#honestly guys i do love tim being bi

[panic-and-procrastinate-drawing]

Tim Drake Redesign - Rumour

i combined a lot of his past outfits into this one, the belts obviously inspired by his red robin outfit, and his gloves and boots inspired by his current robin outfit, minus the shoe shape, which i decided myself to give him ninja like shoes to sneak around better. I also gave his elbows yellow patches to match his knees, but its hard to see in this pic.

I decided to keep his current R as his Rumour symbol bc no.1 he's pretty clearly attached to his robin days, i thought it might comfort him thru the change :(. no.2 theres no real symbol for a rumour? like for spoiler she could honestly have an exclamation mark, but nothing for a rumour, so yeah, R it is. (although the robin symbol is an R despite it being a bird so... maybe the robin symbol should change to a bird instead.)

feel free to use in fanfics and such! i imagine him as a duo with steph, with her being the loud front attack (like a spoiler) so that rumour could sneak around back to do his own damage u know?

[buddiebeginz]

I was talking to a friend earlier and it got me thinking about something.

B*mmy stans project all of the stuff they do onto us to an extent I've never seen with any other fandom discourse before.

They call us homophobic for not liking B/T or T*mmy. Yet they hate on people for shipping Buddie or seeing Eddie as queer. To the point of harassing people for including Eddie and Buddie in pride posts. Continually harassing the 911news account and even trying to dox a journalist for posting about Buddie.

They call us delusional for having watched two men love and support one another for 6 going on 7 years and for thinking there could be something more than friendship there. Even though Oliver, Ryan, and Tim have all said they see what we see. Yet they've seen Buck kiss a guy twice, have very minimal screen time or development and they headcanon that they're in love and will get married in the coming season.

They say we fetishize Buddie. Yet most of the time when our fandom is discussing our ship we're talking about the emotional connection between them. Or how we want to see them finally be together in a canon romantic relationship or as a full fledged family (with Chris). Or have their first kiss. Meanwhile most of their posts are the kind of sex they headcanon Buck and T*mmy have. Hell after that that dinner scene tons of them changed their urls to something with daddy in it (referencing the out of place daddy kink joke). To be clear there's nothing wrong with headcanons about fictional characters sex lives. But the main reason most of us ship Buddie is not just because they're two hot guys who we want to think about f*cking, it's because we're invested in the story of their life together. The same can't be said for B/T.

They say we feminize Buck for Buddie:

Meanwhile most of their fics/art/headcanons involve T*mmy being the big strong protector rescuing the "damsel in distress" Buck. They constantly talk about how hot it is that T*mmy is this big older "daddy" firefighter who can take care of Buck and guide him in what it means to be in a m|m relationship.

They say we've made Buck's coming out all about Buddie but 1. Eddie and Buck's feelings for him were heavily included in Buck's bi awakening ep. 2. They have made T*mmy synonymous with buck's coming out to the point of saying Buck wouldn't have even realized he liked men without T*mmy. They've even said that if T*mmy and Buck were to break up in s8 that it would ruin Buck's coming out story.

They accuse our fandom of being mean and of harassing the actors including of sending death threats to Lou. Of chasing Lou off of social media and being the one who caused him to stop his cameos. They say we're the reason Oliver chooses not interact with Lou or anything B/T related online. When there has been no proof of any of this. Meanwhile there is proof from their own fandom that Oliver and Ryan have blocked some of them. They have repeatedly tried to pressure Oliver to interact with B/T posts and Lou. They were also leaving comments on the the video of the podcast Ryan did (with Tommy DiDario) where he talked about his s*icide attempt, telling him he should have finished the job.

They call us a cult or BoBs (Buddie or Bust) yet they dress up like Lou and would still be paying for his videos if he was still willing to put them out. They prioritize Lou/T*mmy above any other character on the show. They talk about how T*mmy should get a begins episode. How T*mmy should be a main character. They defend everything T*mmy has ever done including when he was racist and homophobic to Chim and Hen. They harass anyone who has a negative word to say about their ship or Lou or T*mmy much like a cult would protect their leader. They to this day act like everything Lou ever told them in his cameos is the gospel truth.

911 fandom has grown increasingly toxic ever since B/T became a thing and I honestly just can't wait for the day we either find out T*mmy isn't coming back or when his last ep will be. I mean in some ways our fandom won't ever be the same after this. I've seen a lot of ugly sides to people who I had followed for years as Buddie shippers.

It will never not confuse the hell out of me that some people who were big time Buddie shippers for years not only dropped Buddie but turned completely against the ship and our fandom. And all for a ship that is seriously underdeveloped and one that it's clear the show is telling us in flashing neon lights isn't meant to last.

