a few identities for the show, should Gaiman really be making those major changes when he's only one half of the author team? Pratchett has, sadly, passed on and thus obviously has no say in whether his characters undergo such revisions. Even if fans hate every other argument, they should understand that, out of respect, Good Omens is going to largely remain the same story it was 30 years ago.

And those 6,000 years are just the beginning! Again, this was meant to be a miniseries of a single novel, a novel that, crucially, covered only Crowley and Aziraphale's triumph in being able to love one another freely. That's a part of their personal journey. Yeah, they've been together in one sense for 6,000 years, but that was always with hell and heaven on their backs, to say nothing of the slow-burn approach towards acknowledging that love, for Aziraphale in particular. We end the story at the start of their new relationship, one that is more free and open than it ever was before. They can be anything to one another now! The fact that we don't see that isn't a deliberate attempt on the author's part to deny us that representation, but only a result of the story ending.

So yeah, there's a lot to consider and, frankly, I don't think those fans are considering it. Which on a purely emotional level I can understand. I'm pissed about queerbaiting too and the knee-jerk desire to reject anything that doesn't meet a specific standard is understandable. But understandable doesn't mean we don't have to work against that instinct because doing otherwise is harmful in the long run. We need to consider when stories were published and what representation meant back then. We need to consider how we adapt those stories for a modern audience. We need to acknowledge that if we want the inclusivity that "queer" provides us, that includes getting characters whose identity is not strictly defined by the author as well as characters with overtly canonical labels. We need both. We likewise need to be careful about when having higher standards ends up hurting the wrong authors - who are our imperfect allies vs. those straight up unwilling to embrace our community at all? And most importantly, we have to think about how we're using the terms we've developed to discuss these issues. Queerbaiting means something specific and applying it to Good Omens not only does Good Omens a disservice, but it undermines the intended meaning of "queerbaiting," making it harder to use correctly in the future. Good Omens is not queerbaiting and trying to claim it is only hurts the community those fans are speaking up for.

[firelxdykatara]

I’m just really confused as to where this idea that Zuko is gaycoded came from. Like people are allowed to have that headcanon but I don’t understand where people are coming from when they try and claim that he was undisputedly gaycoded and trying to deny it is homophobic when he’s only ever shown romantic interest in women.

I made a pretty long post on the topic a while back, but the ultimate gist of it is this: there are a lot of elements of Zuko's status as an abuse victim and trauma survivor that resonate with queer folks. This is understandable and completely fine! However, there are some parts of the fandom who have taken that to the other extreme and will now insist that those elements are uniquely queer, and that they can only be read as some sort of veiled gay/coming out narrative, even though that doesn't make much sense since there is no part of Zuko's narrative which is unique to any sort of queer experience.

I think the problem really does stem from two things being conflated--Zuko's history of abuse and trauma, and trauma&abuse being something a lot of queer people have experienced. I suspect it goes something like 'I see a lot of myself in Zuko, and I was abused for being gay, therefore Zuko must be gay too in order to have had similar experiences.' This can then lead to feeling dismissed or invalidated when other people point out that those experiences are not unique to being queer--but on the flip side, abuse victims and trauma survivors whose abuse&trauma do not stem from queerness (even if they are queer themselves) can feel invalidated and dismissed by the implication that their trauma must be connected to their queerness or it isn't valid.

This is also where the 'people don't actually know what gay coded means' part comes in, and I realize now that I didn't actually get into what gay coding (and queer coding in general) actually means, since I was so hung up on pointing out how Zuko doesn't really fit the mold. (And the few elements that exist which could be said to count are because of the 'villains historically get queer coded bc Hays Code era' thing and mostly occur in Book 1, not because of how he acts as an abuse&trauma survivor.)

Under a cut because I kind of go on a tangent about gay/queer coding, but I swear I get back to the point eventually.

Queer coding (and it is notable that, with respect to Zuko, it is almost always framed as 'he couldn't possibly be attracted to girls', rather than 'he could be attracted to boys as well as girls' in these discussions, for... no real discernible reason, but I'll get into that in a bit) is the practice of giving characters 'stereotypically queer' traits and characteristics to 'slide them under the radar' in an era where having explicitly queer characters on screen was not allowed, unless they were evil or otherwise narratively punished for their queerness. (See: the extant history of villains being queer-coded, because if they were Evil then it was ok to make them 'look gay', since the story wasn't going to be rewarding their queerness and making audiences think it was in any way OK.) This is thanks to the Motion Picture Production Code (colloquially and more popularly known as the Hays Code), which was a set of guidelines which movies coming out of any major studio had to adhere to in order to be slated for public release and lasted from the early 1930s until it was finally abandoned in the late 60s.

