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ao3-sucks · 4 years

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An Archive of Someone’s Own: my experiences being groomed in fandom circles on AO3

TW: Childhood sexual abuse, grooming, mentions of incest and rape.

I used to be a big writer of fanfiction. It was the logical choice for me. I loved to write and create bold and immersive worlds, and I craved an audience who would enjoy my work as much as I did. Since my writing wasn’t actually good, I needed a community of other amateurs who wouldn’t mind that, and by tweaking my characters and settings into ones from canonical media, I got the audience I so craved.

I started writing fanfiction online when I was 14, posting initially on FanFiction.net and then moving to AO3 a few months later. As I got back into writing original fiction towards the end of high school, I lost interest in this community, and it’s been a long time since I posted anything much on AO3.

I’ve always struggled with the fact I display a lot of symptoms of CSA, and for the longest time, I couldn’t figure out why. Throughout my teen years, I refused to get changed or bathe when anyone was even vaguely nearby, constantly paranoid about being spied on; I developed a severe touch phobia, and would have frequent panic attacks from something as small as brushing arms with a passerby; I resolutely identified as asexual and refused to get into anything resembling a relationship with others because the very concept disgusted and repulsed me.

Weird, considering I had grown up pretty normal and all of these symptoms had started around my early teens. It was only when I told my friends about my friendship with a 30 year old I had met online that the pieces started falling into place for me.

Child grooming is usually discussed in the context of one adult going out of their way to befriend a child with the goal of lowering their resistance to sexual abuse, through normalisation and friendliness. I’d like to talk about how that worked on the fanfiction website AO3. Since it’s an open website and most communication takes place between anonymous users or accounts in the comments section of a work, there is very little delineation between spaces for adults to discuss whatever dark topics they like and spaces for kids to do the same.

This frequently leads to pretty inappropriate conversations between people of widely varying ages and life experiences, which is how I ended up talking sex as a fourteen year old with people ranging from a couple of years older than me, who were generally okay, to more than twice my age. The 30 year old in question listed on her profile how many pedophilic ships she loved, and she knew my age but pushed me to keep discussing sexual topics with her. Sounds like a red flag, yeah? Well. I was 14, and very stupid.

This 30 year old woman, who I will call Aku (because it’s similar to her screen name and because it’s funny to name her after the bad guy from Samurai Jack) would start conversations with me whenever I posted anything to AO3 and would refuse to take no for an answer when I tried to back out of conversations with her, and since these conversations were public and occurring within comments, I didn’t want to be rude to her since this was taking place on content I was trying to promote.

I told her my age multiple times and she would either pretend she forgot from last time (saying her memory is super bad) or continue as though it was just trivia about me and not a sign she shouldn’t have been pushing me. My primary objection to what she would say to me (since most of it was just her being annoying) was her insistence on sexualising everything I wrote, and her determination to push me into writing pornographic content, which I eventually gave in to.

Yes, she was a terrible person. She emailed me using her personal email address, so I know her full name and place of residence, because she’s an idiot. These emails also contain sexually explicit materials. Nothing much ever happened between us except for these very creepy interactions and the fact we remained online friends for a few years. But here’s the thing: she wasn’t the only person pushing me into creating sexual content. Lots of people would comment on my writing demanding that I show explicit sexual content when I really didn’t want to.

After a while it felt like I couldn’t write a longer, romantic fanfiction without including explicit sexual content. Like my work wasn’t valid without it. Other, more popular writers were usually sexual in their content, and I wanted to be like them and bring in the views, right? So, when I look at my back catalog of works, I can see how my content moved from completely non-sexual to featuring sexual content over time, and the views usually came with. In this way, I was in an environment that was encouraging me on many levels to sexualise my own work, which impacted the way I thought about my creative process.

Here’s another example I remember. When I was a young sprout, I remember reading down someone’s list of fanfiction recommendations and seeing a work called Hug Therapy, which I promptly read. While the work is marked as explicit and containing the Loki/Thor pairing, the use of relationship and rating tags on AO3 is so poorly regulated that it didn’t really mean anything to me to see either of those. People tag hardcore material as non-explicit and tag friendships as relationships, because there’s no motivation to tag properly. Plus, someone I followed here on Tumblr had recommended it to me.

Now, you wouldn’t know from the listing, but while this piece starts out as comedy, it turns out in the end to include rape, incest, and BDSM in very explicit terms. The fact it was tagged as being explicit didn’t slow me down, because the liberal use of these tags could mean that an explicit tag was just there because sexual content was implied or mentioned, which I thought would be the case based on the rest of the listing. Out of curiosity, I recently tried to report this work to the moderators for containing no warnings about incest or rape, and I got this in response:

“Selecting “Creator Chose Not To Use Archive Warnings” satisfies a creator’s obligation under the warnings policy. Users who wish to avoid specific elements entirely should not access fanworks marked with “Creator Chose Not To Use Archive Warnings”. Our Terms of Service note: “You understand that using the Archive may expose you to material that is offensive, triggering, erroneous, sexually explicit, indecent, blasphemous, objectionable, grammatically incorrect, or badly spelled. ….. This decision is in accordance with our policy of maximum inclusiveness; we have therefore closed this case and will not be investigating further.”

Which, yeah, I guess. The frustration comes from how ‘Creator Chose Not To Use Archive Warnings’ is an extremely commonly used tag, and most things that it’s used on are totally harmless.

This fanfiction, which I was recommended by a friend, is hugely popular, in the top 60 most read fanfictions in the entire fandom. You wanna hear the kicker? The author, Astolat, is one of the founders of AO3. They’re not just some random author who isn’t following the rules. They’re a creator of the whole website, and they made the rules. This is pretty telling about how seriously the website actually takes protecting their users.

My final example I want to give is one of fetish content. People in fetish communities generally (not always) say that fetishes are probably something one should work up to after the onset of sexual activity, especially potentially harmful stuff like BDSM. In the circles I was running in, if you weren’t sporting a fetish or two (no matter your age) you were a boring bitch.

Maybe this isn’t true of everywhere in the fanfiction community, but I used to feel that bizarre pressure until I got out. Bear in mind that my main time in this community was from ages 14 to 17. I never made my age a secret, either. I told people outright I was that age, I was in high school, I was playing hockey and studying The Great Gatsby when I wasn’t online.

Since I was in the Avengers fandom and I liked Loki and the Asgardians, I was frequently exposed to incestuous content between Loki and Thor, and a lot of it came out of nowhere or was poorly tagged. This was considered the norm, and while I at first felt completely horrified and repulsed, within a year or two I no longer gave a shit. It’s only in the last few years as I’ve begun to unpack everything that I’ve started to get that strong revulsion reaction to incestuous content.

In the circles I was in, it was relentlessly normal. Normal to the point that people who disliked it were usually shouted down. Even to this day, debate rages on in fandom spaces about whether or not content like this normalises this kind of abuse. In my own personal experience, which I don’t usually like to talk about, it absolutely does.

In real life, this normalisation started to have serious consequences for my mental health and interpersonal relationships. In fanfiction, any occasion when you are alone with someone could become sexual, any familial relationship is possibly sexual, and it doesn’t matter if you like it or not. I became incredibly anxious around male family members for fear of being sexually assaulted, and my OCD, which I had been developing since I was a child, turned from thoughts of physical violence to thoughts of graphically sexually assaulted by anyone and everyone around me.

My fear of being touched got to the point where I would have panic attacks if anyone came anywhere close to touching me. I quit sports, fucked up my romantic relationships, and didn’t hug anyone, not even members of my family, for years. All the while, I had bought my first laptop and was consuming more fanfiction than ever before. I struggled with my sexuality growing up, as I am bisexual, and while fanfiction provided LGBT content to help me, the content was frequently so disturbing that I viewed any expression of sexuality as something evil and predatory.

The community on AO3, whether you like it or not, is often sexual, and provides no barriers between the casual user looking for content and extremely intense fetish material. It’s sometimes called the Pornhub of fanfiction, but considering the wide range of people who use it, it’s more like if you opened Youtube and saw niche hardcore fetish videos just on the front page, recommended and trending.

Sure, you have to click a little button to confirm you’re 18 before you can actually read a story, but the tags and descriptions of readily available works can be extremely explicit. Fanfiction also brings you into close contact with fellow readers and the author, and encourages you to become a content creator, which in some ways makes it more dangerous.

I was affected much more strongly by what I saw than most people would be, because I was already treading shaky ground. But I’m also not the only person out there who has been hurt in this way. Most of my friends who grew up in fandom can report the impact that fanfiction culture had on them. One of my friends from high school knew a panoply of porn terms at age 14 or so due to reading fanfiction, and another of my other friends at high school almost exclusively read rape porn because it was her favourite. I didn’t have friends who watched porn; I had friends who read fanfiction. These are just as troubling to me as any other accounts of young people consuming visual porn from a very early age.

It’s frequently cited that fanfiction gives minority groups the opportunity for creative outlet. It was a great place for me to cut my teeth as a content creator, and a source of acceptance and kindness when times were tough. Fanfiction communities have historically been the domain of women and minorities, and create a space for these people to tell their own stories.

It’s largely because of this that fanfiction communities fear censorship and strict moderation, as they have been attacked in the past on homophobic or misogynistic grounds, resulting in mass deletions of works or the shutdown of websites. But there must be some middle ground between total censorship and the kind of free rein that puts vulnerable people in danger, and I strongly encourage the board of AO3 to seek this middle ground out.

But it’s the community itself that needs to shape up; AO3 is, after all, a community-led website built by fans for fans, so the fact that this website has such issues is a reflection of the issues that run deeply within the people who created it. Aku didn’t talk to me with the intention of doing me harm, or so I believe at this time, and she didn’t pursue me as a lone wolf or in isolation.

She was simply a particularly brazen member of a community that was used to having inappropriate conversations with young people and sexualising everything they did. Even people my own age were jokingly pushing me into discussing and consuming extremely sexual content. It was just normal. That’s what I want to say here. Inside the world of fandom on AO3, the grooming of children with sexual content is normal. And that’s scary.

- Mod Daft

#mod daft post #ao3 discourse #fandom wank #fanfiction discourse #fanfiction wank #csa//#rape//#grooming//#incest//

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surveys-at-your-service · 3 years

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Survey #454

“last thing i remember, i was running for the door / i had to find the passage back to the place i was before”

Last thing you bought online? Did you like it? I have no clue. Could you date someone who didn’t drive (and didn’t show an interest in ever getting their license, either)? I don't know. Public transportation isn't a big thing here at all, and even whenever I get my license, my partner needing to get somewhere while I'm needed elsewhere could be problematic. I think it would also depend on why they don't want their license. Like if they had a traumatic wreck, I couldn't blame them. How would you react if your artwork became famous? That'd be fucking amazing. Would you get your nipples pierced? I've briefly considered it. I ultimately wouldn't, though. How many people know your birthday? Without the assistance of Facebook, a few, I guess. My immediate family, Sara, uhhhh... Has anyone ever tried to ruin a relationship you were in? Yes, and it worked. For the better, though. He had a bad reputation. Have you ever watched a whole hour long infomercial? Ha, yes, this one time with Girt. It was a vacuum infomercial. We were just really bored at my place and... okay, I have no justification for watching that whole thing lmao. What is your current MySpace song? I still remember it was "Pocketful of Sunshine" by Natasha Beddingfield lmaooo. What is your favorite kind of meat to put on your sandwich? Ham. Which one of your exes do you feel like you have the most chemistry with? Sara or Jason, idk. How do you feel about people who make Facebook profiles for their pets? I don't care. Have you ever personally known a pair of conjoined twins? No. What was the most disturbing thing you have ever heard your mother say? Mom and my older sister got in a fight once and Mom yelled that she was a slut. I don't know why, but... it never left me, and I GUARANTEE it never left Ashley (who is not a "slut," by the way). This was when she was a teenager, so it's been many years and I can absolutely promise you Mom regrets it, big time. I don't even have to ask. Is there something in particular you like to look at photos of? What is it? Mark and meerkats, ha ha. Chewy chocolate-chip cookies: like or dislike? Chewy is the way to GO. If your boyfriend/girlfriend wanted to dress only in the opposite sex’s clothing, would you support that? If not, would you leave them? I wouldn't care. I'm pansexual, anyway. Anyone can be attractive to either gender's clothes to me. I think assigning clothes to a specific gender is dumb, anyway. Do you think your grandmother is/was beautiful? I only remember how my maternal grandmother looked, and yeah, she was a pretty lady. Which of your fields of interest are you a total expert on? Mark, ha ha. I know way too much on a person I've never met. When was the last time you got all dolled up? Not since last October when I did a witchy Halloween shoot with friends. Do you ever name objects? (i.e. mp3 players, guitars, cars, etc.) No. Do you have a criminal record? No. Last person you took a nap with? Sara, years ago. Well, unless you count my cat. He always comes running when he hears me getting comfy in bed, ha ha. Does seeing your mother cry automatically make you feel sad as well? Yes, and angry because I want to stop whatever it is making her cry, but I usually can't. Do you think someone likes the same person you like? I have no idea. Do you want your life to stay the way it is right now forever? God no. Have you ever been to craigslist.com? Yes; I've adopted and rehomed pets from there. What about eBay? Mom's bought stuff from there. Have you ever used Nair? Yes, on my legs. It's just as exhausting as shaving with how thick my hair is. Are you medicated? I think I'm on too much medication, personally. I want to try weaning off my OCD prescription, because I haven't had problems in a long time, but my psychiatrist doesn't want to? Which is odd to me because when I came to him, he was stunned by how many different meds I was on. He's concerned that the symptoms will just re-emerge, but like... I've beaten OCD before, for many years. I can do it again. I trust him with my life though, because he saved it, so I just go with what he says, honestly. Do you shape/fill in your eyebrows? No. Have you ever stolen/borrowed clothes from an ex? I've worn Jason's pajama pants before because I found men's pj pants more comfortable, and besides, sometimes I spent the night when I didn't plan to and needed something more comfortable than jeans. Could you make a statement about anything political? Texas' new "heartbeat bill" is fucking bullshit and is going to get so many women killed from DIY abortions. Do you think you’ve already met your soulmate? I don't believe in soulmates, but I do believe I met the person I loved more than I could ever possibly love somebody else again. Do you get the feeling something good will happen in your life soon? Fuck if I know. Do you enjoy romantic movies, even when they’re cliche? Yes. Have you been to McDonald’s in the past month? Yes. Have you ever slept over at your best friend’s house? I have. How often do you go bowling? Very, very rarely. I haven't been since I was on a date at the end of 2017, I wanna say??? Or was it '18??? Last time you were in an apartment? Not since Colleen still lived in one and I was visiting her. Have you ever seen a live seahorse? Yeah, in aquariums. Would you like to have your own yacht? I mean I wouldn't say no if you offered it to me for free, but I'm not exactly interested in one. I'd probably just give it to my dad. He'd be on Cloud 9. Winnie the Pooh or Tigger? Pooh! :^) What’s the unhealthiest thing you’ve eaten today? A brownie with caramel drizzle. Mom bought a box of them to split between Ash and her family and us, so I had one. :x Thankfully though she gave more to Ash, because I don't like having treats in the house for my weight's sake, but a little something sweet occasionally keeps you sane when you're trying to lose weight. Has a stranger ever offered to buy you a drink? Ew, no. What is something you’d be happy to receive as a gift, that doesn’t cost a lot? I'd really appreciate something hand-made, like a drawing or something. What kind of music does your significant other/crush like to listen to? He likes mostly the same stuff as me, but also more indie-ish stuff than me. Who did you have your first kiss with? Do you remember what colour his/her eyes were? Jason. His eyes are brown. Are there any themes from TV shows that you like to sing along to? Supernatural. It's inevitable that I'll sing, ha ha. Do you eat dessert after dinner? Very, very rarely. Have you ever had too much to drink and felt embarrassed about your behavior the next day? No. When you go out drinking, what do you prefer to drink? I don't go out drinking, but if I was to order a drink right now, I'd go for a sangria. That sounds soooo good rn. What was the last animal that you saw? My cat. Venus is in her hide as I'm answering this, so I can't see her. What was the last thing that you said to one of your siblings? I told Nicole bye when she was leaving the other day. What is the most expensive thing that you’ve purchased that you paid for: My snake. What is your favorite messaging program? Discord, nowadays. Do you eat fast food more than 5 times a week? Yikes, no. Have you ever almost drowned? No. Have you ever learned something shocking about someone through Facebook? It wasn't shocking in a bad way, just very unexpected. One of my friends has been an egg donor twice, I wanna say? What’s the scariest living animal that you’ve petted? I have no clue. Nothing that dangerous. Well wait, I shared the story of holding a tarantula before, and I was still kinda nervous to do so when I did. She was a total sweetie, though. Do you remember the first conversation you ever had with the person you currently have feelings for? I actually don't. Other than he got my attention with "lip ring girl," lmao. Do you dread certain days of the week? If yes, what day/s and why? No, because they're all the same to me. If you eat oatmeal, do you have it plain or do you have certain toppings that you like to add to it? I add a bit of sugar. What is the funniest or strangest thing you’ve ever heard somebody say in their sleep? *shrug* Choose one - Butterfinger, Milky Way, Snickers: Milky Way, 100%. Do you use Mozilla Firefox? No, I use Chrome. Who is your favorite person to hug? Sara. Have you ever had to have a mug shot? No. What was the last thing you carried to your room? Water. When was the last time you had a late night phone call? Damn dude, I couldn't possibly tell ya.

#survey #surveys #random questions #lyrics: ''hotel california'' by the eagles

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crushaa · 4 years

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Explaining the long break and how I got diagnosed with ADHD:

This is a post about mental health. There’s a TLDR at the bottom :)

“Apply yourself, Cien. If you wanted to pass this class, you would be trying.”

When I was 15, I got my tonsils out. I got the same kind of statement from a few friends and even family members; “Oh yeah, they used to take EVERYONE’S tonsils out! Even if they didn’t need it, it was the cure to everything. But now everyone’s got ADHD, so that’s the new trend.”

Around the end of July 2019, I was running out of steam. I still had plenty of creative energy, but I couldn't understand why I wasn't able to work on anything anymore. The truth is that I knew I would hit another music block, and I wouldn't be surprised if anyone else expected it too. My posting history has always been very irregular, even back in high school with long unexplained breaks in between new songs. Knowing it would happen, I felt confident in my ability to tackle it and change my pattern of behavior.

I never thought it would last this long. With each month passing by I began to feel guiltier and guiltier, trying to find out why I couldn't do it. I'd sit in front of an empty FL Studio project for hours, and all my Paint Tool Sai canvases never had more than a few lines. As the months went on, some pretty dramatic life events took place- various family deaths, 2 near death experiences myself, an abusive doctor. For whatever reason, I just could not recover.