The Hays Code essentially existed to ensure that the content of major motion pictures would not 'lower the moral standards' of the viewing public. It didn't just have to do with queerness--cursing was heavily monitored, sex outside of marriage was not allowed to be seen as desirable or tittilating, miscegenation was not allowed (most specifically interracial relationships between black and white people), criminals had to be punished lest the audience think that it was ok to be gay and do crime, etc. Since same-sex relations fell under 'sexual perversion', they could not be shown unless the 'perversion' were punished in some way. (This is also the origin of the Bury Your Gays trope, another term that is widely misunderstood and misapplied today.) To get around this, queer coding became the practice by which movies and television could depict queer people but not really, and it also became customary to give villains this coding even more overtly, since they would get punished by the end of the film or series anyway and there was nothing to lose by making them flamboyant and racy/overly sexual/promiscuous.

Over time, this practice of making villains flamboyant, sexually aggressive, &etc became somewhat separated from its origins in queer coding, by which I mean that these traits and tropes became the go-to for villains even when the creator had no real intention of making them seem queer. This is how you generally get unintentional queer-coding--because these traits that have been given to villains for decades have roots in coding, but people tend to go right to them when it comes to creating their villains without considering where they came from.

Even after the Hays Code was abandoned, the sentiments and practices remained. Having queer characters who weren't punished by the narrative for being queer was exceptionally rare, and it really isn't until the last fifteen or so years that we've seen any pushback against that. Buffy the Vampire Slayer is famous for being one of the first shows on primetime television to feature an explicitly gay relationship on-screen, and that relationship ended in one of the most painful instances of Bury Your Gays that I have ever personally witnessed. (Something that, fourteen years later, The 100 would visually and textually reference with Lexa's death. Getting hit by a bullet intended for someone else after a night of finally getting to be happy and have sex with her s/o? It wasn't remotely subtle. I don't even like Clexa, but that was incredibly rough to witness.)

However, bringing this back to Zuko, he really doesn't fit the criteria for queer coding for a number of reasons. First of all, no one behind the scenes (mostly a bunch of cishet men) was at all intending to include queer rep in the show. This wasn't a case where they were like 'well, we really wanted to make Zuko gay, but we couldn't get that past the censors, so here are a few winks and a nudge', because it just wasn't on their radar at all. Which makes sense--it wasn't on most radars in that era of children's programming. This isn't really an indictment, it's just a fact of the time--in the mid/late 00s, no one was really thinking about putting queer characters in children's cartoons. People were barely beginning to include them in more teen- and adult-oriented television and movies. It just wasn't something that a couple of straight men, who were creating a fantasy series aimed at young kids, were going to think about.

What few instances you can point to from the series where Zuko might be considered to exhibit coding largely happen in Book 1, when he was a villain, because the writers were drawing from typically villainous traits that had historically come from queer coding villains and had since passed into common usage as villainous traits. But they weren't done with any intention of making it seem like Zuko might be attracted to boys.

And, again, what people actually point to as 'evidence' of Zuko being queer-coded--his awkwardness on his date with Jin and his confrontation with Ozai being the big ones I can think of off the top of my head--are actually just... traits that come from his history of trauma and abuse.

As I said in that old post:

making [zuko’s confrontation of ozai] about zuko being gay and rejecting ozai’s homophobia, rather than zuko learning fundamental truths about the world and about his home and about how there was something deeply wrong with his nation that needed to be fixed in order for the world to heal (and, no, ‘homophobia’ is not the answer to ‘what is wrong with the fire nation’, i’m still fucking pissed at bryke about that), misses the entire point of his character arc. this is the culmination of zuko realizing that he should never have had to earn his father’s love, because that should have been unconditional from the start. this is zuko realizing that he was not at fault for his father’s abuse--that speaking out of turn in a war meeting in no way justified fighting a duel with a child.

is that first realization (that a parent’s love should be unconditional, and if it isn’t, then that is the parent’s fault and not the child’s) something that queer kids in homophobic households/families can relate to? of course it is. but it’s also something that every other abused kid, straight kids and even queer kids who were abused for other reasons before they even knew they were anything other than cishet, can relate to as well. in that respect, it is not a uniquely queer experience, nor is it a uniquely queer story, and zuko not being attracted to girls (which is what a lot of it seems to boil down to, at the end of the day--cutting down zuko’s potential ships so that only zukka and a few far more niche ships are left standing) is not necessary to his character arc. nor does it particularly make sense.

And, regarding his date with Jin:

(and before anyone brings up his date with jin--a) he enjoyed it when she kissed him, and b) he was a traumatized, abused child going out on a first date. of course he was fucking awkward. have you ever met a teenage boy????)

Zuko is socially awkward and maladjusted because he was abused by his father as a child and has trouble relating to people as a result. He was heavily traumatized and brutally physically injured as a teenager, and it took him years to begin to truly recover from the scars that left on his psyche (and it's highly likely, despite the strides he made in canon, that he has a long way to go, post series; it's such a pity that we never got any continuation comics >.>). He was not abused for being gay or queer--he was abused because his father believed he was weak, and part of Zuko's journey was realizing that his father's perception of strength was flawed at its core. That his entire nation had rotted from the inside out, and the regime needed to be changed in order for the world--including his people--to begin to heal.

That could be commingled with a coming out narrative, which is completely fine for headcanons (although I personally prefer not to, because, again, we have more than enough queer trauma already), but it simply doesn't exist in canon. Zuko was not abused or traumatized for being queer, and his confrontation with Ozai was not about him coming out or realizing any fundamental truth about himself--it was about realizing something fundamental about his father and his nation, and making the choice to leave them behind so that he could help the Avatar grow stronger and force things to change when he got back.

TL;DR: at the end of the day, none of the traits, scenes, or behavior Zuko exhibits which shippers tend to use to claim he was gay-coded are actually evidence of coding--they aren't uniquely queer experiences, as they stem from abuse that was not related in any way to his sexuality, and they are experiences that any kid who suffered similar abuse or trauma could recognize and resonate with. (Including straight kids, and queer kids who were abused for any reason other than their identity.) And, finally, Zuko can be queer without erasing or invalidating his canon attraction to girls, and it's endlessly frustrating that the 'Zuko is gay-coded' crowd refuses to acknowledge that.

[thickenmyblood]

hey maca :)) I have sth that I’d love to hear your input on! (wall of text incoming so beware- I’m absolutely not mad if you don’t want to answer lmao). Basically it’s about how you portray women in your works and to what extent you see that portrayal mirrored in the canon books. I have noticed that a lot of writers tend to go a traditional route with for example daughters not being heirs like you also mentioned in an answer for a wtsioa ask on here. Considering the cultures Vere and Akielos are based on that’s obviously very logical and a lot of authors (including you) make it work fantastically! Yet personally I never got the vibe of Vere and Akielos being as patriarchal in canon, mostly because the Information we get is kind of confusing. On one hand damen is a walking manosphere (and. all of Akielos in general as well) without any prominent female figures in his life but on the other hand damen only ever speaks appreciatively of for example the female vaskian warriors. Both countries seem to ban women from the army yet Damen also refers to a warrior queen. The regent is a total misogynist but with the wording Laurent uses it almost seems like that is more the exception and not the general rule of veretian court life. Both countries also have ties to Vask, an exclusive matriarchy and Akielos is said to be similar to Patras which Pacat has stated is also partly a strong matriarchy due to vaskian occupations in the past. I could go on for a lot longer but I guess that damens overall positive attitude towards women and especially stereotypically spoken masculine women is what sticks out the most to me. It just seems kind of misplaced in a world that supposedly is as sexist as the original cultures from our world. Which is why I’d say both countries do have gender roles but are overall a lot more egalitarian than their respective real world og cultures. But that’s only my take and I’d love to hear more on what others think about the portrayal of women in canon and how they chose to portray it in fanfiction. Love you and your new work, hope you’re doing well❤️

HELLO!!! Thank you for asking me interesting stuff :, ) you always have the best questions and my sad little inbox is open to you any time, friend. I divided this into parts, so:

My portrayal of women: I need to work on this a lot lmao. I’m not proud of any female character I have ever written for this fandom, and I’m also not proud to say I struggle horribly when it comes to writing female OCs, especially if the story is not about a female character that is a literal projection of me. Or Bella Swan (yes, Twilight literally shaped my sad little brain and the way I write and consume fiction).

Authors writing female characters in a “traditional” way (for fantasy settings): I can’t speak for other authors but I definitely think, in my case, that using the “it’s a patriarchal society, women have no rights, women can’t be heirs, etc.” blueprint is a matter of being lazy. It’s quick, and easy, and it’s been done before so we all know how it works and a) it’s unlikely that you’ll mess it up (in the plot hole kind of way) and b) it’s obvious that most readers know how the usual system works and so you don’t have to spend paragraphs or even chapters explaining it to them. I am very lazy when it comes to world-building for fics. Why? Because when I’m writing fanfiction I don’t give two shits about the world, I just care about the characters doing Things and having Feelings. The moment you start to question these issues (a society where women can join the army, where they can be heirs, where maybe they can have multiple husbands, etc.) a billion issues arise because it’s not the “usual way” and so you’ll have to deal with “unusual problems”. See: plot holes, info-dumping, etc.