I used the tragedies as excuses as to why I couldn't do it. It would be reasonable to not be able to do anything. My antidepressants were definitely working for the first time in my life, but why couldn’t I work? I spent the New Year holiday feeling just as guilty and frustrated as ever…. I couldn’t do it anymore. I decided that I was going to go back to my doctors loaded with new theories and ideas as to what could possibly be wrong with me. It never occured to me to tell anyone I couldn’t write more than 2-3 songs in one year when it’s literally my job to write music.

I began speculating the possibility of another psychiatric disorder, and that made me nervous. Would she think I was lying? Or faking it? I could no longer stand the treatment from the nurse practitioner who had been treating my psychiatric illnesses. I’d always been very uncomfortable with how she treated me, but she’d found the rare genetic disorder I had. I felt that I owed my progress to her and that I should stick it out. But I was still leaving her office in tears at the end of every session. An off color comment, passive aggressive reminders to take my medication, the feeling that I had no say in my own treatment plan… it was too much. But she was the only one in town who was available to see me. So I went, and I was administered an MMPI by a psychiatrist in that same building. At the end of February, I’d get the results.

The next appointment with her was the last time she’s ever going to see me. The results of the test had come in as inconclusive, and my world fell apart. She asked what I thought of the results, and I answered truthfully. I told her I was afraid that she saw me as a hypochondriac.

“Well what if you are?” I didn’t answer. “Well, you are,” she went on with a cocky smile.

She began to tell me it was my own fault. She told me I had brain damage. But it was fine, because she told me I could be treated for believing I was still sick.

It affected me deeply, for days I couldn’t stop crying or eat a full meal. The guilt, frustration and embarrassment swallowed me whole; the problem was me. Of course I was making it up. I felt suicidal for the first time in 4 years. There was no point in trying anymore because I as a whole was defective. This world would be better off without a lost cause like me.

I pulled myself out of this headspace for a while one day, and realized that a HEALTH CARE PROVIDER made me feel this way.

WHERE WAS THE BRAIN SCAN, BITCH????

All the guilt, embarrassment, shame- it morphed into a new red hot burning rage. I fired her immediately and revoked any permissions she had. I went to my primary care doctor and asked him to prescribe me my psychiatric medications while I looked for a new psychiatrist, to which he agreed. I asked him for an ADHD test, but he wasn’t comfortable doing it himself. He referred me to a psychiatrist with a 6 month waiting list who then tried to refer me to the abusive nurse practitioner. I set up the six month appointment wait and began to look into doctors in other towns.

On Monday, April 6th, I went to go see a different doctor for something completely unrelated and walked out with an ADHD (Inattentive type) diagnosis. And now less than a week later, everything about my life has changed. 7 long months of executive dysfunction came to an end in the 1 hour it took for the first half-pill to dissolve. Hot damn.

It felt like everyone else in the world was allowed to use the sidewalk to get from place to place, but there was a rule that I had to dodge incoming traffic to get anywhere. Now, I can use the sidewalk too. I am relearning everything that I know.

I am no longer ashamed that I have the GPA of a baked potato. I know that I am not lazy, I am not stupid, and this was NOT my own fault; I was sick and nobody knew. The signs were there, but how we view ADHD has changed entirely since I was a child! People still called it ADD. So why was it so hard to get diagnosed in this day and age?

The stigma has shifted into something far more dangerous than I’ve ever realized it was. I don’t hear “I have ADHD OO SHINY” jokes anymore, you know? We believe it to be a grossly overdiagnosed behavioral disorder meant to punish children for having a lot of energy. We wave it off, calling it the new tonsil removal surgery trend. Of the three types of ADHD; Predominantly Hyper-Impulsive, Predominantly Inattentive (that’s me!), and Combined Type; a mix of the two, there tends to be more stigmatized attention towards the hyper-impulsive type. We believe in what we see, breaking the first rule of mental illness: Just because you can’t see it doesn’t mean it’s not there.

This leaves those suffering from both inattentive type and combined type to rot. Attention deficiency itself doesn’t have much of a stigma because it isn’t even seen as having a seat at the ADHD table. This is catastrophic and will continue to destroy lives because people don’t feel hyper enough to even consider that they might have ADHD. In turn, those who are told to try harder, apply themselves, stop procrastinating, and to stop being so lazy do not receive the proper care they need. Those who suffer without treatment get worse over time; they lose confidence in themselves, they don’t start new things in fear of the inability to finish, they break promises to friends and family with the inability to follow through, damaging important relationships beyond repair.

My confidence has been shattered. I was the artist who failed art class. College was never an option because I knew I’d go straight back to failing every class I took. I feel like I am a burden and the token “lost cause” of my family, the one everybody worries about because I’m not right in the head. I’ve grown to become a reclusive, bashful adult who struggles to make and answer phone calls and emails. ADHD devastated my life in deeper ways than my OCD, my PTSD, my anxiety or depression ever could.

The number of diagnoses are going up because we can recognize it better. This is not a bad thing- science is evolving to show possible causes of the disorder itself. We know not to smoke while pregnant anymore, we know not to eat and drink high fructose corn syrup, we know not to sit in front of blue light screens all day, and we’ll continue to learn.

As soon as I started my medication, I was able to start taking care of myself and working again. The symptoms of my other mental illnesses began to let up, and I felt like a human being for the first time in my life. I have control over my own emotions- I can walk on the sidewalk with everyone else, I am free.

However, it’s going to take the rest of my life to unlearn the methods I came up with to perform basic self-care functions. It will take many years to gain confidence in myself, to make phone calls without shaking or to even consider the thought of college, potato grades and all. But my mindset has transformed from “I can’t” to “Maybe I could try,” --a first for me.

Question everything, don’t settle for the minimum, and don’t stop fighting. Thanks for reading this post. I'm hard at work on Propaganda part 2 and hope to post it on May 31st. See you then :-)

TLDR: ADHD destroyed my life in ways my depression, anxiety and other mental illnesses never could. The stigma surrounding ADHD is shifting to become more dangerous than it has been in the past.

We live in a society.

#Mental Health #ADHD

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my-autistic-things · 5 years

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Autism test anon here. I am an adult, but I'm pretty estranged from my parents and grandparents (who raised me more than my parents did). I've heard of several adults who didn't involve their parents and were diagnosed but will this affect it in any way? The most I could do is get my dad to call or email (but he works a lot and is super neglectful and in another time zone so that's a soft maybe) Thank you for answering BTW it's made me much more at ease (other than the parents part lol)

I'm glad I could help! I wouldn't stress too much about the parents part. For minors, namely children/young teens, parent reports are probably more essential because the kid can't report their own behaviors as accurately (or even know what's going on to be asked questions, if they are that young). Also they have less years being autistic to draw memories from. For me, all my mom (aka a person who was present during my childhood, so it could be an aunt/grandma/best friend's mom even probably) had to do was the online survey thing I mentioned. I did have the option to not include her at all after I asked about how the test would look and if the word "autism" was going to show up anywhere. I wasn't sure how accepting she would be, just for me to go out and seek a diagnosis, so I didn't want to spook her. If your psychiatrist does the same thing as mine did, your dad could do the survey thing pretty easily (theoretically). My mom had like....2 weeks to do it? Probably longer if she really procrastinated. The two week "deadline" was just from my initial appointment with the doctor when she emailed the link to my mom until the appointment where I did the eval. The psychiatrist was fairly open to me not involving her at all, though. The point is to get as accurate as a background to your childhood as possible, because let's be honest, nobody can remember how they actually were growing up. Also it shows from a different perspective how long certain symptoms were present and if you're blowing things out of proportion or you do have issues socially. The main thing that comes to mind is people saying "omg I don't wanna do my homework I'm so ADHD" or "ugh I can't flirt I'm so autistic" like first off, buddy-pal, your wrong, stop it, ew shut up, but also people do think of themselves as more socially awkward (and also all negative things) as more severe then they actually tend to be perceived as. So having someone else say "yup this person says slightly off things by neurotypical standards" is just like a verification thing. Also you could be lying, which doctors sometimes like to think....🙄. (Also, some traumatic brain injuries result in behaviors/symptoms/changes that actually look very similar to autism; if you had symptoms since birth/a very young age, then it's probably autism, if it's only after, say, you were in a car accident, hmmm maybe not autism). If you can identify yourself as having clear examples and situations from stories like "my mom/dad always used to make fun of me for lining up all my toys by color and size and that was my version of "playing" with them haha" or "yeah, I always needed to be tucked in super tight at night ever since I was a baby otherwise I would cry" stuff like that, then that should be acceptable.

When you give answers to questions, try to think of examples when you were little (either that you remember or that your parents have told you about) around ages 2-7 ish, during your teen years, and also recently as an adult. One example could be: as a kid I hated playing with other kids because my play scene didn't match with theirs and I only wanted to do mine, as a teen I hated group work because we never could agree on the same topic/way of doing things, and now I hate working with coworkers for the same reason" something kinda like that. Might be a tad overkill and you might not be able to even answer fully without being cut off like "hey yeah that's enough info I don't need all that *awkward laugh*" but it really doesn't hurt to be overprepared. This is where writing down some notes and bringing it would be really helpful, or asking to write a follow up email after asking friends/family who knew you growing up. Also, if your dad was neglectful (very sorry to hear about that btw) he might not even know you well enough to report behaviors anyways, so that's something to mention if the psychiatrist needs more reasoning then "he won't respond".

If you really want to overprepare, you can compare different disorders that can present similarly like ADHD, OCD, social anxiety, BPD, etc. and prepare examples according to the ASD criteria that couldn't be examples by a different disorder. Like a lot of my examples I gave mapped pretty well onto only social anxiety and OCD with my previous ADHD dx, so I made sure to discuss the sorta "root" of my social anxiety being how I have difficulties understanding people's intentions and meanings behind their words (rather than mainly talking about how I worry others perceive me).

Now that this has turned into another really long ramble, I'll stop now lol

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curlyjoe7 · 5 years

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Forming Your Own Opinions.

First off - major trigger warning for rape, manipulation and abuse. Second off - this is an adult conversation, between adults and only adults. I don’t want any arguments just informed debate. If you don’t know the situation then don’t speak. If you don’t like my opinion, agree to disagree, unfollow or block and move on. Everyone has the right to express their thoughts, all arguing will result in being blocked. Third off - I know this is old and no one wants to hear about it anymore but I just formed an opinion on it which I want to talk about. Sorry if hearing about it bothers you.

For the longest time and still even so now I have had the mentality: go with the popular opinion or just be quiet and you will be liked. Which is very toxic. I am obsessed with being liked, being plastic and letting others control my thoughts. I’m trying to get away from that though and this is my first step. Stating a controversial opinion. A big one. Very big. It’s hard for me, the whole thing has thrown me into a few severe anxiety attacks but I have to do this to get better or I never will. I’m super nervous and I’m ready to be hated or as ready as I possibly can be whilst simultaneously freaking out. So what’s my opinion? That Melanie Martinez is innocent. Just hear me out. Here’s why I think she’s innocent:

I was a big Melanie fan at the time of the rape accusations. At first when I heard it I thought “wow this is terrible, she’s a rapist” and cancelled her. It was really hard but I knew it was the best thing to do. After all it’s better to side with a potential victim than a potential rapist, right? I also knew nothing about the backstory so I had nothing to work off of but the word of someone I didn’t know existed and the statement “she never said no to what we chose to do together.” I as many thought that was a dumb excuse, just because someone doesn’t say no doesn’t mean it means yes. But like I said, I had no backstory so I moved on and unfanned Melanie, as hard as it was for me. Randomly I thought of it again, in the past week, and wondered if there was anything else about it. Looked it up and well... there’s a ton. I want to make a disclaimer that when looking at all the evidence, I took into consideration both sides. I was completely unbiased in this despite my past love of Melanie. Rape is a serious issue and should be treated like that not just excused because you like the person who is accused of it. Though with what I was learning, Timothy’s story seemed fishy with some holes. So I did more digging. First let’s get the story clear of what supposedly happened:

And that’s it basically. That’s the story, coming straight from her Twitter. Pretty horrifying, manipulating and wrong. Makes you feel bad for Timothy. But it doesn’t end there. After she released that statement Melanie released her own:

Many people thought it was her admitting to it and claiming it wasn’t rape because she let it happen. Which had us thinking she was guilty as sin. Until Timothy started releasing more information. Apparently that same day they went to a thrift shop and picked up a game that included a blindfold, handcuffs, and a dice that said things like “lick leg.” Which she never mentioned at all before. Originally Timothy said that Melanie bought it but then later said she herself did. Which is odd since she stated she has been abused before and sexual stuff made her uncomfortable. But whatever she said she thought it would be funny. Now here’s where it gets weird, she never mentioned the game before, right?Maybe she forgot? Sure that’s reasonable. They played the game on June 25th 2015 according to Timothy in an interview:

At Melanie’s house. Melanie’s house is in LA. This is important because with further information, she was in New York performing on stage that day. She even made an Instagram post about it:

And fans have pictures of her on stage. You notice how her hair is blonde and black in this pic? Well to support her cause Timothy posted a picture of Melanie the night it happened:

Her hair is a different color. And on her phone it shows up as May 6th, 2015. She claims it’s because her iCloud is messed up and that pictures of her recently showed up at being in 2011:

I went to Melanie’s Instagram to see her hair color May 6th, 2015 and just look:

On May 2nd her hair was that color in the picture. It’s actually really easy to change dates on your iCloud too. That’s... odd. But there’s even more, I believe she said they stopped being freinds after that but I know she said they stopped being friends in 2016, yet in 2017 she said this:

Okay. Change it once, maybe you forgot but if she changed it twice and still got it wrong? Suspicious. She actually has changed a lot of the story, multiple times. She said originally she didn’t want to go to the cops because she was afraid they wouldn’t believe her then said on her Instagram Live that yeah it’s bad but not murder so she doesn’t deserve to go to jail. So which is true? I mean it doesn’t matter her reason, it’s her decision but why is the reason changing? In Timothy’s original statement she mentioned some of Melanie’s fans became her fans but their loyalty never strayed from Melanie. That’s... irrelevant. But is it actually? Melanie was supposed to release a new album one month later. Which didn’t end up happening and when you went to Timothy’s Twitter at the time she had a pinned tweet for her song. Kinda weird but okay, it was probably there before. But why mention the loyalty of her fans never straying from her? Like I said, it’s irrelevant to the topic but not to her potential motives. They started their careers at the same time and Melanie was more popular too. And apparently started focusing on her music more than her friends so both of these might be the reason why. Seems reasonable. Now of course I wanted to check the stuff on Melanie’s side too but all I found was the original statement and this one:

Which in my opinion does clear up the “she never said no” thing. I think what she was trying to say is, Timothy didn’t say no multiple times like she said she did and that Melanie would never have sex with someone without their complete confirmation. Maybe even she meant she didn’t say no to the game they played. Though it could mean: “She never said no, I didn’t act on when she did say no but pressured her to give in.” And what Melanie says in this statement: “I trusted so many people in my life who took advantage of that trust for their own personal gain” supports the fact Timothy did it for fame. She also mentioned that in her song she released on Spotify called Piggyback that goes:

Trusted too many people while I was still young

Gave them the benefit of the doubt, I was so wrong

I cut them off and they came for blood cause they know

They ain’t getting no more

I’m so done playing piggyback

Swear to god I wished y’all all the best

You’re lying your way to try to gain a piece of me

When you could never come close cause I know my destiny

I worked hard for my shit

Put my love in this shit

Now you’re trying to kill my name for some fame

What is this?

Tried to help you do your shit

Encouraged you to work on it

Was a good friend and you used that to your advantage

Timothy did mention when Melanie blew up that she didn’t have time anymore for her and that she wanted to focus on her fans and music. So it does make sense that she did this for attention, to hurt Melanie. Even so the way Melanie worded her statement originally, doesn’t help her cause. Just made her look worse. The second statement however does clear it up in my opinion. With all the evidence and what Melanie said, it’s 1 point she’s guilty to multiple that she’s innocent. Even if you don’t like her you can’t deny that. There may be more points towards her being guilty as well, I’m not sure but this is all I could find, though there is just too many points towards her being innocent. In reality though none of this is fact, it’s just evidence and even evidence can be fake or twisted sometimes. Here’s a few more things about Timothy though and this story:

She says she doesn’t want to talk about it anymore but yet is willing to keep bringing it up. She dressed up as Melanie in 2016, a year after the rape, why would you put yourself through so much pain and do that? Idk just seems like it would hurt you more but she did love her so maybe that’s why: she was trying to deny the truth because of how much she loved her. She also suffers from BPD (Boarderline Personality Disorder) which I hate to bring up, just because she has a mental illness doesn’t mean she would do something fucked up. Just because anyone has a mental illness doesn’t mean it’s the reason for everything. Mental illness doesn’t equal bad morals but it can lead you to do bad things. Trust me I know, I have depression, anxiety and OCD. My OCD causes me to try to avoid particular things which I don’t always do in a nice way. I hurt people because I don’t want to deal with something related to it. This could be the same situation. The symptoms of BPD do explain why she would do this to hurt Melanie. For example some of the symptoms for BPD are pervasive instability in moods, distaste of one’s self image, insecurity and problems with interpersonal relationships. It seems logical with that info why she would do it if she is lying. Not to mention Timothy has claimed abuse on past bandmates of her old band Dresses where she only stayed cause they needed her voice. She has the history to make claims, I have no idea if it’s true though. She also allegedly molested a 16 year old girl. Also unsure if that’s true but if she did that she might have based the story on what she did since the story is quite similar. Regardless, here’s my complete opinion on the matter:

Timothy made it up for attention because she was jealous Melanie was focusing on her music not her and that she wasn’t as popular, probably a lot being because of her BPD. She knew a story like this would get attention and people would believe with the rising amount of sexual assault victims coming forward. So she posted it and then remembered she knew she had that picture of the game so she started basing it around that, picking a random date and saying it happened at Melanie’s house cause they are in her house in the pic, not knowing what Melanie actually did that day. However though she forgot the picture was dated and tried to blow it off as her iCloud being messed up which she supported by changing the date on recent pictures to awhile ago. And also she can’t remember parts of her story so she makes up new stuff and changes stuff a lot. Then she goes on to social media shading her and posting things about how hard it is to get empathy. Stuff like the picture on her IG story which is her crying (it just looks like she put in eyedrops to me) I would post but I hit the picture limit. She even contacted her friends to get in on it to make it look legit. She hasn’t gone to the cops because she knows they will find it bs and she’ll be revealed as lying. Most juries which are meant to be unbiased would side with Melanie because of the evidence so if it is false that explains why she hasn’t gone to the cops. And if it is real, honey if you don’t remember a part just say you don’t remember, it’s not helping your cause.