Vere and Akielos in canon: I think the books get very, very confusing at times when it comes to gender roles in that specific world. They also get very confusing about how royalty works, in my opinion. So:

Damen never mentions female influences in his life, not even nannies or wetnurses or anything. He mentions past queens and his mother, but even then… It’s always struck me as “what the actual fuck” that we get no information on Egeria. In TSP, he doesn’t even read as curious to me, especially when I think of that line that goes something like “oh, well, he’d never asked how tall she was”.

Then you have Jokaste, who is highborn and also… perhaps trained in politics? It’s unclear to me if she’s ever been directly involved in meetings or been an active member of the Council or even been allowed to study these issues. Clearly, she’s smart and capable and cunning, but like… how? Did she have private tutors? Is she a self-made woman? Like, what’s up with that? Are women allowed to engage in public politics? Are they allowed to be kyroi?

IMO, Damen complimenting the female warriors in Vask has to do with how appreciative he is of war-related stuff. Like, he thinks people with his own qualities are neat. We see this time and time again in the books—having honor, being brave, respecting one’s family, protecting those who need protecting… He compliments these things when he sees them in others, especially in Laurent. Obviously one of the big changes in Damen as a character is that he goes from being daddy’s boy to being like “well, actually… maybe war isn’t always the answer, and maybe war isn’t always honorable”. The Vaskian warriors prove themselves worthy of praise in a “manly” way, if that makes sense. (In the same way, Laurent proves himself in the Okton, not so much to Damen but to other Akielons). So, in essence, War > Any issues he may have about women doing Stuff.

Don’t judge me for this but I can’t remember the Regent talking about women. Do you have any quotes about that? I feel like Book 1 is super rich when it comes to world-building stuff and yet it’s the book I remember the least. I know he obviously has a preference for boys and not girls, but I don’t recall him having interactions with Vannes or ladies at court? I’M SORRY I’M SO STUPID but I don’t own the book so I can’t exactly word search my way out of this one, and so instead of saying stupid stuff, I’m asking anyone reading this (lol, you and my mom probably) to please tell me what canon says on this issue.

Ties to Vask: Er, yeah, I mean… They’re clearly not at war with Vask and have some sort of economic deal (there are Vaskian pets in Arles? Which makes me wonder if they, like, buy them from Vask? Or if the pets are Vaskian and turn into pets in Vere? Slaves are not like pets so I don’t know?), BUT just because they have deals with this kingdom/are on good terms with the ruler does not mean they necessarily approve? Like, maybe they’re like “yeah, it’s weird they give women so much power, but also I need that silk/leather/WHATEVER, so I’ll shut up about that”.

“Akielos is said to be similar to Patras which Pacat has stated is also partly a strong matriarchy due to Vaskian occupations in the past.” Is this in the books or is this something she said in an interview/post-releasing the trilogy? I know in the books there’s a quote that Akielos and Patras are similar because they both have slaves, but other than that I can’t quite remember anything about Patras? Like, I don’t recall Pacat giving us extensive and thorough world-building on either nation, at all. Once again, I am asking you for more explanations on this because I literally don’t remember.

4. My opinion and a Stupidity Disclaimer: As I’ve said above, there’s a lot of stuff I don’t remember and so I’m not trying to preach to anyone reading this or even saying that I hold the truth about… anything. I’m answering questions as I see fit and asking more questions when I run out of answers.

I believe world-building is not one of Captive Prince’s strong points. I will not elaborate on this because this is already long enough but there is simply, in my opinion, not enough material to reach any solid conclusions when it comes to world-building questions such as the role of women in Vere and Akielos, how compulsory homosexuality affects the development of highborn men and women in Vere, exactly what makes Akielos’ view on women different from Vere’s (if there’s any difference at all), the history of gender roles in this world and how it’s evolved up until canon, how Lamen can solve the heir issue without recurring to, once again, “the usual stuff” (concubines, bastards, marriage to women, etc.). It’s clear from what I’ve read that Pacat has come a long way as a writer and that her new trilogy has a lot more in-depth explanations to world-building questions, but this is not the case with CP, and so I’m afraid my answer to most of this is “I don’t know, and I don’t think anyone can know for sure”.

Lastly, I think I struggle a lot with understanding the role of women in this universe because I simply did not see enough women doing stuff, so I don’t know what’s permitted, what’s unacceptable, what’s illegal, what is straight-up execution worthy, etc. This is not me complaining about the lack of female characters in CP, at all, which I know is contradictory to stuff I’ve said in the past (I answered a couple asks a year ago about how I’d wished we’d gotten Vannes’ POV or Jokaste’s POV in the short stories). I’ve changed my mind, and so I think Pacat is entitled to write whatever she wants, just like I’m entitled to talk shit about KR with any living soul who will listen lmao.