But that’s just my opinion, everyone has their own. There is probably even more to this that I don’t know but I shared everything I do. Though regardless let’s remember no side has concrete proof. To me everyone is innocent until proven guilty. You can’t really call her a good or a bad person and say it’s fact because you don’t know the truth. You can however support her by forming an opinion based on your own view of the situation. That doesn’t make you a bad person or someone who is defending rape. And to everyone who believes it: don’t get on the people who think it’s bullshit. You can’t deny there is a lot of holes in the story. And it doesn’t make you look better or woke nor is it siding with a potential rapist, it’s siding with evidence and your opinion. Evidence is better to side with than a potential victim just because they are a potential victim. Some people make stuff up. Even horrible things like that. Also don’t side with Melanie just because you like her, actually do some research and use your brain not your heart. It makes you a horrible person to just support her because “she’s my idol and a true fan would support her even if she’s a rapist!!!” That’s so fucked up. It truly makes me sick to hear delusional stans saying that. People like you are making the situation worse and contributing to rape culture. Delusional stans are also saying if you didn’t believe Melanie from the beginning on this situation you’re not a real fan. Which is not true at all. We are real fans, we just wanted to not instantly believe she didn’t do it because we like her. We wanted to figure out how we see the situation by looking at the evidence before jumping to conclusions. That makes us logical. On a similar note us questioning the situation and trying to find more information on it to form an opinion is also being logical. Not invalidating a potential rape victim. But rather doing the right thing and giving both parties the right to a fair trial. And if any of you are going to say: “why hasn’t Melanie done more about it then?” Would you want to talk about something like this? Something that damaged your career immensely? No, you wouldn’t. If it’s real, I’m sorry Timothy that this happened to you and Melanie deserves consequences. But if it is false, I’m sorry you have to deal with this Melanie and Timothy deserves consequences. Form your own opinion and please be respectful. I’m going to go back to supporting Melanie because I genuinely believe that she didn’t do it. That’s my decision, make your own. And don’t get on Melanie or Timothy, no cyber bullying them. Like I said you don’t know the truth nor do I, only they do. Even if you did being mean gets you nowhere. Now let’s just let this go and move forward from it.

#melanie martinez #timothy heller #i want to say as well i told both my mom and bf about this #i told the whole story and they both think something is up with timothy’s story #they don’t care nor really know about either of them #so their opinion is as unbiased as it can get #and they both think she’s lying #take that as you will #also i want to say i feel so free posting this #like i cut those chains holding me down to perfection #holding me back #not letting me be me #i’m so proud of myself for doing this #it’s a big step towards getting better

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psyopmyself · 6 years

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Today I got a bipolar diagnosis

edit: btw, nobody was injured when i crashed. it was into a light post and nobody was around.

There is confetti everywhere around my room. And I am confused why there is such a mess and why it’s so pretty to me and also why despite seeing beauty in the mess I feel uncomfortable with my space having little shit all over it and I want it to be clean. Today shit hit the fan and the shit was a balloon and when it hit the fan it erupted and confetti flew everywhere. I got a bipolar diagnosis today. After nearly 10 years of clinical diagnoses from major depression, generalized anxiety, ocd tendency, mania, psychosis, to a literal thought disorder called delusional disorder, as well as PTSD, today I heard something that felt like it contains all of me and there is room for me to be me and not feel so confused and like my identity is all over the place depending which disorder is showing it’s face most. I am Cassidy Jean Gardner, and I am bipolar with PTSD. I feel terrified and so confused and Im crying while I write this but the tears feel like a relief a sweet rush of acceptance from and for myself that I have been yearning for for a long, long time. My therapist believes I have mixed manic-depressive bipolar called cyclothymic bipolar, not to be confused with a less “emotionally intense” cyclothymia diagnosis. With my understanding so far, I understand that Bipolar 1 is characterized by more manic tendencies with depressive stints. Bipolar 2 is characterized by more depressive tendencies with hypomanic bursts. The difference between these types of bipolar and the one have been experiencing the spectrum of for the last 2 and a half years years for sure is that BP 1&2 symptoms of mania or depression last several days, weeks, or months. Cyclothymic bipolar experiences of mania and depression can last hours. I have been so confused by my own mind for so long, and like my emotional responses to things were never valid, true, natural, and in my manic times, not even human. I can go from being manic to then coming across something that doesn’t fit my manic ideology and having an extremely depressed, hopeless response, to, sometimes it feels like minutes later, come up with a new “solution” that helps me feel better and relieved of the shame i feel about my manic beliefs and world view that I go right back up there again, and the cycle repeats. Thinking myself in and out of mania it can feel like. The days when I am not crippled or at best, so far, consistently hindered, by the accompanying anxiety of not having much of a sense of emotional normalcy or “neutral” perspective on things are my best days. The days when I am hypomanic, and I decide to scrap everything I’ve been working toward and stop identifying with these things in the name of authenticity libration and creativity, are my favorite right now, and that is hard. because it’s not super helpful to be this way- so passionate and “righteous”- that i throw out the window regard for any sort of routine i have worked hard to establish myself in the name of having “figured out something better”. It’a hard to feel so happy I can’t listen to my rational self because I feel so intoxicated by the feeling of happiness motivation and productivity I so crave. I am not sure what is harder. Being so manic that I become psychotic, completely delusional to the point that I literally believe I am Satan or Lucifer herself and that everything around me is confirming this horrible burden yet somehow “karmic blessing” that I never asked for, the the times when my depression is so bad I sleep for 16 hours of the day, have no motivation to even fathom life becoming better ever, and prefer to dream than live waking, walking life. I have lived in ambivalence for years, and as a coping mechanism I convinced myself I thrived in this arena. I see myself in front of the pendulum that is my mind. Every day it swings and I try to control it. It doesn’t stop swinging. It swings so roughly and rapidly that it flys out of the bars holding it up often. It’s like there is a wind pushing it that is the devil itself tricking me by being “invisible” aka not existing. When it’s on the manic side, I try to grab it and in the process get picked up off the ground and everything around the pendulum gets knocked over in my efforts to hold the pendulum and keep it on the “happy” side. Like the things around me are my life that I’ve built and they will fall as easily as bowling pins. There is no weight to keep them stable when I hit them. The foundation is slippery. On the depressive side, I rush over angry that I wasn’t strong enough to hold things on the manic side and desperately try to push it back toward my “happy” side, but it is so so fucking heavy. and I don’t remember it being that heavy and I cannot believe I ever fathomed loving the pendulum I was clinging to sometimes minutes earlier. Shame guilt self loathing. compared to my visions of grandiosity, of the world revolving around me, of having a sense of self worth and confidence and the courage to claim it and say hey i deserve to feel good about myself. to god how dare I ever think that. I am the most selfish person on the planet the sheer vain and foolishness to believe everything even anything really could possible be about or for me. I like to believe that I am somewhere in the middle. I prefer the hypomanic side, and this is a detriment as well, because i can easily get too high. but the hypomanic can be so... fun. The bits of excessive energy, the slightly inflated sense of self worth, the belief that I can follow my dreams and the ability to use my mind to direct my thoughts toward ways to create strategy to get where I want and build stepping stones. The fear of fallibility. the anxiety that comes with ever feeling good about myself from the ptsd of that abusive relationship and that night especially. I shouldn’t plan, because they will be foiled, if not by me by a man most likely. nowhere is safe, especially not my own mind. thats’s where I perceived love, and oh hasn’t god shown me how powerful that is. being so manic that I confuse the feeling with someone being my soulmate, twin flame, my destiny. telling that person and responding to the rejection emotionally by going psychotic and fully delusional. How afraid I have been to love, of my own love, being truly loved that i don’t feel the need to constantly prove myself, and certainly the idea of ever loving myself for being who I am. In 2016 when I got PTSD and no longer was the “high functioning” “mentally ill” girl I was before, many people treated me like I had fallen from grace and it was my fault. Thank fucking god for the people who have been here for me. So many people took this as an opportunity it felt to slander me. “ha, I knew she wasn’t so wonderful, look how crazy she is. She intentionally crashed her car. who does that?” a person who is so confused with their undiagnosed bipolar and the fact they are going through a manic episode as a response to intense trauma therapy does that. I was told my whole life I was wonderful for being pretty and intelligent, and what a special combination. what a bitch of a “gift”. The two things I was naturally both with and did not earn, my intelligence and my body and my face. What about my humor? What about my ability to be a good friend? What about how hard I work? I was told I should never dare praise myself for these things because I was already “lucky enough” to be praised for the things I never asked for but was given by either genetics or fate- god knows. I have so many feelings. and I’m so grateful to know that I am impulsive. Sure, I’m “spiritually gifted”, but not necessarily everything has to be a blaring call from god or synchronicity that I must act on immediately if I want to see the “right things”, see the world the “right way”, and “be where I am to be”. My perfectionism has nearly killed me. Seeking to be spiritually perfect because I sure has hell was not physically or mentally perfect, I mean, look at those guys and girls more “beautiful”, look at those men and women more “accomplished”. And the brainwashed peers (not their fault) for idolizing me, giving me a sense of power I never fucking sought. Sure. Maybe you can make the argument that my “soul wanted this”, but suffering was never in the deal. and I have suffered. I have been so miserable I didn’t even know how to fathom the energy to put together a plan to kill myself. and thank god for that level of depression, because I didn’t die. because I’m supposed to be here and finally I feel I can make some peace with my singular identity as Me, Cassie. someone who is fun, funny, smart, relatable, bipolar, and so much more. I feel terrified of stigmatization even though I know it’s fucked up that it even exists. At least, I think, with the delusional disorder diagnosis, even though it was similar to a schizophrenic diagnosis just lacking frequency of symptoms, hardly anybody knew what it was. Oh I have a thought disorder and the propensity to think in delusional ways sometimes. NBD tho as u can see I’m perfectly fine :). So many more people know about bipolar. And many have strong opinions. The plus here is that there is more push to end stigmatization and more research into ways to cope manage and accept this diagnosis which I am so thankful for, and more easily accessible community. There was nothing on delusional disorder. It was so uncommon that when my psychiatrist in the rehab told my therapist what my diagnosis was she handed me the DSM to read about it because she didn’t know what it was. Yeah, I went to rehab. Last november (2017) I had a psychotic break, though it was not my first experience with delusion. I became manic as a response to feeling rejected by a guy and it escalated to me hardly sleeping, doing a lot of cocaine and other drugs, and having a full blown psychotic break. I experienced psychosis for 2 and a half months. The first 3 weeks of this stint it was all i could feel or think about. At first it was fun, until it wasn’t. I legitimately thought that there was a secret society the illuminati that had been made to “illuminate” me, that all art had been inspired by me, the energetic muse, lucifer “finally reincarnating” back to earth in the age of aquarius and dawn of immortality, and nobody around me was safe because I was all that was valued by this illuminati and the people who I loved most were in danger because while I loved them most and the illuminati knew this, the illuminati was angry that these people has hurt me, someone who was so impressionable, “born schizophrenic and able to hide it in order to learn about ‘normal society’”, and were responsible for the pain I felt which I handled with negative coping mechanisms like addiction. So it was my job to create worldly and spiritual circumstances to keep them safe from disaster and accident or murder because they all felt so bad about hurting me subconsciously that they had less of a will to live, and this was a dangerous way to think, subconsciously of course. That I was everyone’s higher self in the 4d’s favorite 3d person other than their person, and that they all were working to send me messages from the consciously unaware around me. I was fully out too my mind. I legitimately thought I was lucifer, the most hated person on the planet but god’s favorite angel, ready to ask for entry back into heaven. And the only thing that was me was my fear response to my thoughts and the way I read into everything. no I can’t dare think this this can’t dare be true but somehow everything around me is telling me it is. Literally fuck this. I felt that I needed to be with loved ones constantly to “keep them safe” and I understandably was simultaneously scaring the shit out of my family due to my mental health, and exhausting them. my mom and I both agreed the best thing was for me to go into a treatment center, the rose house. A “dual-diagnosis” rehab that treated mental health and addiction. Cool, well when I got there apparently every single reason I had mental health problems was because I had used substances, not because I had struggled with my mental health since becoming conscious in light of my father passing when i was almost 9 and eventually found drugs as a coping mechanism. I felt shamed for my addiction to marijuana and 100% misunderstood and ostracized. out of the 15 women there all of the girls my age were in primarily for addiction and the only woman who was there for first mental health was an older woman named Kathleen, and she wasn’t an addict. The delusions never stopped I got better at hiding them. I was heavily medicated, afraid, fearing homelessness if i didn’t follow my family wishes to finish the 90 day program, and still pretty insane. After I got my diagnosis I left the treatment the night I got onto “transition” 67 days in and got my phone back, called a friend, and got brought up to fort collins where thank god emma was willing to let me stay with her. Miraculously, the delusions stopped within days. I was no longer so stressed and afraid that I couldn’t think for myself. I was bipolar this entire time. and my mania was “so irrational and unrecognizable” that they didn’t even know to recognize that this was my issue, it was more like I was “almost schizophrenic” without the visual hallucinations or auditory hallucinations. I wasn’t hearing other voices, but the voice in my head wanted me dead just as much as it told me I had a special reason to stay alive. I had a “sane reaction to insane circumstances”, and I temporally lost my mind. and I was petrified and anxiety ridden to the point I couldn’t function for months. I couldn’t make a single decision for weeks without going into full blown panic. I felt like everyone knew something that I didn’t and that they couldn’t tell me what I thought I knew, just give me hints, because otherwise they could be punished and also because they “believed in me”. I felt horribly betrayed while simultaneously fearing abandonment and isolation so much I felt I had developed Stockholm syndrome.

When I experienced full blown psychosis that was so scary, my whole life went to shit. I lost my scholarships. I lost my house in boulder so my family could afford rehab. everything changed while I was in panic and when I “returned” to a “normal” state of mind I couldn’t recognize anything in my own life, even myself. When I was on medication I gained 70 pounds in 2 and a half months. I went into rehab 95 pounds. I was so manic for months, either full blown or hypo, that I would forget to eat. And I was 165 when I left. I hated my life and the months following I was more depressed than I can ever remembered. I relapsed in april. april to september was a mix of drugs and romance that I don’t really care for. When I got sober again, prompted by a really scary night of returning to psychotic thinking which I thankfully learned reality checking skills for, I feel like after 4 almost 5 years of using drugs I was finally ready to stop feeling so out of control, at least with my substance use. Thank god for today, no matter how afraid i am of my future. I am just as hopeful. I have for hate myself for the ways I have treated people in my manic episodes, my family in my depressive episodes, and how I can hardly even remember it. but I do not deserve to feel this hate. I was suffering. I was living in a world I hadn’t found the words to describe. and now I know. That I am beautiful. truly. inside and out. and I have a beautiful mind. I love fiercely. I believe I can make a contribution to help “save the world”. That those who are mentally ill should be hugged tightly when they need it, that schizophrenic people especially, imo, are horribly and unfairly understood and deserve to feel cherished and accepted just as much as anyone else, not to be feared and casted out of society. I believe every single person no matter what deserves to know they are not alone, no matter how lonely they feel, and so much more good. I am not the ugly or the bad. I am a motherfucking survivor. And thank god I didn’t die the day I re-enacted my dad’s car accident. Because I do have a purpose, and it is special. Most importantly, it’s just as special as everyone else’s special purpose. We are all in this together. And I’m excited to find a community of people who have fought similar battles. Who I can laugh about my “a trillion under the sun” delusions with and find humor in the ways my mind sought to preserve a will to live. and how other people have done the same. I am me, and today I became free of my own condemnation. I will struggle, but now I know there is community and resources that I don’t need to scour the earth to find. I have a home, and it is here, proud to be me. There is confetti everywhere around my room. Who knew that balloon I had been so afraid of letting go of was my own attempt to celebrate myself. I may feel late to my own party, but I’m here now. And there is no problem with not wanting my room to always look like a wild rave. I can always make more confetti, anyways :)

To end with some gratitude, thank god for my true friends and my family. Emma has never left my side as my best friend, even in the distance of living in different parts of the state. She is my best fucking friend. My other close best friends as well, who have not been afraid to hug me when I swore to them my entire body was covered in needles. My mom, who has done everything for me to make sure I know I am never truly alone, no matter how much my mind tries to tell me otherwise. For my little brother, for putting up with my craziness and still being willing to love me and laugh with me at the end of the day. Everyone in my life now is so beautiful it’s hard to deny that there may be some beauty in me, too, then, if they all tell me they like when I’m around. I’m grateful to know that my father, who i have idolized though gone now, was whole loved by the people around me. Whose described as “large than life” personality and substance abuse may have been a way to mask bipolar symptoms, was still a loved personality and loved person. This I know. This people have convinced me. and that I am of him just as much as I am of my mother. I’m grateful for the mental health professionals who have not given up on me, even when they required i be medicated in order to be able to be worked with, even when i was misdiagnosed, these people have helped to save my life too. so many times. And I am so grateful for my higher power, for prayer, the only thing that felt safe to think that sometimes I would just repeat the serenity prayer for hours for the sake of at least having a way to direct my anxious energy and not be in panic from my own delusional thoughts. God, who has always shown me that i will never be truly abandoned or given up on, who has helped me understand my higher power as something that is absolutely not punitive. My family and friends have been my lifeboats, and god, the universe, gaia, the god in every person, has shown me how to survive the storm. I am. I desire. I see. and i am free.

This has been such a clusterfuck of emotions coming out that I have been wanting to feel for a long time and as messy as this is i’m grateful as well for the will to sit through this and write about these experiences, no matter the feelings they bring up. Because know I feel free to understand that the feelings will pass, sometimes more quickly than others, and that I can always survive. Even when that’s all I “manage” to do. Today. I stayed sober. I laughed. I put up the christmas tree with my mom and brother. I talked on the phone with my best friend. I told close friends what I learned about myself today. and I got diagnosed with bipolar. and I found a hope and interpretation for my mental narrative that I never felt was right for me because i don’t understand the words for what i was experiencing. I have learned today. And I have grown. and I am smiling as i finish typing this with tears rolling down my face, because I believe I can be happy. Sustainably happy. and sustainably grateful and hopeful when it’s hard to get to feeling the happiness. I believe and I survive. and I become<3 I am 21. I am brilliant. and I am bipolar.

#bipolar #personal #off my chest #very personal #text

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autismisaokay · 6 years

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I saw a really good post today about how autism affects @cactus-spirit and I thought oh man this is a really great idea! Not only is it helpful when you have those moments when you feel like “Am I faking?” But I think its a great idea of showing how together but diverse everyone is on the spectrum to just have one post where you can go back to.

So here’s how my autism affects me and kind of also some of the things that I do that female’s with autism get put under as symptoms.

- My sensory development got worse as a an adult and what I mean by that is almost everything makes me want to puke or have a headache.

- I don’t wear makeup.

- My special interests are still very important to me but not as intense as they use to be.

- Background noise is higher than it should be and I can’t filter it out. In fact when I’m mad at something it just get’s louder.

- Although I’ve gotten better at making friends, in the beginning, I still can’t keep friends. I tend to fall apart after a while and I get anxiety from hanging out with them. Like everything they do starts to annoy me and I know it’s not their fault. I also always worry I’m being a bad friend.

- I’m terrible with names and forget things midway through sentences every time I speak. Unless it’s very simplex answers my sentences are never going to be the way I imagined them. It can also take me a while to get the answers out.

- Hypersensitive/Hyper defensive.

- I tend to work better with people if I have already planned out activities.

- I will have foods that I will only exclusively eat and then all of a sudden get sick of them and switch to a new group of select foods. I can’t ever eat to place something in my body for substance. It has to be specific foods.

- I always have to be the good guy and if someone sees me as the bad guy I completely break down and have meltdowns.

- I repeat phrases and words without meaning to when I explain something. My explanation can be long-winded at times as well.

- I like sounds in short bursts. Even when I’m watching shows I’ll get over stimulated and have to turn them off. Unless it’s something I’m highly interested in.

- I tend to stick to only one or two people like glue even when I want to hang out with other people. I become overstimulated and anxious thinking about other friends.

- I’m super imaginative and have creative thinking skills.

- I tend to see the best in people which can be awesome but it’s more of a coping strategy for me because I have a hard time processing being let down.

- I work best with schedules but can’t make schedules and asking for help when I feel vulnerable sends me in spirals. It’s not that I can’t ask for help it just takes a lot of spoons for me to do it.

- HELL NO to change.

- I don’t do well in clumped up crowds when the crowds are spread out I feel a little better.

- I hate to be touched except for by one person. I will allow occasional hugs as long as someone asks me.

- I’ve never been in AP classes but I was called smart or gifted. Really it just meant I listened to rules better than most kids my age and behaved better than them. Which I feel is kinda shitty because they were just acting like kids now that I think about it.

- Extremely bad high school experience and bullied all through middle school. Whenever someone brings up high school it bring’s out my PTSD and I become depressed.

- When I was a kid, kids scared the living shit out of me.

- I had a very extensive vocabulary as a child.

- A strong sense of justice.

- I have selective words I stick to. “Yeah” is one of the big ones.

- Echolalia.

- I like working by myself unless I’m the leader in creative type projects.

- I fidget with my body. Twirling hair, pulling out my nails, ripping off my skin, scratching, or straightening my body out, picking my chapped lips.

- I need to be stimulated at all times another wise I fall asleep breifly. I can’t really sleep well.

- I have very low stamina.

- OCD, Depression, and high anxiety.

- I look way younger than I actually am most people mistake me for a teenager when I’m in my mid-twenties.

- I can keep a conversation going to a degree as well as my ability to grasp social quotas quickly when properly explained to me. However, I don’t just get them right away off the bat.

- I need things to be broken down for me.

- Masking.

- I hate wearing clothes.

- Black and white thinking.

#actually autistic #autism acceptance #autism #asd #pride

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hegglespeggles · 6 years

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Mental Illness, the Honour System, and the Commodification of Human Beings.

Hi. I’m Peggy. I have a mental illness.

People talk a lot about mental illness. It’s kind of a Thing. It pops up when a teen commits suicide, or there is a mass shooting, but especially at Halloween, where monstrous “psychopaths” and “schizoids” charge at us with their chainsaws from the dark corners of haunted houses and our screens. Particularly, a good chunk of the discussion tends to centre on how to integrate these mentally ill people, with their strange green-skin and their funny antennae, into our society full of humans. I find a lot of this dialogue to miss the point, so like every person with an opinion and a keyboard, I’m going to offer mine.

I was diagnosed with Generalized Anxiety Disorder and Major Depressive Disorder when I was 15. When I was 19, those were both were discovered to be manifestations of PTSD from an emotionally abusive and neglectful childhood. I was hospitalized at 16 for a suicide attempt (the most successful in a chain which started when I was 12) and have been in therapy ever since. With the right combination of medications, therapy, and accommodations from my university, I am in my second year studying Music at Western University and have a part time job. I also do musicals with the campus theatre society and do a bunch of writing and composing and occasionally, stand-up comedy. I spend my summers working at an overnight camp and I want to be a music therapist when I finish school.

I tell you all of this for two reasons. One, that I am not some waif withering away from some romantic disease, like a modern-day Victorian heroine. I am not some tortured saint who is just too delicate for this world. I am loud, and abrasive, I love my friends and strangers with the same ferocity and I give great advice. It just so happens that last week I was also spending about 4-6 hours a day staring at a very specific chink on my balcony because my brain was shutting down and I had no ability to focus and very little awareness of what’s happening around me. (This is what the psychologist-types would call a “Hypoarousal Trauma Response” and it is just as scary as it sounds.) This is a very foreign concept for a lot of people, and before I finish this I’ll probably end up trying to explain it even more, because yeah, part of what makes this such a hard concept to grasp is that even those who suffer from it have trouble describing it. Lumping us all together is difficult for the same reasons lumping cancer patients together is difficult. In the same way that leukemia, brain tumors and melanoma are all vastly different from each other, I could no sooner fully grasp what its like to have OCD, or schizophrenia, but I’m going to accept that your melanoma has different symptoms than my leukemia. Please don’t ask me what I did to catch it, or if I’ve tried this herbal remedy, or tell me that you don’t think that my medication is a good idea, because its messing with my brain. I know it does. That’s the point.

Secondly, please understand that those with these illnesses are under no obligation to prove themselves to you. I have had many a boss or professor push for details of my diagnosis, to the point where one professor asked for the nitty-gritty of my abuse. And hey, I get it, we all love salacious gossip and exciting backstories on the people around us. But the problem is that what is your fun real-life soap opera, or your next conversation topic for Girls-night-in, that same problem is the reason that I wake up screaming in the middle of the night, or hyperventilate, shake, and vomit until I pass out. It’s the same way that while Game of Thrones is fun to watch, no one would want to live there. I am offering my issues up as a platform and case study for discussion, and so please, I ask you to pick and prod and ask questions, (As any of my friends will tell you, I have dangerously little filter,) but the people you meet and interact with in the world, you must understand that their struggles are their own bruises to pick at and not yours. These are issues that we struggle to talk about with ourselves, let alone other humans. I understand the desire to verify the truth, but that is a job for professionals, (with all due respect,) not you.

And that’s the crux of the issue isn’t it? Mental illness is antithetical to our society’s method of dealing with the ill. It’s not a linear healing journey, and its not always a cold that you can muscle through. Submitting the proper paperwork and showing up for disability meetings and the fighting and clawing and demanding the help with is your right (the difficulty of access to which is its own discussion) is something which is difficult and frustrating under the best of circumstances, and is infinitely more difficult when the very nature of your illness is to convince you that you are an unworthy burden, sapping any focus and energy you had to do it anyway. Perhaps more frighteningly, it is an invisible illness. There is no way to tell if someone is faking it or not, and in our empirical, productivity-based society, that is a frightening notion: if some people, not for lack of trying or desire to do so, cannot function at peak efficiency most of the time, how do we measure their worth?

I can feel your incredulity, but I mean it. We pay a lot of lip service to being well rounded and self-care, which to my delight is becoming more and more mainstream, but for most it’s a lofty dream, on par with being a Best-Selling Novelist, or owning a home in Toronto. But check some twitter bios, and go on some first dates, or a party with lots of people with people you don’t really know, and you’ll notice we define ourselves by our careers, what we do, not who we are. So, what do I say when I spend an alarming amount of time fetal on my floor this morning because I didn’t have the energy to get up, and even if I did, my brain is screaming how burdensome I am to any system with which I interact?

See, we grew up in this culture too. We internalized that otherness and vague discomfort with mental illness too, often long before symptoms started manifesting. So, all that frustration and confusion at how we can’t just get up and do things, we feel that too. It all adds to the melange of confusion and self-hatred. On top of that, we see the same people who wear their neurodivergence like a shiny new thing which separates them from the normies who just don’t get it. Believe me, it makes me just as angry. I would do just about anything on this earth to be one of those normies. I believe in self acceptance and loving yourself for who you are, right now, but I also must believe in the innate human lust for self improvement, and that we all must take active steps in our lives to better ourselves every day. It’s hard, but it must be done. My illness is not beautiful, but it is also not a flaw. It is a part of myself which a work everyday to improve, and that involves taking hard, humbling looks at how I interact with the world and working hard to turn that into tangible change. Again, this shows us where that tangible change gets sticky: its different for everyone. For me, that means working on my trust issues. In order to tell my friends something as small as my age and birthday, I had to be at least five glasses into a case of boxed wine and spent the next week a broken shell of a human crying in bed as a result. In a culture which vilifies mental illness, and expects objective proof of things, where do I go from here? Surely, this is not my fault, as this was a misstep in an ever-present journey to be the best version of myself that I can be. Likewise, how do I, or anyone around me, know whether I’m faking it? How do my professors know that I am not just blowing off class because I don’t want to go?

Now of course, I’m lucky. I am a white, pretty, middle-class woman who has a very agreeable personality. This means people are more likely to give me lots of extra chances and help me out. My family had the money to put me into therapy. I’m also lucky that I’ve had lots of experience pushing through the system, first trying to access support on my own when I was 13. This means I have no fear asking for accommodation, and I have the vocabulary to describe what I need. But what about people who don’t fit the key demographic for what we expect mental illness to look like? Or people who don’t know where to start, or think that they deserve it? What about men, who are just as likely to suffer from these issues but only a fraction as likely to seek help? And while we’re at it, what about people who will experience anxiety and depression without it being a full-on disorder? I am a rare unicorn in that I have the support I need, and the self assurance to speak up when I am not getting it. But why should someone in my position, which I stress again, is an almost impossible best-case scenario, be the only person who is allowed to access support to it’s fullest? Even with a well documented diagnosis and disability accommodations, I have professors and bosses who express disappointment in my inability to function. It leaves me wanting to scream “I know! I’m angry at myself too!”

The best way to explain it is that it feels a bit like having your insides vacuum sealed to the point where breathing feels like trying to pull against the vacuum, being blindfolded and thrown naked into a pool of maple syrup which has thumbtacks at the bottom and trying to make it to some nebulous “other side” of the pool. Meanwhile everyone in your life is waiting on the other side of a door for you and you can hear them telling you that “you should be moving faster,” and that “you don’t have it that bad.” You also don’t want to be doing this, but you don’t know where the pool stops, how to avoid the thumbtacks, or how to move faster through the syrup. You start to wonder if the pool is infinite, is this just what your life is, and how you’ll ever accomplish anything.

That’s why I need the support. Because its handy to get an extension on a paper when all of a sudden, the pressure of the vacuum seal is too strong, and I need to remember how to breathe. Its really nice to not be penalized for not going to a rehearsal because I was busy fishing a thumbtack out of my foot. And its difficult to describe what’s happening to me when I’m blindfolded, so I have no way to describe where I am. Everyone around me is waiting for me to get to the other side of the room, but they aren’t allowed in, so they can’t see that in order to do this, I have to traverse this surrealist obstacle course. My academic accommodation is someone telling my professors that my room is a bit more difficult than other rooms, and my therapist is up in the spectator gallery, talking me through it from the PA system. Medication is like a pair of flipflops. I’m lucky to have these things, but what about someone who doesn’t know how to work the PA system? Or someone who’s superiors think they’re taking a nap in that room? What about someone who doesn’t realize their room has a pool in it, and now they’ve fallen head-over-foot into it?

This is why I’m about to propose a mildly radical thought: If someone says they’re struggling, believe them. Give them the benefit of the doubt, that they are actually doing their best. Yes, there will be people who abuse the system, but don’t you think that letting them go, is worth helping people who need it? Otherwise, we run the risk of throwing more thumbtacks in the pool of someone who is genuinely trying to meet you halfway. Likewise, these people are not delicate flower petals who just couldn’t cope with the difficulty of their room. They’re just as capable, and strong as anyone coming out of any other rooms. Maybe their syrup was a bit deeper, or there were more thumbtacks, or to this day they aren’t quite sure of the shape of the pool and they’ve tripped and fallen back in a few times. All that does is speak about their pool. Not them. They didn’t build the room, and they didn’t ask for this room so that you would pity them. Who would want to go through a room like that? All they want is someone waiting at the door and cheering them on, without hurrying them.

When you live in a society that is timing how quickly you can get through rooms and how far you can get, it’s a wildly daunting task to not only believe that you can get through the room, but that doing so is worth risking stepping on another thumbtack, and making sure that you’re taking the air you need. For me, I don’t know if there will ever be a point where someone releases the vacuum seal, but that is something I can live with. I like so many others, am just desperately yelling to the people on the other side of the door to wait for me until I get there. I know I won’t be able to make it through with the times that other people have, and in our society’s way of measure success, that means I’m not as good. The only way to reconcile this is for us all to realize the differences in our rooms, and that we might not be able to directly compare times. Its frustrating and complicated, that there wont be such a clear one-to-one comparison of our successes, but isn’t it that much more rewarding to know that you’re actually be timed for what you actually have to go through?

So, my professors won’t know that I’m not faking it. My friends are waiting on the other side, and they’re probably getting annoyed at how long they have to wait for me. All I can do, all any of us can do, is call out to them that our room is a little bit weird, and that we’re still trying to make it to the other side, but it’s going to take a while. I guess I just hope that the world takes us at our word.

#actual blog post #actual blogging #thatmentalhealththing #mental health #mentally ill #school #studyblr

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anakinskywalkerog · 2 years

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I feel weird about saying I have ocd cuz I'm more or less cured like I wouldn't say that I'm in a state of disorder my life is no longer just hours upon hours of compulsions but like I still do some weird shit I would say I have residue from the disorder that won't leave and that depending on anxiety and situation the ocd can take stronger hold but as I said I'm no longer in a state of disorder so I dunno what the heck to say to people when they question my weird little behaviours and anxiety. I feel kind of guilty just going oh yeah I do that cuz ocd because I'm no longer in disorder but then again I'm not gonna go into my whole psychological history y'know 🤣

Girl kinda same about the fandom obsession thing, that's what I'm doing with starwars rn for avoidance and now I'm over 3 months behind in my assignments whoops P.s this is SandArt anon lol The kenobi show was soooo good though

The media portrayal of ocd and a lot of other mental disorders is so crap and surface level that I just ignore it or it'll make me mad, I'd rather media just not go there. The one thing I've seen that is pretty accurate is Leonard Decaprio in The Aviator. That showed how strange and weird or even kind of asshole-ish the sufferer appears to 'normal' people. And the complete decline of the character until he wasn't even a person anymore, he was just a vessel for whatever nonsensical torture the disorder needed carried out. The sheer disfunction was shown. Like boy ended up cording off parts of his house because they weren't 'clean' enough til he ended up with one room that he deemed 'uncontaminated/safe' and lo and behold that room didn't have bathroom facilties so he was urinating in bottles. In real life I would never admit to relating to that but yeah

In your fic master yuma and readers emotional force connection thing would be SO good for ocd therapy/cbt like yuma's force presence and emotional knowledge could be used to kind of insert itself into your own force presence and alleviate the anxiety to the point where the obsession or thought no longer has any power and then you'd be free from compulsions

I haven't seen the Aviator in a long time so I can't remember how it ends, I'm gonna maybe watch it again, there is a dinner scene in it though that is so relatable it's kinda funny like just the way everyone was looking at him like he was deranged and you could see in his eyes that he was like silently communicating that yes he is in fact aware that this is crazy but he still has to 🤣

i haven’t actually seen Aviator. i do definitely relate to having some weird needs/preferences, or getting upset about something that my ex partner/family/friends would have no idea why anyone would get upset about haha

i’m not sure anyone is ever cured of any mental illness, but they definitely change and evolve over time and can get better or different. even as i talk about these obsessive symptoms i’ve had, i definitely recognize my illness has gotten a lot better over the years, or maybe i’ve gotten better at dealing with it? idk 🤷‍♀️

i would LOVE IT if Master Yuma is real i mean i know the whole fic is the Anakin fantasy but honestly it’s also a parental fantasy lol having an older mentor to watch over you and take care of you? sounds nice 😭

#star wars #anakin skywalker #ocd tag #ocdawareness #ocd #answered asks

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anothergirlrecovering · 6 years