To end this on a spicy note, I think sometimes we consume the wrong media and then complain because it doesn’t have what we wanted. If you’re looking for a trilogy with strong, fleshed-out female characters, Captive Prince is not for you. If you’re looking for a trilogy on female struggles and, I don’t know, defying… the male gaze… Captive Prince is not for you. There are plenty of books out there that focus exclusively on female characters, featuring sapphic relationships, and dealing with gender issues. WHICH IS NOT TO SAY WE SHOULDN’T BE HAVING THESE DISCUSSIONS. This is not about this particular question, but more about a lot of posts I’ve seen floating around… complaining about Pacat’s writing and the themes she didn’t explore.

If anyone has made it this far, thank you for reading, and know this is NOT me telling you what to think. This post is an open question that anyone can engage with, although I hope people will engage with this directly and on this platform, instead of… taking it somewhere else where I sadly can’t engage back! Unlike what happened with our awesome fat Laurent discussion, I will be replying to any questions I get on this (Note: I did not reply to most of those questions because a long time had passed and they were sort of repetitive).

[bigskydreaming]

Something else to keep in mind is the way things compound? Like for instance, I’ve seen a mini trend of fics lately focusing on the issue of Dick dropping out of college or not wanting to go, which for the record, I feel is another way of building up to the idea that he and Bruce have all these fights during this period that are two way streets instead of like....what canon actually was (reminder that in the canon that Dick actually dropped out he and Bruce actually were never really NOT on good terms, like there’s never been a big fight in the comics about this topic so.....incheresting).

But anyway, my point is its worth keeping in mind that how you frame something at one point in a narrative like.....ideally, you want it to mesh up and align with other things you’ve brought up throughout the narrative, and not accidentally contradict yourself narratively.

I mean, this is really the big gripe most Dick Grayson fans have with his fanon characterization overall:

The fact that it just doesn’t make sense.

In Jason-centric fics that are after his resurrection, how often is Jason utterly convinced that Dick can’t even wipe his ass without Bruce��s approval? And yet in Jason-centric fics that are before his death, how often is Jason thinking about how Dick and Bruce are constantly fighting and Bruce can’t seem to do anything without Dick objecting? Reconcile these two things. They make no sense.

Same thing with fics that talk about Dick being the emotional glue of the family, the one keeping a cool head to calm down everyone else when they’re all taking shots at each other.....until randomly he just pops off without warning because he’s just that hot-tempered. These things mesh, how?

Same thing with Dick being frequently referenced as idealized by the hero community......but every time he interacts with someone like Roy or Kori or other Titans he can’t seem to avoid pissing them off and creating epic grudges. Make it make sense.

Or how Dick disliked or didn’t care about Jason to the extent that he only references him as a cautionary tale because of one line in canon......but the whole damn story where he kills the Joker because of Jason doesn’t count.

Or how its not okay to blame Dick for his own rapes but both of his major breakups which are intrinsically linked to the actions of his rapists like....were clearly and objectively all his fault somehow.

Dick Grayson fans aren’t on board with most of fanon because you can’t sell people on a constantly conflicting characterization that makes no sense and has no internal consistency.....you can only cater to people who don’t NEED to be sold on that because they’ve already decided they’re down with hating a character or largely ignoring him.

And I think people have gotten so used to not thinking twice about contradictory takes on Dick Grayson that they unintentionally undermine their own fics by contradicting themselves without even realizing it.

Like its ridiculously common to come across fics that reference Dick being beloved and charming everyone at the society galas they all have to go to.....but these fics take pot shots at Dick’s name, fashion, mannerisms etc all throughout it just because the author likes it or fans expect it or whatever reason.

But actually THINK about it:

Think how snobby the socialites at these galas are characterized as being any time its Jason their noses are turned down at.....and then look at like.....the constant jokes you as the author make YOURSELF at Dick’s very name, fashion and circus origins......how on Earth does it make ANY sense that these same people aren’t doing the same damn thing about Dick? That they’re actually any more fond of him than they are Jason, if no matter how charming he might be in the moment, the second he turns around its just as easy and likely for them to make a joke about his circus background or name as it is for writers and readers? If you can’t resist doing it, you really think snobby one percenters would bother in-universe?

Hell, they’d be more likely to hate him BECAUSE of his name, his fashion, etc.....because think of how often people not so subtly infer that he’s making a bad choice when he refuses to go by a different name, or dress more accordingly to normal fashions, etc.....