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Lynn 88

Lynn emailed me and said that she was stuck at a railroad crossing so she was going to be late. I walked across the parking lot and use the bathroom there and her door was still locked so I just stayed outside until she arrived. When she got there she apologize and I was like it’s fine I use the bathroom across the parking lot and she was like oh really can you do that and I was like I mean no one said anything and she was like OK will that’s good to now. She told me to go in and I sat down and she fiddled with the lock and said that it hasn’t been working right and then she went in her office and got my chart out and invited me in. She was like you were out of town last week right? And I was like yeah I went and saw Hamilton and she was like oh that’s right how was it and I was like it was really good but honestly listen I felt like it was kind of overrated for what it was and she was like you know my husband said the exact same thing and I was like well I mean like it was a good show but I would never have seen it if I hadn’t known what it was and thought oh my god this is the best show ever and totally deserves several hundred dollar tickets. She said her has been absolutely hated it because he was like this was literally just three hours of people standing around and wrapping. I Aster if he had listened to the music had of time and she said no and she thinks that would have helped because she was like it’s different if you know all the music and I was like yeah thankfully my friends had said it would help to listen to the music I had of time so I made sure I did and I looked up all the lyrics in the plot so that I would definitely know what was going on but even then there were a few parts that I was like what are they saying. She said yeah she definitely understood and I was like in I didn’t really like the Aaron burr that we had but I watched a bootleg so I saw the real deal online and she was like OK that’s good and I said that I would be going to New York in September and that yesterday was my birthday and my brother’s girlfriend texted me about it and she asked me if I would want to see pretty woman for my birthday. Lynn was like oh my gosh I really want to see that to you! She said she’s going next week with her daughter to bring her to school and she is trying to figure out what she will see but she really wants to see carousel since it is closing but she also wants to see pretty woman and she was like I think I might see a few of them and I was like and come from away? And she was like I don’t know it’s up there as one of the maybes and I was like I know I know you’re not sold on it but I really want you to see it that way you can tell me if you end up liking it because I really loved it and she was like I know, but she said she would see how much time she has and what tickets available and the costs for them. I said that made sense and she was like pretty woman is a classic and I love the movie and you know it’s a stereo typical prostitute love story and I was like don’t ruin it for me actually haven’t seen the movie yet but my husband and I will watch it this weekend. She was like really and I was like yeah I’ve been super movie deprive my whole life and she was like OK and then she asked what else has been going on and I was like well the other good thing was that I semi-impulsively but not really impulsively bought a piano keyboard. I was like I had a really bad sinus infection for like the last two weeks and she was like really my daughter had a really bad virus and she said that there’s a virus going around and it’s mostly her throat and was like yeah I had a fever but it was definitely a sinus infection and she was like yeah my daughter had a fever too and she said they thought it was mono because it was kind of on and off for a little bit but she was feeling pretty terrible and now she’s feeling better and I was like yeah I don’t know maybe it was the virus that caused the sinus infection and she was like yeah you sound terrible and I was like I mean thanks and she was like well I’m being honest and I was like yeah so anyway so I bought a keyboard and I was like listen of this and don’t judge me because I totally have had laryngitis so pretend that’s not a thing and I played or the beginning of she used to be mine that I recorded myself playing and singing and she was like oh that’s so good and she was like you’ve seen waitress right? And I was like yeah and I don’t actually know how to play the piano but I want to learn and that seems like an easier one to get the hang of Sam there was that and I was like otherwise there really hasn’t been anything going on just because I’ve been mainly sick and not doing anything. I was like but also my dad irritated me yesterday because on my birthday he asked if I was going to have cheat meals since I said I was going to take it manage of all the birthday freebies at restaurants and it just made me mad because it’s like he knows my history and he knows that I’m definitely not on a diet or anything so it was super unnecessary and also that I was thinking after our session a lot about my childhood phobia and just how I realized that I know Lynn has always said that I have some OCD traits but thinking back on childhood I was like you know I really realized that I had contamination OCD that kind of went comorbid with the phobia as a result of the phobia assume and I explained I had all of these checking behaviors and rituals like always checking where the garbage was in the exits were so that way I wouldn’t know where to go if I was going to throw up and the constantly checking in and making sure other people aren’t sick or things like that and I said I just hadn’t really thought about it and I told her about how my husband got violently ill and threw up on his birthday and I had a panic attack and cried and kicked him out of the bathroom and it really bothers me because I’m obviously not over it and I would like to be over it for my future children. She brought up the OCD aspect and was like if it’s more of the OCD stuff we can treat that and she asked if I did the specific OCD protocol with people with EMD are and I said actually hadn’t and she said it’s about reducing the urges to do compulsions and I said oh and I explained that while I definitely had a lot of those rituals and compulsions throughout childhood and adolescence and even as if I got in college, I feel like it’s a lot better and I don’t have those rituals anymore but I think actually what stop that was that because of my own purging I’m no longer scared of myself I’m annoying so it doesn’t feel like OCD is a problem anymore and she was like oh OK. She asked what I thought the issue was that I was feeling stuck I feel like we ended up having a conversation about the whole phobia situation that we’ve had many times before where she was basically like there’s no way to test whether or not you are over this and what is it that you are feeling stuck on and I was like honestly I don’t really know and then I got anxious and I was like this is literally what is Sony got nasty with me about was the fact that she kept pressing me and I was like I really don’t know and I wish that I did and I was like maybe that feeling trapped feeling because I was in the bathroom and cornered but I could’ve easily step aside so I don’t think it’s that but maybe it was the anticipation aspect because I knew that it might happen again versus a year ago for my birthday somebody threw up at the baseball game and I didn’t have any time to anticipate it it just happened and she was like yeah I don’t know. She was like I mean it’s possible that panic attacks just happened and I was like no they don’t and she was like yes they do and I was like if it was an isolated incident sure like at the acupuncturist I was thinking about my car accident I can get on board with that, but this was super specific tied to a specific phobia and Lynn was like panic attacks just happen man and I was like random ones sure and she was like symptoms they just happen and she said how last year her and her daughter were in New York City and they got locked out of her apartment and she had this huge panic attack and she said that her daughter had to calm her down then she was like I don’t know what happened but obviously there was some psychological shit going on which I couldn’t help but laugh but I was like OK but that totally makes sense that it was just like a random panic attack I’m on wasn’t exactly random and it’s hard to test because it’s not like I’m around people throwing up all the time and she was like yeah and it’s not like I can really just send you into a children’s hospital and I was like yeah I mean being around bunch of chemo patients I guess that’s why it’s so hard to treat. And then she did the home this may be as good as it gets and then I got sad and I was like OK but I just don’t wanted to be this way and she was like I mean it may be one of those things where your husband deals with the kids when they’re sick all that but I don’t want them to feel like I just didn’t want to be around them and she was like well it could be different when you have kids and I was like but it probably won’t like realistically I see the people in the Facebook groups and they have kids and their phobia doesn’t just go away and she was like well you still don’t know until you have them and I was like I don’t want to be that mom who has to be like sorry kids mommy is just too scared to sit with you and she was like vomit is uncomfortable for everybody I don’t have happy memories with my kids comforting them in the bathroom and I was like OK but you still comfort of them and she was like but it wasn’t a good time and I was like but I don’t want them to feel terribly alone and abandoned like I did and what if my husband isn’t there and she was like well you won’t know until you have them and could be different. and she asked what my goals would be around it and I was like I just want to be normal and she was like well that’s not a goal and I was like you know what I mean though and she’s like well what do you want and I was like to be able to just deal with it like a normal person like I’m not even that grossed out by Vomit I could totally handle it but it’s like I just want to be able to be around people vomiting without going into this huge panic attack and crying or having to run away and like when I think of having kids I don’t wanna do to them what my mom did to me and kick them out of the bathroom or pull over the car and me get out because I’m scared and so she started asking about my anxieties about having kids and she asked if I’m anxious to have kids and I was like I mean isn’t everyone and she was like well when are you planning on having them and I was like I don’t know it kind of just depends more on my husband because I would like to have them sooner than later because I don’t want to be like 39 and not able to play outside with my kids because I’m already out of shape and she was like wait how old are you and I was like 28 years ago and I was like so I mean is there anxiety sure but I don’t know and she was like well when does your husband want them and I was like I don’t know he kind of changes his story a little bit about when and so I don’t really know and she was like well when do you want them and I was like sooner than later and she was like are you ready to have them now and I was like I mean is anyone ever actually ready and I tried to explain and I was like I mean I want them and I don’t really see a real good reason to keep waiting and then I get anxious that if I wait too long I’m gonna have the bad eggs left and Lynn was like I don’t think that’s how that works and I was like well you never know what if I’m getting rid of all the good eggs now and she was like yeah that’s definitely not how that works because if you have a viable pregnancy it means that I was healthy enough to take and I was like I mean yeah I know that it’s kind of a rational but I still worry because what if I end up passing along the eggs that have the bad genetics and I know it’s irrational and she brought up if I have an anxiety about whether or not I will be able to get pregnant and I was like not really because my periods are pretty regular and I’m not on birth control and haven’t been so I don’t see any reason why I should have a hard time with it in theory but I know something that does make me anxious when thinking about pregnancy is just the Wiecking aspect and not being sure how exactly I will handle so much weight gain and you know if it was just all in my stomach that would be easy but if it’s all over I think that’s going to be a struggle. She was like oh yeah well I think when you are pregnant I’m going to need to refer you to an eating disorder therapist because that’s just completely outside of my realm and all of the stress chemicals and not eating at all that would affect the baby in the pregnancy and so she would want me to see somebody who really knows how to address that and I just didn’t even say anything so I was like I’m not pregnant it’s not worth arguing with her about why she shouldn’t do that because ultimately as long as I’m actually following through the meal plan which like I said not worth explaining but I’ve already planned that I would see a dietitian to make sure that I’m staying nutritionally OK but I therapist is just gonna be like remind yourself of the fact that you are growing a baby and I really don’t think that I would do anything like restricting because I would be too anxious to do anything to hurt my baby. Only thing that I could see happening is that I can definitely see myself struggling with becoming really rigid around following the meal plan with the dietitian sense but other than that, now I think it will be fine but whatever so just an address that in Lynn was like so maybe this anxiety about the vomiting really isn’t anxiety but the vomiting as much as it is anxiety about being a mom and she was like what do you think of that and I was like I mean maybe because I’m definitely anxious that I’m going to screw up my kid like my mom did to me and she was like so maybe that’s it and she went back-and-forth on the whole we could try continuing to tackle the whole phobia thing or keep working on the other issues that may be connected Then maybe we just have the wrong negative belief and I was like I mean maybe and she pulled it up and said that the positive believe was I’m OK as I am and that we had gotten the negative leave down to a one but we were not able to do that positively can she likes when you think of that now though I’m OK as I am doesn’t seem like you would be fitting does it and I was like now I mean I guess what would be more fitting would be wanting to feel like I can handle it or I can get through it or stay present or something like that. She said that made more sense and again when with the whole like what do you want to work on and I was like I don’t know and she was like well what do you think is the biggest issue and she started talking and I honestly checked out and I asked her what she said twice and I apologize and she was like basically just what are you want to work on and what bothers you and was like I mean I guess the whole feeling that I don’t matter is really probably be cool or I would think like unless I’m sick or has something wrong with me because Lynn had also brought up do I think the phobia thing was just a response because we’ve been working on me getting better and I’m afraid that if I get better then I don’t need her anymore and I was like honestly no because there was literally no thoughts about it and it was like an immediate reflexive response to go into an automatic panic attack and she had said OK but so I was like I really just don’t even know why I just feel like I don’t matter so she was like oh we have some time so grab the toppers. I noticed that I was like I just feel like there are so many things wrong with me and they’re always have been and part of me feels like I don’t know just worried that I don’t matter because there are 1 million things wrong with me and I have so many weird anxieties and corks end but then I noticed that part of me feels really mad because I look back and I’m like reminded of how recently my mom I said something about I don’t know how mom could have a kid in the not want them and she was like yeah I don’t now but it made me mad in the moment because I was like you basically acted like you didn’t really want me but of course she would never admit that and I think about how she was like I didn’t know I was supposed to spend time with you and it’s like how the fuck did you not know that? And I noticed that it made me mad because it was like I think back now to being a little kid with all these problems and when I think of all of my intensive children that I’ve worked with yeah they are always the difficult kids but if parents actually invest and spend time with their kids or get them the help that they need it’s like they become totally different children and they get better and they become so much easier to be around and part of it makes me mad because it’s like if my mom would have gotten me help or spend time with me maybe I wouldn’t have so many problems now and also maybe I would’ve been an easier kid to where she would’ve actually wanted to be around me. I noticed that it’s sucked that I wasn’t just an easy kid off the bat that made my mom want to be around me and I noticed that honestly makes me feel mad and Lynn was in like notice that anger and I was like OK and I noticed that I feel like I’m not supposed to feel mad and anger is an emotion that I’m not comfortable with And you know I used to always fight with my dad but with my mom there was no fighting because it was instantly if I got mad she sent me to my room or told me that he needed to get over it and stop being dramatic or ridiculous or bad and I never saw her expressed anger over literally anything like I can’t remember a single time when she was mad and I just has always felt like it wasn’t safe to express anger with her and I think that’s why even now I feel so uncomfortable for me to feel mad at her and she was like noticed that and I noticed that I was such an angry teenager but at some point I turned the anger on myself and like when I think back I can remember I always had anxiety and I always wished I could be different but I don’t remember feeling like everything was literally my fault until 12 grade because I can remember in 11th grade when my friend Christi had been taking out her anger with her ex-boyfriend on me and I remember being mad at her for it but I don’t remember feeling like it was all my fault and if I can just be better then it wouldn’t be happening and so I guess at some point I must have switched from being mad at other people to just blaming myself and being mad at myself and feeling like everything was my own fault. She told me to notice that and I noticed that I wasn’t really sure why I changed it on myself but I remembered just getting so angry and cutting myself and Lynn brought up the whole control issue and she was like could it be perhaps that it was your way to control it and I was like I mean yeah and she asked if I had any idea why and I said I thought I guess just that everything just sort of build up all at once and it felt like there’s only so many times that it could be everybody else before I should probably admit that I’m the problem and at some point the pattern that I was the common denominator so I would guess that’s where came from. She suggested the that was your way to control everything again and I said yeah probably. I jokingly said control my favorite issue and she smiled and said she knew and said we would keep working on all of this. She was looking at scheduling and was like we already have an appointment for next week right and I was like no you said you’d be gone and she was like well I will be going on Thursday and I was like what the heck but she was like I’ll be here on Monday and Tuesday if you want to come in then and I was like I already have clients scheduled so I can’t and she’s like that’s OK we already have the following weeks schedule and I was like yeah so can we do that next week scheduling that way I will know my schedule for that week and she laughed and I was like I’m sorry but since I won’t be here next week to schedule the two weeks out I need to do it now for my schedule and she was like that’s fine I understand. I was like OK and so we scheduled and I went to pay but then I was like wait did you figure out my deductible and she was like no I’m going to figure that out this weekend so if your next session but I’m just not gonna collect any payment and I was like OK that works. She told me safe travels and I headed out.

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RHR: A Three-Step Plan to Fix Conventional Healthcare

In this episode we discuss:

The patient case that inspired the book

Who is this book for?

The mismatch between our medical paradigm and chronic disease

Drug companies and conflicts of interest

How clinicians can help create a new paradigm

The three core problems and how to solve them

What this new paradigm looks like

How do we pay for this? Is it scalable?

How allied providers are the key

Show notes:

Unconventional Medicine by Chris Kresser

Special offer for RHR podcast listeners - get the audiobook free if you buy the book by November 12th.

NaturalForce.com - use coupon “unconventional” and get $10 plus free shipping

[smart_track_player url="http://ift.tt/2yiM0Yd" title="A Three-Step Plan to Fix Conventional Healthcare" artist="Chris Kresser" ]

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Chris Kresser: Hey, everybody, Chris Kresser here. Welcome to another episode of Revolution Health Radio. Today we’re going to do something a little different. I am bringing on a guest host, Tony Federico, he’s the VP of marketing for Natural Force Nutrition, a physiology editor for the Journal of Evolution and Health, and a longtime contributor to Paleo Magazine, and also at Paleo f(x), which is where I met Tony, I think, originally, and I have interacted with him the most. And he’s moderated several panels that I’ve been on and I’ve always been impressed with the way he’s done that, the intelligent questions that he asks and just his balanced perspective on ancestral health and Functional Medicine, and this movement overall. Today is the day that my new book, Unconventional Medicine, comes out. It’s now available on Amazon, and I wanted to ask Tony to come take over the podcast and talk with me about the book because I know he’s really interested in all these topics and he’s read quite a bit of the book himself, and I thought it would be more interesting to have a conversation about it than for me to just sit here and do a monologue. So Tony welcome to the show and thanks for being here. Tony Federico: Yeah, thanks for inviting me on, Chris. It’s always fun, when we’ve had the chance to chat, as you said. Whether in person or on podcast, I’m always happy to jump in and dish on health with you. Chris: Fantastic. So, you have read a little bit of the book and we chatted a little bit about it via email, so let’s dive in. Let’s talk a little bit about this book. And for me it was really, it felt like the most important next step that I could take in order to get this message out about ending chronic disease. Tony: Yeah, I got my copy of Unconventional Medicine a couple days ago. I just so happened to have some time off yesterday, and the next thing I knew I was 80 pages in. Chris: Nice. Tony: So, I have to say that, as somebody who’s been in the trenches, I worked as a personal trainer for 10 years, I could really relate to a lot of the things that you were saying in the book, and we’ll get into why a little bit later on in the interview. But you know I just am really impressed with what you put together here, Chris. So let's just, let's get into it, and the first thing that I actually wanted you to maybe tell me a little bit about was how you open the book, which I think is a really great story about a patient named Leo. So I wanted to talk a little bit about Leo and his story and kind of how that inspired you to go down this particular path of unconventional medicine.

The patient case that inspired the book

Chris: Sure, yeah. So, Leo was an eight-year-old boy that I treated in my clinic a few years back, and I wanted to start with his story because it's, unfortunately, a typical story, much more common than, of course, we would like. And it was powerful for me, it was a powerful experience. It's what actually led to me writing this book. So, like way too many other kids of his age, he was suffering from a number of behavioral issues. He was initially diagnosed on the autism spectrum. Eventually they settled on OCD and sensory processing disorder. He would throw these just crazy tantrums where he'd end up crying or screaming inconsolably, writhing on the floor, and this would happen for seemingly the simplest of reasons. Like trying to get his shoes tied as they were going out the door, not cutting the crust off his sandwich in just the right way or getting a stain on his favorite T-shirt. And he was really rigid around his behavior and its environment, everything had to be just right, just the way he wanted it to be, or else he would fly off the handle.

Is a new healthcare paradigm affordable? Scalable? You bet.

His diet was extremely limited, he only ate a handful of foods, pretty much all of which were processed and refined. So crackers, bread, toaster waffles, that sort of thing, and this is part of the kind of OCD-like tendencies. And any time his parents would try to introduce new food, he would go totally ballistic. And they were worried about nutrient deficiency, but they didn't feel like they ... they were just worn down. Any parent who has a kid like this will understand that. It's just they didn’t feel like they had the resources to battle him at every meal. And they took him to a bunch of doctors locally, and that’s where they got those diagnoses. Initially they were kind of relieved to have those, but then after a while they realized that they were just simply labels for symptoms. And when they asked what the treatment was, you can probably guess the answer: medication. Tony: Something to do with drugs. Chris: Something to do with drugs. Yeah. And when they asked how long he would be on that treatment, you can probably also guess the answer. Tony: The rest of your life. Chris: Yeah. Shrug of the shoulders, indefinitely, maybe he'll grow out of it, that sort of thing. And they weren't excited about the idea of of medicating their son, but they were also aware of how much he was suffering, and they were suffering, frankly, too. They decided to give them a try, starting with Adderall, and then they progressed to Ritalin and then antidepressants. And certainly the drugs did seem to help with at least some of the symptoms, but there were a couple issues. Number one, they also caused some very intractable side effects like headache, abdominal pain, irritability, and most significantly, severe sleep disruption. And they had a couple of other kids that were younger than Leo. So they were not happy about the sleep disruption. Nobody was because it was brutal for them and also brutal for Leo. Kids need a lot of sleep, and if they’re waking up throughout the night, that’s going to make ... So that was in some ways worse than the original symptoms they were trying to treat. And then Leo's mom had done quite a bit of research on the effects of these medications and she was scared. Particularly for children and adolescents, some of these drugs have some pretty scary side effects and long-term risks. So what really stood out to me, and I mentioned this in the book, is that not once during this entire process of seeing all these different doctors, primary care provider, psychiatrist, eventually behavioral disorder specialists, did anybody even hint at the possibility that something in Leo's diet or some other underlying issue like a gut problem or nutrient deficiency or heavy metal toxicity or something like that could be contributing to his symptoms. It wasn't even broached as a possibility at any time. Fortunately, Leo's mom, one of her friends followed my work and sent her a couple of articles from my blog. One was on the gut–brain–axis, and I think the other one was on the underlying root causes of behavioral disorders. And so that's what led them to bring Leo to see me, and long story short, we were able to ... we did a bunch of testing, found issues that you might guess at. So, disrupted gut microbiome, SIBO, fungal overgrowth, gluten intolerance, but also intolerance of soy and corn and rice and buckwheat, which were major ingredients in a lot of the processed and refined food products that he ate, and arsenic toxicity because rice milk was the only other beverage he would drink aside from water. And we know that rice products can be high in arsenic. So, we, over several months, it definitely wasn't easy to address these problems because of his OCD-like tendencies and his picky eating habits. But after several months he was like a different kid. His teacher even called home and was like, “What have you done with Leo and who’s this kid that you’re sending in?” Because it was a big issue for her. They often had to come to school and pick him up early because of the behavioral problems. And his diet expanded; he was eating foods he would've thrown against the wall just months before, he was more tolerant of disorder, more relaxed in his environment. They were able to travel for the first time in a long time because he wasn't so anxious in unfamiliar environments. His physical symptoms had improved significantly. So they were just over the moon. They couldn't believe it, and toward the end of our treatment together, she said something that really struck me, which was there’s so many kids out there that are like Leo and they’re suffering, they’re not finding help in the conventional system. Tony: Sure. Chris: And their doctors and parents are not even thinking about this stuff. Like it’s not even in most people’s consciousness that if a kid has a behavioral disorder that you should look at these physiological issues. It’s not, for 99 percent of people they don't even go there because they don't know. Tony: Yeah, I mean I think that that was—reading about Leo and reading about a story and certainly there's people that I've known, myself included, who have had very similar experiences—I think it's great to have a narrative like this that you can really connect to because then when you tease it apart, all the pieces really make sense. It makes sense why having doctors treat symptoms has failed, it makes sense why a lack of communication between the health provider network that was supposed to be serving Leo failed. It makes sense why it didn't work when you actually start to tease it out. But then we’re still all, well not all, but most of us are still going down this path and it's an exercise in futility, really. You have an eight-year-old kid who's on powerful stimulant medications, he’s on antidepressants, and it was bad enough for his parents to reach out and to seek those interventions as solutions, and then the side effects are even worse. And that’s just something that just gets you right in the heart. And like you said, he’s not the only one, he’s not the only kid. His parents are not the only parents. And frankly, his doctors are not the only doctors because I can guarantee you that that probably doesn’t really feel good for the practitioner, for the healthcare provider to not get results as well. And they’re working with what they’ve got. Chris: Absolutely. Tony: And trying to use the tools they have. Chris: Yeah, I mean, let’s be clear about this. Everybody is doing the best they can in this situation. The parents are doing the best they can, in the vast majority of situations, parents just love their kids and do everything possible that they can to help their kids thrive. I’m a parent, I know that that’s how I relate to my kid. I know that every parent I know, that’s how they relate to their kids. And I would even, I would say that’s true for doctors too. The vast majority of them are trying to do the best they can with the tools that they have and in the system that they’re working within. And that’s the rub. Tony: Right. Chris: It’s like most doctors I’ve seen have been caring and they’ve wanted to do the right thing, but the question is, can they do the right thing in the conventional medical system as it exists today? And, of course, that’s largely what the book is about.

Who is this book for?

Tony: Yeah, so let’s kind of speak to that specifically. And we’re talking about doctors, we’re talking about medical professionals, we’re talking about patients, and then we didn’t mention it, but where I fit into this formula or potential formula as an allied healthcare provider, as a personal trainer/health coach, is that your audience for this book, do you really see that kind of triad is who you're speaking to here? Chris: Yeah, definitely. I think if you look at the cover of the book, the subtitle is “join the revolution to reverse chronic disease, reinvent healthcare, and create a practice you love.” So that last bit would suggest that it's mostly for practitioners, but that's not true. It is really for anybody that is interested in the ideas of reinventing healthcare and reversing chronic disease. And, in fact, I would argue that that change is going to be initiated by people, primarily by people that are not practitioners. So it's like a grassroots, bottom-up approach, where a good example is with my training program, my ADAPT training program, now that we've been training practitioners in this approach for the last couple years, we always ask people how they learned about my work or how they learned about the training program. And in a surprising number of cases, the answer is from their patients. So these doctors or other practitioners, their patient brings an article in that I wrote or brings something in, tells them about me, and to their credit they’re open-minded enough to go and check it out. And then they like what they see and they end up taking the next step. So people even who have no intention of ever becoming a healthcare practitioner, I think would really benefit from this book if they're interested in these ideas. And then certainly, as you mentioned, licensed healthcare providers like medical doctors or nurse practitioners or physician assistants that are currently working within the conventional paradigm but have already seen its limitations and want to do something different but don't yet know what that might look like. And then people who are outside of the conventional paradigm but are already practitioners, so acupuncturists, chiropractors, naturopathic physicians, etc., in many cases they’re already well aware of the limitations of conventional medicine, which is why they chose to go down a different path. But speaking personally as an acupuncturist myself, I also saw some limitations in the traditional Chinese medicine approach, or at least some differences in the way that I wanted to practice it. I was looking for something that could incorporate modern diagnostic testing and create a more systematic approach that included ancestral diet and lifestyle and some of the other things we talk about in the book. So, I think many of those practitioners can benefit from the book from that perspective. And then you have the growing and already large number of people like yourself who are personal trainers, health coaches, nutritionists, etc., who I really think are going to play an increasingly important role in this revolution to reinvent healthcare. Tony: Yeah, it so important now for people to really, for patients to be their own advocate, and I don't think we’re living in a time where I remember with my grandparents—if your doctor said something, it was basically gospel and you didn’t question it and you didn't think about it. Now, the first thing people do when they experience a symptom, it's Dr. Google first. So it's super important to equip and arm patients with good information, which I think this book does. Here's a path, here's a path forward for you as a patient. But then it's respectful of the role of doctors, and you highlight many situations where conventional medicine is great. If you break your arm or get in a car accident or have a heart attack or whatever the case may be, yeah, you need a doctor, and you need to go to an emergency room and you need those types of interventions. But it's really in this kind of gray area, it’s really not gray, it’s actually quite clear. And we could probably specify a little bit more, but there’s this middle zone where somebody’s not acutely injured, they’re not acutely in a disease state. They’re in a chronic disease state, or they’re just unwell. And it’s hard for a system that is all about pharmacological interventions, surgical interventions, to deal with a more subtle approach. And that’s where that whole middle ground and acupuncturists and massage therapists and everybody who's in that middle zone. I had clients constantly when I was actively training, constantly asking me questions where I was like, you know what? This is really something they maybe should be taking to their doctor. But guess what? The doctor only has 15 minutes under pressure to see as many patients as they can. I had a friend who was a physician in France. And he was telling me about their medical model, and he would spend tons of time with his patients. And it was actually incentivized for prevention. And here we see some maybe misplaced incentives, and perhaps you can speak a little bit more about that.

The mismatch between our medical paradigm and chronic disease

Chris: Yeah, so, going back to your original comments, I think that the most important thing for people to understand is that our medical model, when it comes to our medical paradigm, is that it evolved during a time when acute problems were the biggest issues. So in 1900, the top three causes of death were all infectious diseases, tuberculosis, typhoid, and pneumonia. And the other reasons people would see the doctor were among those you mentioned, like a broken bone or a gallbladder attack or appendicitis. Tony: War. Chris: Right, injuries, trauma, etc. And so the treatment for that's pretty straightforward. It wasn't always successful, of course, but it was straightforward. You know, if the bone was broken, you set it in a cast. If the gallbladder was swelling, you would take it out. If someone was having appendicitis, you’d remove the appendix. So that's pretty ... it's one problem, one doctor, one treatment. Pretty straightforward. But you fast-forward to today, it's a totally different healthcare landscape. Seven of the top 10 causes of death are chronic disease rather than acute problems now, and 86 percent of the healthcare dollars we spend go toward treating chronic disease. And unlike acute problems, chronic diseases are expensive, difficult to manage and usually last for a lifetime. They don't lend themselves to that one doctor, one problem, one treatment kind of approach. The average chronic disease patient requires multiple doctors, usually one for every different part of the body in our system, and is taking ... Tony: Specialists. Chris: Right, specialists, they’re taking multiple medications in many cases, and they're going to be taking those medications for the rest of their life. So far, it's really, our conventional medical system is amazing for these acute problems. But it's the wrong tool for the job for chronic problems. So that's one issue, and it’s really important to point that out, because we just went through the whole healthcare debate again with the Affordable Care Act and the current administration’s proposal for a replacement, which has not come to fruition. But throughout that entire discussion, it really bothered me that there was an elephant in the room. All the discussion was around insurance. Like, who gets insurance and who doesn’t. And that’s important, it’s important to talk about that. But we have to recognize that health insurance is not the same thing as healthcare. Tony: Yeah. Chris: Health insurance is a method of paying for healthcare. And that’s really crucial to get that difference. Because my argument in the book is that there is no method of paying for healthcare, whether it’s the government, corporations, or individuals, that will be adequate and will be sustainable under the pressure of growing prevalence of chronic disease. It will bankrupt all of us. Government, the corporations, individuals, whoever is responsible for paying for the care will not be able to do it unless we can actually prevent and reverse chronic disease instead of just slapping Band-Aids on it. Tony: I think the analogy you gave in the book was rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. “Making a few small tweaks to our current system and expecting that to work is like rearranging the deck furniture on the Titanic as it inexorably sinks into the ocean. Too little, too late.” Chris: Yeah, exactly. That’s the argument about insurance. As the whole ship goes under, sinks under. The other problems you mentioned are very real also. So we have a misalignment of incentives, like the insurance industry, for example, doesn't benefit when the cost of care shrinks because they only make more money when the overall expenditures rise. So it's actually not in their best interest necessarily to seek out the most cost-effective solutions.

Drug companies and conflicts of interest

Chris: And then of course, we have drug companies. People are pretty well aware of the conflicts of interest there. It’s in their interest to sell drugs, and even when that’s not in the interests of the general public or the patients or the doctors. In many cases, it’s not in their interest either. So the best example of this is a recent one. We’re in the midst of an opioid crisis, the worst we’ve ever seen by far, and the DEA has been wanting to create new regulations that restrict a pharmacy’s ability to sell opioids in ways that will protect people. So, for example, there was a pharmacy in West Virginia in a town that was tiny. It had like 30,000 people in this town, and they had ordered something like nine million opioid pills in the last year. It was clearly a front, like there’s clearly something shady going on there. There's no way that 30,000 people in that town needed nine million opioid pills, and yet there are no regulations to actually prevent that from happening. And so, the DEA had proposed some regulations to just safely protect people from that kind of thing. And the Big Pharma lobby basically shut that down and they played a big role in writing a law that limits the DEA's ability to do that kind of regulation in the midst of the worse opioid crisis ever. And to put this in perspective, we hear a lot about the gun lobbies and their control. They spend about $10.5 million lobbying Congress, I think, per year. And Big Pharma, they spent $250 million. Tony: Wow. Chris: Twenty-five-fold higher. Tony: It's really tragic. I actually, I don’t think we’ve ever talked about this, but I grew up in South Florida, which was kind of ground zero for the opioid epidemic. And I remember in high school down in Miami and West Palm Beach, and kids would get a hold of a contact or whatever, somebody that had a prescription and basically would end up being a de facto drug dealer vis-à-vis a pill mill, etc. The kid across the street from me died, multiple kids in my high school died, multiple kids went into in-treatment programs, some of them battled addictions for decades. Some of them got out of it. Very few got out of it. Some of them didn't and have continued to be plagued with either switching from pharmaceuticals to street drugs like heroin, etc., and then we can see what's happening there. And that's just one example. If we look at drug consumption in the United States, is it that Americans are just that much sicker and we’re in that much more pain than people in other countries? Because we’re consuming far and away more painkillers than any other country on the planet. And I would venture to guess that you could say the same about antidepressants or ADD medication. It's very much a case of misaligned incentives. And incentives are working in the sense of the pharmaceutical companies are doing very well. Chris: Yeah. Who are they working for is the question. Tony: Exactly. Chris: We’re the only country aside from New Zealand that allows direct-to-consumer drug advertising, and I think that's a big part of the problem. But it's not just Big Pharma. We also have conflicts in medical research that, of course, are related to Big Pharma because they pay for two-thirds of all medical research. We have broken payment models, where there's no real incentive or reward for good performance, and in fact, you could argue it's the other way around because doctors are compensated for, usually based on the number of procedures they order and the number of patients they see. So to your point about the doctor in France who is actually incentivized to prevent, rather than just treat disease, we don't have that at all, it's the opposite. And so there are a lot of deeply entrenched issues that we certainly need to address, and that's not essentially what this book is about. There are other books that cover that material really well, and frankly many of those issues are outside of our individual control as clinicians or practitioners.

How clinicians can help create a new paradigm

Chris: We can work toward addressing them, and I think we should, but the good news is that I think that the bigger changes that we need to focus on individually and collectively are addressing the medical paradigm which we’ve talked about, creating a medical paradigm that’s better suited to tackle chronic disease. Addressing the mismatch between our modern diet and lifestyle, and our genes and our biology, which we've, of course, talked a lot about on the show before. And then creating a new way of delivering healthcare that actually supports this new medical paradigm and this more preventative approach. Because those things are all within our control as clinicians. Tony: Yeah. I like how you posed the question, and it was kind of a cool little, I think it was, not Hiroshi, but the person who is in charge of cooking at a Buddhist monastery. And basically a young monk comes up to this older man. He’s like, why are you doing the grunt work, basically washing rice out in the courtyard? And he says, it was like, what was it? “If not me, who? And if not now, when?” And I think that that’s really kind of the core of setting all this stuff up. Talking about the problem is really in the service of pivoting to the solution, and I’m a big believer in thinking globally, thinking big, but acting locally, hyper-locally, like yourself. Chris: Yeah. Tony: And then the people around you and who you can touch and impact. That’s ultimately where the power comes from. So let’s talk about that. What is in people’s power. And you started to describe some of those pillars of a new model. And you describe it as the ADAPT framework. And I don’t know how much you get into this on your regular podcast episodes, but to just kind of lay it out, ADAPT from a big-picture perspective. How does that actually address some of these systemic issues from an individually empowered stance? Chris: Yeah, great question, and before I even go into that, I just want to say I agree that I think the change is going to happen on different levels. So, because a lot ... we’ve talked about this stuff at conferences or even some people who’ve already read the book. They say, oh, this is fantastic. I’m so excited. But how are we going to deal with Big Pharma and the insurance industry and these misaligned incentives and all of that? And can we ever deal with that? The answer is we’re not going to deal with that overnight and it’s going to take a while to unwind those things. Tony: It’s the chronic disease, is what you call... Chris: Exactly, exactly. And I use that analogy in the book. But the good news is that changes can happen very quickly on an individual and local level. And there’s already a lot of evidence of that happening. So my own clinic, CCFM, tripled in size in the last three years alone. We have Cleveland Clinic Center for Functional Medicine, launched by Dr. Mark Hyman, has just blown up like crazy. I mean they started in this tiny space. Now their 17,000-square-foot space, it takes up the whole second floor of the Glickman Tower at Cleveland Clinic. They've got a waitlist of 2,500 patients from nine countries around the world. This is really exciting! The Cleveland Clinic is always on the forefront of the newest trends in medicine, and the fact that they've invested that much money in this speaks volumes. Then we have groups like Iora Health, an organization based in the Rocky Mountain area that’s reversing diabetes using health coaches. So there are lots of really interesting produced concepts, and there's going to be more and more of these. Like we’re doing a pilot program with the Berkeley Fire Department where we’re working with their new recruits to help, we’re implementing a wellness program. Tony: That’s awesome. Chris: To reduce injuries and help with recovery and optimize their performance. And if that goes well, there’s been interest from the wider fire department and in the city of Berkeley as a whole. Robb Wolf’s done some incredible work with Reno that we’ve talked about before. So I think the change is going to happen more quickly on this local grassroots level, and then that's going to start to get the attention of people on a state and federal level. And then it will start to get really interesting.

The three core problems and how to solve them

To answer your question, in my book I basically lay out three core fundamental problems with the healthcare system in the US. And these, I argue, go even deeper than the misaligned incentives and Big Pharma and all of that stuff, although they’re, of course, connected. The first is that there is a profound mismatch between our genes and our biology and our modern diet and lifestyle. And I'm not going to say more about that now because almost everyone listening to this podcast knows exactly what I mean. The second problem is the mismatch between our medical paradigm and chronic disease, which we just talked about. We need a new medical paradigm that is better suited for chronic disease. And then the third is that the way we deliver care in this country is also, it's not set up to support the most important interventions. And we’ve touched on that too, where the average visit with the primary care provider is just actually eight to 12 minutes. Tony, you were talking about 15 minutes. That’s luxurious in our current model. The average amount of time a patient gets to speak before they’re interrupted by the doctor is 12 seconds. Tony: Wow. Chris: So I think it’s pretty clear that if a patient has multiple chronic diseases, which one in four Americans now do, one in two has one chronic disease, and they show up to the doctor’s office and they're on multiple medications, and they had been presenting with a whole set of new symptoms, there’s absolutely no way to provide high-quality care in a 10-minute visit. So we have to change our, not only the paradigm, but also the way that care is delivered. So that was my premise. So it follows then that my solution would address, I would hope at least those three points, right? Each of those three deficiencies. So the ADAPT framework combines an ancestral diet and lifestyle, which addresses that mismatch between our genes and biology in our modern diet and lifestyle. And then Functional Medicine is the new paradigm of medicine that is based on addressing the root cause of health problems, so we can prevent and reverse them instead of just suppressing symptoms. And then the third component is what I call a collaborative practice model, which links licensed providers like medical doctors, nurse practitioners, with what I call allied providers, which include folks like yourself, Tony, health coaches, nutritionists, personal trainers, etc., to provide a much, much higher level of care than what doctors are able to provide on their own. So, again, we're not trying to replace doctors in any, or even conventional medicine. We need people to do colonoscopies and remove cancerous tumors and use all of the incredible amount of training and expertise and skill that they’ve acquired over a lifetime of practice and study. We absolutely want that, but we need to add stuff to that that's not available now. Tony: What that really says to me is, emphasize the importance of community, of connection, of collaboration. We’re social creatures, we’re tribal by nature. That’s another kind of Paleo/ancestral health part of the puzzle. And it would be foolish to think that we can dissect out and silo out all these different aspects of our lives without consequence. I really like this idea of bringing everybody into the fold, and it’s not saying that you can go to just the naturopath, or you can go to just the health coach. Because like I mentioned already, I certainly would’ve been ill-equipped to handle plenty of issues that a client would’ve brought to mind or brought up in conversation during a training session. But it would’ve been really great to say, ah, here's the Functional Medicine practitioner that I recommend you speak with, and to have a good relationship with that person and to be able to, as a health coach, help my clients better by getting them in touch with the right person. And that’s having this network that can really support people throughout their health journey whether it’s just feeling better and more energy, or addressing something like diabetes or hypertension. Which certainly there’s a place for all the players in that kind of scenario.