Dick has a million ways he could more easily fit in with the society he was brought into and ease his passage through it, but he puts his foot down at practically every opportunity. The idea that everybody is just dazzled by him at these galas makes no sense because the most consistent character choice made by Dick throughout the decades is that he refuses to CONFORM to others’ expectations of what he should be like. 

EVERY SINGLE CHOICE he makes from his name to his wardrobe to his costumes to his education to his city to his living arrangements and on and on is in complete and utter DEFIANCE of what people expect of the eldest son or ward of Bruce Wayne, Prince of Gotham, and that’s by Dick’s conscious and consistent choice. He knows damn well how to be more what people want or expect of him, and that’s not what he wants so he says mmmm but also how bout no.

Dick constantly embodies the idea that you can take the boy out of the circus but you can not and will not take the circus out of the boy no matter what environment you place him in or who you surround him with. He will not allow it. He will not play along.

In what universe is that going to endear him to the very people who would most likely view his choice to prioritize the very things they look down upon as something he consciously PREFERS over their projected expectations or assumptions?

Its not.

Personally, I think Gotham high society despises Dick Grayson no matter what they pretend to his face, and he’s perfectly aware of it. And probably gets some kind of trollish glee out of it because fuck them too, anyway.

(And all of that is WITHOUT even taking into account the fact that a good number of the people at these society galas all along were looking at Dick as their future property, given that they were Owl members who knew all along what they intended for their Gray Son. These people simply do not view and treat Dick as an equal. Its impossible. There’s no way).

Or then back to the idea of Bruce and Dick’s fights in his later teenage years being a two way street....

The core problem at the root of all this is the very idea of a two way street implies a certain give and take. A clashing of equals.

And that’s just not the reality in ANY continuity.

Because the question is, in any given fight between Dick and Bruce in ANY canon....

When does Dick ever WIN these fights?

When does Dick get the outcome he wants OVER what Bruce wants? When does Bruce ever cave? When is it NOT Dick leaving the manor without getting what he came for, or even being kicked out? When has Dick ever been able to say no, I’m NOT fired, or no, I’m NOT giving you control over what happens with Robin. Even when he DOES confront Bruce on these matters, Bruce STILL infamously never caves. He never actually apologizes or admits wrongdoing, he still usually tells Dick to leave. Like I said, basically the only time Dick’s ever got the upper hand in an argument was over the college thing and that time it wasn’t even a fight! Bruce didn’t actually care that much! That was the good timeline! LOL.

But there’s never actually a reversal. There’s no real precedent for Bruce caving to a teenage Dick Grayson and saying hey you know what, you’re right here, I’m overstepping or I’m in the wrong or I’m the one who doesn’t know what he’s talking about because our divergent life experiences here have mine as less relevant to the issue in question than yours do?

It doesn’t happen.

And here’s the problem with that:

Dick’s a literal genius. Every member of the Batfam is. Its how they’re able to do what they do. They’re ALL smart as fuck, capable as fuck. Put any of them in any other situation where they’re the only Bat present, and everyone usually defaults to them. They know what to do, they know what call to make, their approach is borne out by the narrative as being the correct approach. Their intelligence and strategy is validated by the narrative, with Dick being no exception here. In fact he’s particularly NOTED within canon narratives for being the guy everyone in the DC universe trusts to lead them.

Now.....imagine being this guy, who while although still a teenager, is in his late teens, and has YEARS of leading his own team under his belt. Years of being responsible for the lives of teammates and civilians. Years of becoming aware of and comfortable with his own natural brilliance. Years of becoming confident in being capable of making the right call when the situation demands it. Years of learning to TRUST in his ability to make the right call, to know the right approach, because not only are people relying on him to make those calls, he needs to be able to trust he can make them in order to have the confidence to follow through and DO so instead of being frozen with indecision or trying to pass the decision off to someone else, which he NEVER does?

With all that....and even with all due respect to Bruce’s own genius and experience....

What are the chances that in all the times that Bruce and Dick clash in his late teenage years....

Dick is NEVER right?

And yet.....when in any of these conflicts.....is he ever validated in that, versus shut down by Bruce who insists his way is still right?

Imagine being an acknowledged genius with years of experience and responsibility under your belt, but NEVER getting to be right in any arguments with your father, even when just based off pure freaking statistics, its frankly impossible for you to be 100% wrong EVERY SINGLE TIME?

Do you see where the two way street thing starts to fall apart? How can it truly be a two way street if part of the reason the two of them so often end UP aggressively opposed to each other during this time period.....is because of how many times previous encounters have only ended ONE way no matter WHAT?

It makes sense for Dick and Bruce not to clash as much during their younger years, because even the most stubborn kids do understand on a fundamental level that they have things to learn from more experienced adults. And Dick has never been someone mindlessly predisposed towards conflict. He didn’t become an exceptional acrobat by the age of eight by butting heads with his parents every time they tried to teach him, he couldn’t have. He KNOWS how to listen, he KNOWS how to acknowledge when someone else is right. 

But as he grows older, when he has more and more experience under his belt, more and more confidence in his own insights in large parts thanks to Bruce’s own efforts in buttressing his confidence in his younger years.....what happens when the balance of who is right and who is wrong in their arguments NEVER EVER starts to shift in his direction even a little bit, no matter HOW much more experienced he seems to get....and what happens when communicating this problem, this imbalance, to the person that really matters here, Bruce himself....still inherently requires Bruce accepting blame and acknowledging even just in THIS case, the idea that he’s not always right at this point and Dick has insights that can challenge his?

Of course there’s going to be more and more conflict....but can you truly argue that its a two way street, even just based off THIS? Is the teenage son truly to blame for being frustrated that he’s not allowed to ever be right, because the thing getting in his way is his father never ever being willing to back down or cave or not have the last word?

This is the sort of inherent contradiction I think lies at the heart of a lot of conflicting viewpoints here. It doesn’t matter how much lip service is being paid to the idea that Dick is intelligent, that Dick is respected, if all your content continually bears out the idea that actually no he’s not, because Bruce is always right, Dick never is in the right in arguments or conflicts.

The latter evidence just is not aligning with the former claims, and thus readers are innately forced to make a choice as to which to believe.....and more likely than not, they’re going to err on the side of substantiating whichever stance actually has more narrative support behind it, in any particular story.

See what I’m saying?

You need to make sure your story is ACTUALLY saying what you think you’re saying or you intended to say....or you end up undermining your own intentions.

Anyway. Just throwing that out there. 

[sketching-shark]

I think we should start a protection squad (although they don’t need it because they can protect themselves) for Sun Wukong and Guanyin

“Begone monkie kid fandom trying to down grade these really interesting characters with interesting personality’s and backstory ( the both of them like seriously Guanyin backstory is so cool) to a villain wile trying to justify your angsty backstory (that are no where near as cool as monkey who fights gods and Person who has 1000 arms and heads to help people in need) for the actual villain”

So who wants to join

Me:*raises my hand*

Ps: sorry if I got Guanyin backstory wrong am not an expert on it.

Haha okay so some critiques on the jttw & associated media western fandom & fandom in general coming up, so please skip this upcoming text wall if you don't want to encounter my undoubtedly ~devastating~ words (i.e. don't like don't read as people love to say, & if I have to be inundated with images of my notp every time I go into the sun wukong tag then I imagine people can be chill with me expressing my opinions & giving people fair warning that I WILL be critiquing common fandom trends, but no need for you to see that if you don’t want to. Cool? Cool.)

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PFFFFFTTT oh man there are many times when I feel like signing up for such a protection squad...when it comes to the current western jttw & Sun Wukong fandom I do feel like I'm often swinging at a rapid pace between "well it's fandom & people are allowed to make the stories they want" & "I am once again begging my fellow monkie kid enthusiasts (& sometimes creators) to do more research into the og classic/show it more respect so you can avoid any potentially offensive/off-the-mark misunderstandings of the status & cultural context of the characters in their country of origin (I promise it's super interesting & I can provide you with links to free pdf copies of the entire Yu translation, i.e. the best one ever created, so feel free to ask!) & maybe also stop constantly stripping away all the nuance of Sun Wukong's character for the sake of either making him an entire asshole so your little meow meow can look completely innocent in comparison and/or making the monkey king's entire life & character revolve around said meow meow."

Like I get that fandom's supposed to be a kind of anything-goes environment, but one thing that honestly seems to be true of a lot of fandoms--and the western one for Sun Wukong & co. is certainly not immune from this--is that there often seems to be a kind of monoculturalization at work in what stories are created & what character interpretations are made popular. Across a multitude of fandoms, you frequently see basically nothing but the exact same tropes being made popular & even being insisted on for the canonical work (especially hasty redemption arcs & enemies to lovers these days), the exact same one-dimensional character types that characters from an original work keep getting shoved into, the exact same story beats, etc. And I get it to an extent, as fandom is generally a space where people just make art and fic for fun & without thinking too hard about it & without any pressure. 