What this new paradigm looks like

Chris: Absolutely. And let’s use an example just to bring this to life for people. So, imagine you go to the doctor and they do some blood testing for your annual physical. And they find that your fasting blood sugar is 96 or 97. Your hemoglobin A1c is 5.5, and you’ve got triglycerides that are 110, 120, maybe 130. Currently, what would happen is nothing, usually. Tony: You’re not sick enough yet. Chris: Yeah, all of your markers are within the lab range, they say, and that means you’re normal, and so you might get some vague advice about make sure to exercise and follow a good diet. And thank you very much, that’s it. Certainly there are exceptions to the rule, of course. There’s some practitioners who can get a lot more proactive about that. But I can’t tell you how many people, patients I’ve had that have been given that basic line with those kinds of lab results. What could happen is this. The doctor says, “Well, you know, if we think of blood sugar disorders on a spectrum, on the left you’ve got perfect blood sugar. On the right you’ve got full-fledged type 2 diabetes. You’re not on the right yet, you don’t have type 2 diabetes or even technically prediabetes, but you’re progressing along that spectrum. And what we know from a lot of research is that if we don’t intervene now, that you’re going to continue progressing. And in fact, we have studies that show that the average patient who has prediabetes, will progress to full-fledged type 2 diabetes in just five years if it’s not addressed.” So what we want to do is be proactive here. We want to intervene now because it’s much easier to prevent a disease before it occurs than it is to treat it after it’s already occurred. So here’s what we’re going to do. We’re going to set you up with our staff health coach, and they’re going to give you all the support you need to adopt a better diet. They’re actually even going to take you shopping, they’re going to come to your house and clean out your pantry with you, and they're going to give you recipes and meal plans and give you ... totally hold your hand and do everything that they need to to get you on this diet. Because we know that information is not enough. We’ve got lots of studies. I can tell you as a doctor, go eat a healthy diet, and hey, we know that that’s probably not going to happen. Most people know what they should be doing, but they’re not doing it, and it’s not because of lack of information. It’s because they need support, and we’re here to support you. We’ve got this health coach. Furthermore, we've got this great personal trainer named Tony. We’re going to set you up with him and we’re also going to set you up with a gym membership. And the good news is, your insurance is going to pay for all this. They’re going to pay for the health coach, they’re going to pay for the gym membership, they’re going to pay for your sessions with Tony. And in six months’ time, you’re going to come back here and we’re going to retest your blood markers and I can almost guarantee that if you stick with the program, you’re going to have normal blood sugar by that time. And throughout that period you’re going to have weekly check-ins with a health coach, you’re going to have training sessions. And not only will your blood sugar be normal, you’re going to lose weight, your energy levels are going to go up, your sleep’s going to get better, you’re going to feel more confident and empowered because you’re making these changes, and you’re going to feel like a different person. Now that’s totally possible.

How do we pay for this? Is it scalable?

Chris: I can hear some people saying, “Oh, how are we going to pay for that? That’s ridiculous.” Tony: Is it scalable? Chris: The question we should be asking is, is treating type 2 diabetes scalable? Because I mentioned this in the book, it costs $14,000 a year to treat a single patient with type 2 diabetes. So let’s imagine that this patient progresses. We don’t intervene, five years later they have type 2 diabetes. All of a sudden the healthcare system is spending $14,000 a year paying for that person’s care. And let’s say that that person gets diagnosed at age 40, which is still reasonable these days. The age of diagnosis is dropping more and more, and then let’s say that they live until they’re 85 years old, which is also possible because of our heroic medical interventions that keep people alive a lot longer than they might have been otherwise. So 45 years living with type 2 diabetes, that’s a cost of almost $650,000 for one patient to the healthcare system. Tony: And that doesn’t even touch on the lost wages, cost to employers, when someone’s on leave, loss of productivity. And then the cost to the family members. Chris: Absolutely. Tony: People that are actually, are helping the patient, their health is going to be going down too. Chris: Yeah. Nor does it touch on the qualitative aspects. Being immobilized, not being able to play with your grandkids, all of that stuff. But let’s just even forget about that for a second—$650,000, okay? And then the CDC recently came out with statistics saying that 100 million Americans have either prediabetes or diabetes, and 88 percent of people with prediabetes don’t even know that they have it. Which means they're almost certainly going to progress, right? If you do the math and you multiply 100 million people times even $14,000 for one year, you get a number that’s so large, I don’t even know what it is. It’s like a google something. It’s like, it has so many zeros after it, I don’t even know how to characterize it. But then if you multiply 100 million times like 20 or 30 years, it’s more money than there is in the world. It's like it's not going to happen. Tony: Not sustainable, not scalable. Chris: Not sustainable, not scalable. So let’s say in our example that we ... the healthcare system spends $10,000, which is way more than would be necessary, but let’s even say we buy the person’s groceries for three months. And their gym membership and their trainer, and their health coach, and those weekly, let’s say we spend $10,000. We’re just super generous and we spend $10,000 for that six-month period. Again, the research and my clinical experience indicates with near certainty that if the person is at that stage of not even prediabetic and we intervene, there’s like almost no chance that it’s not going to, we’re not going to be able to normalize that person’s blood sugar. And if they do that and they stick with it and they are able to do that because they now have support rather than just information, we’ve just saved the healthcare system $640,000 over the course of that patient’s lifetime. And that’s a conservative estimate, as you say. We're not including even the indirect costs. Tony: Right, right. Chris: I think that this is not only possible, it's going to become necessary. And whether we get there with a proactive approach where we decide to move in this direction and we make these changes or whether we get there because we absolutely have no choice, we’re going to get there. Tony: Yeah. I mean it really sounds like we can’t afford to not do this. Chris: Exactly. Tony: And if we get to that point where we continue down the reactive path and we wait until there’s a total collapse, it might be too late, just to put it frankly. And it’s going to come out at a huge, not just financial cost, a huge human cost. Chris: Yeah, it’s going to be, we can use the chronic disease metaphor again, it’s a lot easier to prevent a problem or reverse it at an earlier stage than it is to wait until the patient is essentially on life support or the healthcare system is on life support. It’s harder to reverse it at that time. And that’s of course why I’m writing the book now because I want to get this message out as far and wide as I can. Tony: Yeah. If not now, when? If not you, who? Go right back to there.

How allied providers are the key

Chris: Exactly. And one more thing about that is the amazing thing, the beauty of this is that it takes about eight years and hundreds of thousands of dollars to train a doctor. And it takes a certain kind of personality and a certain kind of comfort level with science, and a lot of prerequisites. It’s not for everybody. And there’s a ... already we have a shortage of doctors, and that’s predicted to get worse. I’ve seen estimates that suggest by 2025 we’ll have a shortage of 52,000 primary care physicians. So that’s a big deal. [insert image] So we already don’t have enough doctors, it’s already going to get worse, but if you think of healthcare as like a ... I have something in the book called the healthcare population pyramid. And you were referring to it earlier, Tony, where at the very top of that pyramid you’ve got 5 percent of people who are in really acute situations. So they’re in the hospital or they’re in an intensive outpatient care setting. They need the conventional medicine paradigm as it exists, and it’s fantastic for those situations. Then you’ve got another 25 percent of people in that kind of high middle of the pyramid who are dealing with some pretty serious chronic health challenges. So they require more regular care, but they’re not sick enough to be in the hospital or in any kind of ... they’re living their lives, but they’re struggling a lot. A Functional Medicine practitioner/clinician usually working in concert possibly with the conventional specialist of some kind is a really great option for that 25 percent of the pyramid. But then you’ve got the 70 percent at the bottom. So these are people who do, may have health issues, but they’re more minor, so they might have skin problems, or a little bit of brain fog, some difficulties sleeping, some GI issues. And these can be definitely debilitating and total pain, but they’re not at the level of that 25 percent. My argument is that in many cases these people could be very well served by a health coach or nutritionist with good training. And possibly seeing a Functional Medicine provider once or twice a year, or something like that. And the thing is, we can train people in a year or two without an extensive science background to be very, very objective in this role. Because they’re mostly working with patients on changing their behavior. If you think about it, most of the risk factors for chronic disease come down to the wrong behaviors. Eating the wrong diet, not getting enough sleep, not exercising, or exercising too much, or any number of things that come down to choices that we’re making. And so if a skilled health coach who’s trained in things like motivational interviewing and coaching to strengths and other evidence-based principles of facilitating behavior change which we have a ton of research on, they can be incredibly effective for that 70 percent of the population. That's the majority of the population. So we’re totally underutilizing these practitioners, and my argument is that they’re going to play a huge role in this future of medicine. And that's of course one reason why we're launching an ADAPT Health Coach Training Program next year to complement the practitioner training program that we've been doing. Because I want to create this ecosystem we've been talking about where you have all of these different types of practitioners working to the maximum of their training and ability and scope of practice and supporting each other and therefore providing the highest level of care to patients. Tony: That certainly kind of perks my ears up hearing about the ADAPT health coach option and something that I’m personally interested in. So who knows? Maybe I can get in on that. We can talk about it again in the future. Chris: Yeah, for sure. For sure. Tony: So, for this particular book, for Unconventional Medicine, people are fired up, they’re hearing about it, they’re like, “Okay, this resonates with me. I’m a practitioner, I’m an allied health provider, I’m a patient, I’m ready. Now’s the time. This is it. We’re going to do this.” What’s the best way for people to get their hands on this thing? Chris: Well not surprisingly, Amazon. They have the best way to get your hands on anything. So it’s available in paperback, Kindle, and audiobook. We’re hoping [the audiobook] is going to be out today, the day this podcast is released. But it might be another two or three days. They’re just taking their sweet time to approve it. I narrated the audiobook myself. So you podcast listeners, I figured you might be into that, since you like to listen. Tony: They know your voice. Chris:�� Yeah, and just listening to something instead of reading it perhaps. So to that end, we have a special offer for podcast listeners, because I appreciate your support and I know many of you are already part of this movement, and some are wanting to get involved. So if you buy that paperback or Kindle version between now and Sunday night, you’ll get some really cool bonuses. The first is a free copy of the audiobook. So again, we wanted to include that for podcast listeners, since we figured you guys and gals are probably interested in audio. But there are two other things that are really, I think, fantastic. And one, they’re both tools to help you be more confident and persuasive and factual when you share your passion for Functional Medicine and an ancestral diet and lifestyle. Because we’ve had a lot of questions from people, both practitioners and non-practitioners alike. They say, “Oh, how do I talk about this stuff to my sister at Thanksgiving?” Tony: “Isn’t that that caveman diet?” Chris: Yeah, exactly. All of our ancestors died when they were 30, so why should we even care? How do you respond to those arguments? Or if you start talking about Functional Medicine and maybe one of your conventional medicine colleagues says, “Oh, that’s just, I saw something on Science-based Medicine that said that was all just hooey. There’s nothing to it. How do you respond to that?” So what we wanted to do is give people the ammunition they needed in a respectful way. You know, this isn’t about getting the better of somebody. It’s about responding in a factual and convincing but respectful way. So we’ve got two different, we’re calling these the Power Packs. And one is for practitioners, so clinicians, health coaches, nutritionists, trainers, etc., and these are facts, research that you can reference and persuasive reasons for your clients or patients or colleagues to consider this Functional Medicine and ancestral diet and lifestyle approach. And then we have one for non-practitioners called the Supporter Power Pack. And these are smart answers and compelling comebacks, again respectful, for those common objections that you hear when you start talking about this stuff with your friends and family. So these bonuses are available until Sunday night [November 12, 2017] at 11:59 p.m. Pacific Time. So you’ve got a few days to act on that, and you can go to ... we set up a special link for you to get these and that’s Kresser.co/bonus. That’s Kresser.co/bonus. So head over there to get your Power Packs and your free audiobook, and that’s after you purchase either the paperback or Kindle. There’ll be a place where you enter your order number and we ask for some information just to verify, and I hope you enjoy those and get a lot out of them. Because they were actually really fun to put together. Tony: Yeah, I think the audiobook is huge. I like to listen to audiobooks when I’m driving around town or outside getting some exercise. Chris: Yeah. Tony: So, no excuses when you make it that easy. Chris: Yeah, yeah. So, Tony, thanks so much for doing this. This has been really fun to talk to you, as it always is. And I appreciate it. Tony: Actually, I wanted to throw in one extra little special thing, as we mentioned, at the top of the show. I spent 10 years as a personal trainer in the trenches, I was involved with Paleo Magazine for many, many years, going to all the events, and for me kind of an evolution in my professional life was, how do I impact more people? How do I help more people? And at first I was working one on one, and then it was as a facility manager helping other trainers and coaches get better. And then I was able to scale it up that way. And last year I had an opportunity to join the team over at Natural Force, which is all-natural, nutritional products, and I basically said, “You know what? I’m going to go all in on this because if I can touch a million people through really good, high-quality nutrition, that’s me maximizing my impact and really kind of living my purpose.” So one of the things I wanted to do today is put it out there for anyone listening who maybe uses collagen or MCT oil or whey protein. We really bend over backwards to source the best ingredients in the world, no additives, all that stuff. Everything is as clean as we can possibly make it. It takes a lot of work, working with manufacturers. Kind of like what you were saying, how patients have to know how to talk to their doctor. I don’t think people really realize, and I didn’t realize until I got on the inside, how much work it is for a brand to work with their manufacturers to convince them to get outside of the conventional mold. So it’s the kind of unconventional nutrition is really what we’re pushing here. So I set up a discount code for any Revolution Health listeners. Go to NaturalForce.com, use coupon code “unconventional” and get $10 off plus free shipping on your order. So I just want to put that out there as just a little extra bonus for anybody, and I would certainly love to help in that way and really get some good, high-quality nutrition into people’s hands. Chris: Awesome. Yeah, and there’s so many ways people can help, and I ... at Paleo f(x) we’ve see the growth of companies that are serving this space, and it's amazing. Like the products that are available now. I had breakfast this morning, I had some eggs and kale and parsley and a little bit of bacon in a couple of cassava flour tortillas. Breakfast burritos. Whoever thought I’d be having a breakfast burrito again? Tortillas are made from completely cassava flour. They’re autoimmune friendly and they’re grain-free tortillas. It’s incredible. Tony: I think I might have some of those in my fridge as well. Chris: Yeah. I mean there’s so many things. And these people, they’re serving this movement with that kind of work. So it’s great to see. Tony: It takes a village, man. Chris: It does. Thanks again, Tony. I really appreciate it. Thank you, everybody. So again, Kresser.co/bonus to pick up your free audiobook and the other bonuses, and I hope you can all join me in this revolution to reinvent healthcare. We need you, whatever your background and goals. Take care, everybody.

Source: http://chriskresser.com November 08, 2017 at 04:12PM

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The Last-Agust D (BTS) Lyric Breakdown

Before you, read this I just want to let you know that I’ve just listened to The Last for the first time after it was release last year. I didn’t really want to listen to this at first because I’ve seen some articles and a few glimpse of what’s this song is all about. Those things aren’t really good for me because it gives me certain thoughts.. But after finally, gathering my thoughts and preparing my mind for what has to come, I finally listened to it and here’s what I’VE UNDERSTAND.

Again, this are MY OWN INTERPRETATION, WHAT I HAVE UNDERSTOOD so there’s A HUGE CHANCE that this’ll be wrong. And obviously, I’m not sure if this is even what he’s saying.

I only posted this for my own satisfaction ‘cause I really want to voice this out and I can’t really find someone who will listen.

So let’s get started!

Warning: Mentions of Depression, OCD, Social phobia, and other mental illness. Read at your own risk.

Source For The English Translation Of The Lyrics: https://muish.wordpress.com/2016/08/16/agust-d-bts-the-last-english-translation-and-ramblings/#comment-5378

On the dark side of a successful idol rapper

My frail self stands, a bit dangerous

Depression, compulsion, at times relapse

Hell no, maybe that’s just my true self

From the first line to the second line, it's quite obvious that he's going to talk about his dark/vulnerable side.

Then, at the third line he said that his mental illness started to worsen.

Lastly, the last line refers to the first and second line. He thinks that maybe that's his actual self not just a part of him.

Compulsion can also be be converted to OCD the here’s a brief aummary:

Obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD) is an anxiety disorder in which people have unwanted and repeated thoughts, feelings, images, and sensations (obsessions) and engage in behaviors or mental acts in response to these thoughts or obsessions.Often the person carries out the behaviors to reduce the impact or get rid of the obsessive thoughts, but this only brings temporary relief. Not performing the obsessive rituals can cause great anxiety. A person's level of OCD can be anywhere from mild to severe, but if left untreated, it can limit his or her ability to function at work or school or even to lead a comfortable existence at home or around others. (Source: https://www.psychologytoday.com/conditions/obsessive-compulsive-disorder)

Damn, huh. Feeling separated from reality

Conflicts with ideals make my head hurt

Social phobia started around age 18.

Yeah, around that time my mind became more polluted

For the first line to the second line he's talking about how he's over thinking so much. Sometimes he's having second thoughts about what he should do or what he should not do or maybe he's feeling extremely anxious.

But what bothers me about this verse is this line: “Feeling separated from reality“

Is he hinting that he used to have a Depersonalization Disorder?

Brief explanation for Depersonalization Disorder:

Depersonalization disorder (DPD), also known as depersonalization-derealization syndrome, is a mental disorder in which the person has persistent or recurrent feelings of depersonalization and/or derealization. Symptoms can be classified as either depersonalization or derealization. Depersonalization is described as feeling disconnected or estranged from one's self. Individuals experiencing depersonalization may report feeling as if they are an outside observer of their own thoughts or body, and often report feeling a loss of control over their thoughts or actions.[1] In some cases, individuals may be unable to accept their reflection as their own, or they may have out-of-body experiences.[2] (Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depersonalization_disorder)

Does this mean that he can't control his actions and thoughts at that time? As if he was just merely observing himself? That he can’t accept who he is at that time?

Moving on to the the third line and the fourth line, it's safe to say that around that time is where those mental illness started.

So maybe that's about the time where he started audition in BigHit and tried to ask his parents’ permission to be a rapper but unfortunately his parents' didn't seem to agree with him.

Sometimes I’m afraid of myself too,

From the self-disgust and depression coming to play again

Min Yoongi is already dead (I killed him)

It’s been a long time since passion has died and comparing myself to others have become my daily life.

First line to the second line, it's as if he's saying that he hates himself. His depression is taking over again. In some type of occasion when a person has a depression, some people who has may feel utterly useless or they can’t accept who they are, and that causes someone to hate himself.

Third to fourth line. He said that he killed himself (Not literally obviously) but the person who used to be passionate, the person who used to dream and the person that used to hope; is now gone. But instead someone whose mind is clouded by negative thoughts, replaced him. That instead of hoping and dreaming, he just gave up and he just started to compare himself to other people who's probably more successful than him at that time. Which leads him to a probable question 'How come I’m only like this?'

The first day I visited the psychiatry department, my parents came to get counselling with me.

My parents said that they don’t know me well

I don’t know myself well either.

Then who would know? Friends? You? Nobody knows me well.

In this verse. It clearly implies that his parents and him are not that close nor he has opened up to his parents that much. Meaning they don't what kind of person their son's actually is nor what he has been going through. Then to support this conclusion, Yoongi said from the third line to the third line that he doesn't even know himself nor his friends know him that much. So I have concluded that he's also probably suffering from identity crisis at that time.

It's actually quite sad that he can't go to anyone at that time because no one can understand him because they don't know Yoongi that much. So there's a probability that he's been bottling up those feelings and fighting his demons alone.

The doctor asked me

Have you ever.. “beeeeeeep” ?

I said without hesitating, that there were times when I have.

When you go to a psychiatrist for counseling, the first things they'll ask you is the ‘Have you ever’ question.

For example:

'Have you ever harmed yourself or attempted to kill yourself?'