This seems to, however, often unfortunately lead to the mentality that it’s your god-given right to do literally whatever you want with literally any cultural figure without even the slightest bit of thought put into their cultural, historical, and even religious context, even (and sometimes especially) when it comes to figures that are really important in a culture outside your own. For such figures--even if you first encounter them in a children’s cartoon--you should be a little more careful with what you do with them than you would with your usual Saturday morning line-up. It of course has to be acknowledged that there exists a whole pile of absolutely ridiculous & cursed pieces of media that are based on Journey to the West & that were produced in mainland China, but for your own education if nothing else I consider it good practice for those of us (myself certainly included) who aren’t part of the culture that produced JTTW to put more thought into how we might want to portray these characters so that at the very least (to pull some things I’ve seen from the jttw western fandom) we’re not turning a goddess of mercy into an evil figure for the sake of Angst(TM), or relegating other important literary figures into the positions of offensive stereotypes, or making broad claims about the source text & original characterizations of various figures that are blatantly untrue, or mocking heavenly deities because of what’s actually your misunderstanding of how immortality works according to Daoist beliefs. Yet while a lot of this is often due to people not even trying to understand the context these figures are coming from, I do want to acknowledge that the journey (lol reference) to understand even a fraction of the original cultural context can be a daunting one, especially since, as I’ve mentioned before, it can be really hard & even next to impossible to find good, accessible, & legitimate explanations in English of how, for example, the relationship between Sun Wukong and the Six-Eared Macaque is commonly interpreted in China & according to the Buddhist beliefs that define the original work. 

That is to say, I do think it’s an unfortunate, if unavoidable, part of any introduction of an original text into a culture foreign to its own for there to be sometimes a significant amount of misinterpretation, mistranslations, and false assumptions. There is, however, a big difference between learning from your honest mistakes, & doubling down on them while dismissing all criticism of your misinterpretation into that abstract category of “fandom drama.” The latter attitude is kind of shitty at best and horrifically entitled at worst. 

Plus, as I’ve discovered, there is a great deal of interest and joy to be drawn from keeping yourself open to learning aspects of these texts & figures that you weren’t aware of! I can say from my own experience that I’ve always really enjoyed & appreciated it when individuals on this site who come from a Chinese background--and who know much more about the cultural context of JTTW than me--have taken the time to explain its various aspects. It often leaves me feeling like woooooaaaahhhhhHHH!!!! as to how amazingly full of nuanced meaning JTTW is like dang no wonder it’s one of China’s Four Great Classical Novels. 

And I guess that right there is the heart of a lot of my own personal frustration and disappointment with the ways that fandoms often approach a literary work or other piece of media...like don’t get me wrong, a lot of the original works a fandom may grow around are just straight-up goofy & everyone’s aware of it & has fun with it, yet the trend of approaching what are often nuanced and multi-layered works in terms of how well they fit and/or can be shoved into pretty cliche ideas of Redemption Arc or Enemies to Lovers or Hero Actually Bad, Villain Actually Good etc...well, it just seems to cheapen and even erase even the possibility of understanding the wonderful complexity or even endearing simplicity that made these works so beloved in the first place. Again, I feel like I need to make it clear that I’m not saying fandom should be a space where people are constantly trying to one-up each other with their hot takes in literary analysis, but it would be nice and even beneficial to allow room for commentary that strives to approach these works in a multi-faceted way, analysis & interpretations that go against the popular fandom beliefs, & criticism of the work or even of fandom trends (yes it is in fact possible to legitimately love something but still be critical of its aspects) instead of immediately attacking people who try to engage in such as just being haters who don’t want anyone to have fun ever (X_X).   

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Anyway, I know I didn’t cover even half of the stuff you brought up in the first place anon, but I don’t want any interested parties to this post to suffer too long through my text wall lol. I was asked to try my hand at illustrating Guanyin, but as with you I’m nowhere near as informed as I should be about her, so I want to do more research on her history and religious importance before I attempt a portrait. I’ll try my best, and do plan to pair that illustration with my own outsider’s attempt to summarize her character. From what little I do know I am in full agreement that her backstory is so incredibly amazing...just the fact that she literally eschewed the bliss of Nirvana to help all beings reach it, and even split herself into pieces in the attempt to do so (with Buddha granting her eleven heads and a thousand arms as a result)...man, I can see why she’s such a beloved & respected deity. 

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 As for what western fandom commonly does with everyone’s favorite god-fighting primate...I can talk about this at length if there’s interest, but for this post I’ll just say that I guess one lesson from all of this is that for all the centuries that have passed since Journey to the West was first completed, literally no one drawing inspiration from the original tale in the west (lol) has come even slightly close to being able to equal or even capture half the extent of the nuance, complexity, religious, historical, and cultural aspects, and humor that define Wu Cheng'en's story of an overpowered monkey who defied even Buddha.

So thank the heavens we'll always have the original.