‘Have you ever thought of harming yourself or killing yourself’

And he answered them unhesitatingly that he've done that a few times. So in my opinion, he probably thought of doing it or worse he attempted to do it.

Like a habit, I say “uh, I don’t give a shit, I don’t give a fuck”

All those saying are, uh, trying to hide my weakness

That time I want to erase. Yeah, that day of performance that I can’t even remember,

Myself that looked back at me as I hid in the washroom, afraid of people.

Now, let’s talk about this verse. He really has a habit of saying that he doesn’t care but I have notice even before he released this track that he’s not really honest about his feelings nor what he wants. Even the members claimed that Yoongi’s not really honest with himself and he needs to learn how to be more honest about himself.

He has a tough persona, not only to his fans but to also to the other members and constantly saying that he doesn’t give a shit. But for someone who constantly say this, his actions shows how much he cares for them and what the others think of him.

For instance, There was this one time when Hoseok was alone for christmas since at he was planning on surprising his parents but unfortunately, Hoseok’s family already booked a trip somewhere without telling Hoseok ‘causing him to be alone for Christmas. When Yoongi found out about that he immediately went towards the dorms with fried chicken so he can accompany Hoseok for Christmas. Proving no matter how much he cares for his members without saying it.

Also, around 2015 during their concert in Kobe, Japan, Yoongi and Taehyung wasn’t able to attend due to nausea. Yoongi could’ve just tweeted that he apologizes for not being able to attend but no. After a few days/probably weeks (I’m so sorry I can’t remember) he went back the concert hall just to experience what his fans felt as he reflected on his actions.

Now, to talk about the third line of this verse. He was talking about a certain concert that he wants to erase also stating that he can’t remember that performance. Personally, I think he was talking about the same concert in Kobe, Japan. Perhaps, he wants to erase that memory because he thinks that he’s lacking and because he didn’t fulfil what he needs to do. And maybe, he can’t remember it because he was never there during the second day of their performance.

For the fourth line, I think he was also referring to what happened in Kobe. He tweeted that after the second day he started to lose his confidence to meet people with a clear conscience. And to reflect on his actions, he hid inside the bathroom as he stared at the mirror, most probably cried a lot while doing so.

Yoongi’s tweet:

That time I, that time I..

I thought success will make it all worthwhile

But you know, but you know

It feels like I’m becoming more of a monster as time passes.

Honestly, I’m still not sure about this verse but in my interpretation, he was talking about him being a trainee in the first and second line. In how he thinks that once he debuts he will make everything better. But then again, as time passes, he’s starting to want more than that creating a monster inside of him.

The monster called success that I paid with my youth, wants more wealth

The greed that used to be my tool is now turning to swallow me, ruin me and put a leash around my neck

Some people forcefully cover my mouth and tell me to swallow this forbidden fruit

I don’t want it. They want me to leave this garden

Let’s talk about the first line. Usually, idols train at a young age and Yoongi was no exception considering he trained when he was around 18. Just to achieve his dream to be a successful he had no choice but to train at that age. So instead of like other 18 year olds who can still have fun, Yoongi needed to do tons of part time jobs since his parents doesn’t support his decisions. He needed those jobs to continue being a trainee and support himself.

For the second line, he’s stating that the greed that he’s using to his dream has grown and he can’t control it anymore, instead it’s controlling him. Making him want more and more and just creating a monster called greed.

The third line, Yoongi is implying that some people are telling him to just accept that greed because that will help him be successful. Just like how the serpent tempted Eve to eat the forbidden fruit in exchange for knowledge. It’s as if they’re telling Yoongi to just to let the ‘monster’ take over as he continued to strive for success in his career.

For the last line, you can see Yoongi denying it, that he doesn’t want to leave the garden. Those people wants him to just embrace that greed and leave The Garden Eden but he doesn’t want that. It seems here that despite of wanting to succeed he still wants to keep his conscience clean.

Shit, shit, I get it. Please just stop.

I’m the cause of all these issues anyway, so I’ll stop on my own

If my misfortune is your happiness, I’ll gladly be unfortunate

If your target of hatred is me, I’ll stand on the guillotine for you.

I’m still not sure about this verse though. I’ve struggled with this verse the most but still here’s what I’ve understand:

Personally, in this verse I think his fighting with his parents. In the first line the way he’s saying ‘Shit Shit’ clearly means that he’s struggling and having conflicts with his mind. It’s as if like he's probably thinking some sort of things that his parents might say and he’s just telling them inside his mind to stop in a way as if he was in pain. And not to mention the fact that, his parents used to be against of his decisions of being an idol.

From the third line to the fourth line, it’s as if he keeps on blaming himself. Telling himself that he’s the one at fault and the reason why he’s having mental issues. That he’s only giving them misfortunes them misfortunes and that they probably hate him. And if he’s really the cause for all that then he’s willing to give up or even just die to end it all.

The things I had imagined become reality. The childhood dream is in front of my eyes

The little shit that performed in front of crowd of two, is now heading towards Tokyo dome

There’s only one life, so I’m going to live with more fire than anyone else.. Anyone can just live along haphazardly.

My fan my hommie my fam, don’t worry, I’m really alright now, damn

This verse basically says that the things that he used to just dream about imagine, have now come true. He used to just perform in a few amount of people, now, he’s performing in front of thousands of people.

He’s also saying that you only live once so he will work as hard more than anyone else. That he will be more passionate and live with determination while the others, unlike him, can just live without it.

And from what happened, what he achieved and where he’s standing right now, he can finally say that he’s okay. That he’s alright now.

After having denied what my essence is multiple times

My address is idol, I don’t deny it.

The anguish that dug into my mind many times

The end to wandering. There was no answer.

From the first line to the second line, it seems that he’s saying that he used to deny who he is. That maybe he didn’t really accepted the that title because most underground rappers tend to look down on idols which probably leads him to deny the fact that he’s debuting as an idol. But after experiencing what those idols experienced I think he’s saying that he’s not ashamed of it anymore. That he finally accepts who he is and he understands those idols now.

Now, for the last two lines, He’s saying that he used to strain himself, wondering whether his decision was right or what does he need to do.Then he come up with the conclusion that there’s still no answer but for now he’s just going to keep doing it to finally see the answer.

My pride that I thought I had sold out, has now become my self-respect

My fans, I hope you hold your head up high with pride. Who else would do as much as me? uh.

From Seiko to Rolex, from Ax to Gym

For the first line, he’s stating that he used to think that he sold out his pride because he became an idol but now after finally realizing, that it wasn’t that bad to be an idol, he finally gained respect to himself. Meaning he finally accepts, who he is and what he he has become.

In the second line, he’s clearly saying that he’s talking to us and it’s as if he’s saying that he hopes we’re proud of him and we can hold our heads up high as he’ve done so much as our idols.

Now for the last line, he’s talking about he’s rise for success as Seiko’s average price is $200 while Rolex’s average price is worth $10,000 and AX Korean Facility can accommodate 2000 people while Gym/Olympic Gymnastics Stadium has the capacity of 15 000 people.

The tens of thousands that nod to the gestures from my hands

Show Me the Money. It’s not that I couldn’t do it. I didn’t do it. Shit.

You guys that sold us out, it’s not that you didn’t do it. You couldn’t do it. Shit.

The roots of my creativity has tasted the world’s sweetness, bitterness, to shittiness.

The days of trying to fall asleep on the floor of the bathroom is now bittersweet memory, uh, becomes memories.

I had my debut, while holding onto my shoulder that was injured in an accident during my part-time delivery job.

To whom do you think you’re pretending to have suffered hardship?

The first line basically says the amount of people who are listening to their music, Bangtan’s music.

For the second line, He’s saying that it’s not that he didn’t had the chance for that show, it’s just that he doesn’t want to be a part of that show. Show Me The Money is where some idol-rappers are put into some kind of test to see if they’re qualified as a rapper. And personally, I think Yoongi didn’t want to be in that show because he doesn’t want anyone to judge he’s way for music or music shouldn’t be tested like that.

The third line, he’s referring to those underground rappers that looks down on idol rappers. He’s talking about how underground rappers doesn’t acknowledge how idol rappers works so hard and how difficult it is to be one. I think the term ‘sell-out’ is what the underground rappers tends to use at time. That they think becoming an idol-rapper is way easier than being an underground rapper. After Yoongi auditioned to BigHit, the underground rappers probably called him a sell-out because he gave up on being an underground rapper to achieve his dreams. He’s basically saying that it’s not that the didn’t chose to be an idol-rapper, it’s just they couldn’t do it or they can’t make it as an idol-rapper.

In the fourth line, he’s saying that the reason for all his creations is that he has experienced it all from sweetness to bitterness and even shittiness.

The fifth line, I think he’s implying his past attempt to suicide. That he used to try to ‘fall asleep in the bathroom’ but now it has now turned into just a painful memory. Because think of it, most people who attempts to hurt himself or attempts to kill themselves do it inside the bathroom.

The sixth line basically says that he had suffered so much before debuting. He have worked his ass off to the point where he even injured his shoulders. Yoongi trained without any support from his parents that’s why he had to do tons of part time jobs to support himself.

For the last line, he’s referring to those idols who pretend that they’ve suffere to get their fans’ sympathy. That what they’ve pretending they’ve gone through is nothing compare to what happened to him.

From Seiko to Rolex, from Ax to Gym

The tens of thousands that nod to the gestures from my hands

Watch me, uh. Born out of anguish

You guys that sold us out, it’s not that you didn’t do it. You couldn’t do it. Shit.

Now, for my final conclusion, I think Yoongi’s not just talking about his mental illness here. He’s telling us a story, his journey before he became who he is now. It’s as if like he’s inspiring us to never give up no matter what happens and we should continue living passionately.

That’s about it, that my long ass and not to mention extremely late analysis for Agust D’s The Last.

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evartandadam · 8 years

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Since it's the theme today: can you do more analysis' on Hidan's behavior, like I wanna see if you think he has similar mental illnesses that I think he does! He's so complex and such a mystery! What are your thoughts on how any illnesses and disorders erupted as he grew up? Through his religious path? Through the akatsuki? I'm so curious! :D

Hidan is very complex! Kishi did an amazing job on his character! I wish he gave him more of a background haha!

Ok, so first I will go over possible disorders, then talk about his general personality and behavior.

Disorders:

If anything, he has a personality disorder. I definitely think he has borderline personality disorder, and probably PTSD like all the other Akatsuki (I mean, honestly). Also probably depressed. Aaand probably a bit sociopathic, but that one’s complicated. I will talk about that last one in his general personality section.

Borderline Personality Disorder:

Signs:

Inappropriate or extreme emotional reactions- I would say so.

Highly impulsive behaviors- Oh yes.

A history of unstable relationships- Yeah.

Symptoms:

Having an unstable or dysfunctional self-image or a distorted sense of self (how one feels about one’s self)- I think so, because of the kind of cult he’s involved in.

Feelings of isolation, boredom and emptiness- I think Hidan often feels alone, and bored. He seems to always be seeking conversation or something to entertain him. When bored, he gets lost in thought.

Difficulty feeling empathy for others- This is a tricky one, because I think as a kid, he definitely had trouble with this. Growing up, I think he is capable of empathy. And part of his faith is about sharing pain with others. So even if he struggled, he would try to follow this commandment and think of other’s emotions from that point on.

A history of unstable relationships that can change drastically from intense love and idealization to intense hate- I think so. He was probably proud of his village, and his place in it, but once they no longer needed ninja, he turned on it quickly, killing the elders and leaving to join a cult. He is no longer with his cult members- this can be taken many ways, but I feel that he probably left, believing he is the one true follower, and the others didn’t meet his standards. I think the cult is probably after him, actually. He is just on his own, running amuck.

A persistent fear of abandonment and rejection, including extreme emotional reactions to real and even perceived abandonment- I think Hidan definitely has abandonment issues. I feel he probably didn’t have a good home life, and he wants acceptance and validation, which is why he fell into the cult’s clutches. People who need acceptance are the ones who end up in cults.

Intense, highly changeable moods that can last for several days or for just a few hours- Like, I think Hidan has some control over how he acts, but inside, he feels elated one moment, and down in the dumps the next.

Strong feelings of anxiety, worry and depression- I don’t think Hidan is anxious at all. He has placed all of his trust in his god, and he fears little. But I do think he is depressed.

Impulsive, risky, self-destructive and dangerous behaviors, including reckless driving, drug or alcohol abuse and having unsafe sex- Hidan probably did self-destructive stuff before becoming a Jashinist. I think for him, Jashinism helps him stay under control, because of the regulations. Because he is so faithful and serious about Jashinism, he will try his best to follow the laws. I believe Jashinism would list these types of behaviors as sins. It’s funny he is named “hidan”, because I think of hidanism, the opposite of what he follows. I think he avoids self-indulgent behaviors, because they are seen as selfish and pleasurable. Jashinism is about destruction, not pleasure. He is still an impulsive person- that is just his personality- but he tries not to partake in really crazy activities, like those examples.

Hostility- Hahahahahaa well yeah.

Unstable career plans, goals and aspirations- I think before Jashinism, he struggled to find his purpose. He settled on being a warrior, and I think he worked very hard at it. But I don’t think he had trouble sticking to that goal. Like, he has a short attention span, but I think if he sets his mind to something, he can be very stubborn.

PTSD

So, I think he has this just because realistically, this would be very common for ninja to have, especially ninja of his status. Whether the crappy things he’s seen bother him or not, I don’t know. Probably depends on how personal it is. I don’t think bloody war would bother him too much, but a bad family experience from is childhood would. So I think it depends on headcanons. I don’t think he would know that he has PTSD, and he wouldn’t complain about it or really bring it up if he did know.

Depression

I think literally all of the Akatsuki are depressed. I think Hidan is stuck feeling like nothing good comes out of life really, and part of him wants it to end. But then again, he is definitely a survivalist, so his instincts would prevent him from taking action. Jashin gives him a purpose, and his faith is what’s keeping him going. He is definitely into self harm, and likes to play it up as something raw, something that allows him to feel truly alive. But I think he feels bored and empty when he’s not stimulated, and he sits around brooding, thinking about life and death. He spends a lot of time pondering deep questions. People think he’s an idiot, but Hidan is farther along spiritually than most. He accepts death when it comes.

General Behavior and Personality:

The thing is, people can easily label themselves with all sorts of disorders, but most of these behaviors are normal in certain amounts. Hidan is rash, gullible, and misses some social cues. He is overly violent, and seeks validation from others. He is a mess. But I also don’t see him as being super crazy as a person? Like, he’s generally a likable guy, and he likes to talk to people. He also isn’t stupid in some ways. People diss his intellect too much. He is a good battle strategist and can actually read people pretty well. He has good instincts when it comes to people, I think. He is observant in ways others are not.

He is interesting, because he seems like he should be one thing, but after consideration, would actually be the opposite. Hidan is a bunch of contradictions, really. These opposite aspects of his personality add up to make… well, Hidan!

Messy, and yet, Orderly?

He likes to be clean, but I don’t think he is actually OCD. He is just a bit particular about some things. As an example, due to Hidan’s impulsive and outgoing nature, I would think he would have messy handwriting. But then again, he likes to be neat, and I think he would want his handwriting to be orderly.

He loves to bathe in the blood of his enemies, but he wants it washed off as soon as it dries. He hates bad smells, and slicks his hair back. He takes care of his appearance. I think he doesn’t bother wearing a shirt because a) He doesn’t like to wear clothes in general, and b) He knows the shirts will get ruined anyway, so what’s the point.

He also draws perfect circles hahaa and I know that’s just for the show’s sake, but I also like to think his circles have to be perfect, or it will drive him crazy.

But personality-wise, he cuts corners and doesn’t care about details. He just wants to get done what he has to get done. He’s not a planner in most cases. He is impulsive- instinctive.

Distrusting, and yet, Gullible?

He can be gullible, and easy to trick- The Jashinists converted him, and boy did they do a good job. He is pretty content following orders. But, Hidan is also suspicious of other people and their motives. He does still have to be convinced. It would just be easier to convince him than others, once you use his emotions in your favor. But then again, if he dislikes someone, or an idea, I think he would stick to his guns.

I guess a good way to explain this is Chizome- When Hidan will come across Hitomi in my story, he won’t like her. She is too friendly and charming, and everything about her seems too simple. He senses that she is hiding something. That she has other motives. Whether this is true or not, Hidan will not give up on his instincts. Even when Kakuzu assures him she is not an enemy, and calls him an idiot, Hidan still knows something is up. (And Hidan is right about her in some ways, and wrong in others).

I decided this would be his reaction to her, based on what I know about his character. Which is that he has good instincts about people in ways others do not. He is suspicious of other’s motives. And he is stubborn.

The reason he is suspicious of people in general is because of his own personal experiences in the past. I have my own hcs about his backstory (duh, I wrote a full thing about him that will be in Chizome), and I think he distrusts people, not only because his village betrayed him, but because he has had bad luck with personal relationships. My friend Dana does an excellent job at explaining his issues with trusting others in her comic, Akachou. He is distrusting, and she shows probably where it started.

Whiny, and yet, Tough?

Hidan drives Kakuzu up the wall with his constant commentary and whining. When Hidan is bored, he whines. He likes to complain about stupid, shallow stuff. But when it comes to his dark thoughts and feelings, I think Hidan would mostly keep them to himself, once in awhile making a comment, not caring if anyone is listening. Hidan is a tough guy, and doesn’t want to be seen as vulnerable. He doesn’t want pity. He thinks there’s no point in sharing feelings, or opening up to people. He thinks people generally don’t care.

He also won’t take pity on others if they whine. Well, he’s open for some mutual venting, sure, but he is into tough love.

Empathetic, and yet, Sociopathic?

Hidan was definitely one of those sociopathic kids who was a little too comfortable with violence and death, and scared other kids. But all children have sociopathic tendencies. What’s interesting is how he ended up.

I don’t think Hidan is a hardcore sociopath. I think it’s hard to get to him, because he has hardened his heart, as all of the other Akatsuki have, in order to protect himself. He has had crappy experiences, and it is just easier not to care about other’s problems.

I do think Hidan is a bit of a sociopath, because whenever I write him with others, and bad things happen to him, he isn’t as bothered as he should be. He thinks that is part of life, and what happened, happened. But I do think he is capable of making a bond with someone close to him. So, he’s not nearly as bad as Sasori, and he’s not dangerous strictly because it’s tougher to make meaningful bonds with him. I think he likes animals, even though I hc him torturing them (or at least not caring about them) as a child? I think he grows more empathetic as he ages.

Also, as I said, Jashinism is about sharing pain. And Hidan takes his faith seriously. If he is instructed to understand his victim’s pain, I think he would try to do so. After joining the cult, he tried to relate to others more. So for him, it would also be a conscious thing.

There are many others, but I’ll just post this for now :) I could talk about Hidan for hours, he’s very complex haha, as you said! I adore your blog, by the way!! Also would love to know your take on him, if you have a link! :D

#hidan #akatsuki #naruto #headcanon #text post #asks #rambles #reapersperdition

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