[valenschmidt]

i think i found it! this one mentions season 4 being when tim first brought it to oliver. https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/911-buck-eddie-television-firefighters-relationship-1235014753/amp/

YES!!!! They quoted directly from the interview I posted but make the clarification that it was indeed in S4, so this proves that Buck was supposed to be bi canonically since s4 (although they had been dropping little hints before that like in that worm guy scene and ofc whatever mating ritual he tried to do with Eddie in 2x01 + that BLUSH he got when Eddie complemented him)

And Eddie of course has been showing signs of being gay (and repressed) since s2 because honestly LOOK AT HIM

but the hints got bigger and bigger as the season progressed and (in my opinion) THE WILL was the biggest of them all... like he really made his best friend (who he had only known FOR A YEAR AT THE TIME) the legal guardian of his son if something happened to him. Who does that?!?!?

A man in love that's who

So buddie should have been canon in s4 and since ABC gave us bi Buck for episodes in... I'm 100% they'll be canon in s8

[the-sinful-voice-witch]

The Bi Tim Drake and Stephanie Brown, is time I let them go...

I'm deeply sorry fellow Timstephers... I wanted to be loyal🥲, I really did but in the end... I think Steph deserves better😢 so I must embrace my other options for her because DC actually never let them fully click, at least on Tim's side and honestly this hurts, because despite everything I actually wanted them to work but now I have to accept that maybe the writers just did too much damage 🥺😞, let's start for the beginning👇👇:

I wish her identity was kept secret longer, it would have been more romantic if Tim fell for her not knowing her face and frankly the love triangle/cheating thing with Ariana (his first girlfriend) was so messed up and exhausting to read... I didn't like their first kiss was cheating! 😞 and when they finally got together they had again the stupid problem about Robin's secret identity, (I think somewhere in between there was an issue with another blonde girl, named Greta who tried to hurt Steph and I hated Tim's way of acting 😑 she even kissed him and he didn't react badly despite being with Steph 😠 in fact he smiled and said "chicks dig the cape") then Batman tells her Tim's identity, Tim gets mad then they make up, then she thinks he is cheating on her because a random girl classmate kisses him out of the blue and becomes Robin when he retired, then she dies and... He gave us a dry, tearless and unsatisfying reaction 😒, then not even a year passed (in the comics) he quickly starts having new suitors (writers can't just let him being single), like some girl named Darla, Cassie (another blonde with who he has a double rebound relationship after Superboy's death and Tim expressed a lot of more grief about Superboy, his best friend than the one who was his girlfriend, Stephanie was barely mentioned because they wanted you to forget about her) and then when he had again another civil background character girlfriend named Zoanne BOOM Stephanie comes back to the land of the living... and again... Cheating kiss! 🙄🤦‍♀️🤬 why? Just why? And of course the relationship with the boring civil girl doesn't last but he doesn't get back to Stephanie until he finished his dark emo phase in which he had a relationship with Tam Fox who dumped him because she only liked his Red Robin persona and also has a horny moment with another girl named Lynx while still being attracted to Steph 🙃🙃 What kind of ladies man is this guy?😂 (he also had a thing with jubilee from Marvel in a crossover and... Fucking marries BARBARA GORDON💀💀 in one of Batman's video games, I can't fucking believe there's an universe where Barbara gets to marry Tim but not Steph? Batman beyond doesn't count because is not confirmed the background wife is her and very spiteful I have to mention when Barbara's "death" Happened again he expresses more grief and gives more reaction than when Steph "died" But seriously WTH? In that game Dick is there too why is Tim the one romancing Babs when she is supposed to be even older than the oldest Robin? 💀💀) and finally after Stephanie wins some random tournament they get together again and almost bang but they couldn't because they were all banged up from the fight and I think that was all until the new 52 reboot...

So in the reboot they changed their origins and they met in Harper Row's house, they looked at each other Harper teased him and... They got together out of camera 😑😑 (I hate it when they do that, you skip all the development!) and they gave us this beautiful scene in young Justice

These beautiful moments that we will never get back... I can't believe after this passionate confession of love and everything that happens in these Issues (though to be honest this moment doesn't have as much weight as it would have in the pre reboot because here we didn't see the process of them falling in love) they just separated them like nothing out of the blue in such a tacky VERY tacky and lazy way 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️ but before that... Let's talk about the toxic side of their relationship pre new 52 reboot:

Stephanie once told Tim that he was too good for her in anycase when he was having insecurities about her feelings, he once asked her if she would like him even if he wasn't Robin, he was always insecure about their relationship (even thought she wanted him so hard and was so eager and straightfoward on him since he kissed her for the first time) and honestly giving how he treated her... I see so many inconsistencies 😑 or hypocrisy, I always hated how he always put her down and discouraged her from the vigilante life making her feeling she wasn't worthy or good enough (of course under the excuse of good intentions because that life is too dangerous... When he had a normal family and a good life unlike his orphan predecessors and Steph who had a shitty life with a criminal parent and drug addict mother and still demanded to be Robin because that was his dream... And then DC made him conveniently an orphan too to make things easier at the same time they tried to get rid of his girlfriend 🤦‍♀️) when he always felt exactly that way and Batman and other characters had to cheer him up constantly so where did the empathy go? No, seriously🙁 how is it that he is the one comforting her when is Batman the one making her feel that way? What about the times is HE is the one who does it? Feels so hypocritical, he held her back on her potential, I remember reading an issue when he arrogantly said that be a part of the teen Titans is out of her league when she was offered to join and had the entitlement to affirm that she can't speak for herself (and honestly I only saw him be against that because later in young Justice Cassie thought she was joining and was appraised by other members while training, they didn't look down on her but no, she was there only as moral support for Tim) and tried to shut her out a lot of times even in front other characters like Black Canary and Green Arrow's son and in his red Robin period when Bruce was believed death also treated her so bad and demanded her to never be spoiler again, the arrogant prick! I know he was very hurt and sad and what Steph did under Batman's orders was messed up but still to arrogantly demand that? Batman didn't have any right and sure as hell Tim has even less right to take away the Spoiler because is something SHE CREATED without their influence! So dude THE AUDACITY! And again how he called her useless and told her if she was playing dress up when she became Batgirl 🤦‍♀️ yes I know he later apologizes after acknowledging how much better she got at fighting but still... I don't know, all felt shallow. I never liked that she chose to become Robin after she thought he was cheating on her, I saw it as a jerk move but... I can't really blame her for feeling insecure and believe it, after all she became his girlfriend after Tim cheated with her on his first girlfriend and never saw Steph as an equal on that time so... Well I guess all this mess is what helps me to move on them 🤷‍♀️ and now let's talk about the bi disaster... and unfortunately not the good kind:

DC come here, sit with me, we need to talk... Did you hire some kind of... Wattpad fanfic writer by any chance? Because the quality of this pride special... Feels like something you could perfectly find on the lamest part of wattpad 🤦‍♀️, tacky and lazy doesn't even cover up this... and I'm so offended such writing got that amazingly good art 😤😤. So, in the process of making Tim bisexual they had to... Break up his relationship with his girlfriend when they were finally good together without drama after everything they went through for literally NO REASON (seriously there is a real literal dialogue of him explaining to some dude he broke up with his girlfriend someone he LOVES for no reason 🙃🙃) so he could have a relationship with a dude so that he could have a solid proof that he digs in both ways 🙄... This is insulting because in the pre reboot they had a lot of understandable reasons to break up but after the reboot they had a really good relationship of course I didn't like this time they started their relationship out of camera but they still gave us development and a confession I would have loved them to have in the pre reboot but then this shit happened just like that! 🙄🤷‍♀️ So much for be madly in love uh?

You can't just turn that off and then turn it on again on another random person like a switch 🤦‍♀️! Isn't kind of hilarious, people wanted him bi so he could be with Superboy but DC decided to give him instead a background NPC boyfriend created 20 fucking years ago nobody even remembered, yeah sure the guy is not unpleasant but he is so painfully irrelevant just like Ariana or Zoanne (the normal civil ex-girlfriends) but I dare to say at least Ariana provided some "entertaining" drama, exhausting to read nonetheless but still... this random guy was chosen over Superboy Conner Kent! That is literally the only character that could rivalize with Stephanie in story with Tim but noooo Superboy couldn't be Bisexual too... Oh no wait, wait a second... Didn't DC actually made a bi Superboy? Oh dear, let me get this straight (je je "straight", no pun intended 🤪) people wanted Robin Tim bi because they shipped him with Superboy Conner but the ship couldn't be because they couldn't make that Superboy bi but instead they made Bi the other Superboy Jon Kent that shouldn't be in any serious relationship in the first place because he should still be a little kid but they aged him up 🤬🤬 and paired him with another painfully boring boyfriend they think is interesting because is Lois Lane's numer 1 fan🙄🙄 and studies to be a journalist too🙄🙄 because Superman's son had to be in love with a journalist just like him🙄🙄... And he is intangible because we can't have Jon having to worry about his boyfriend being in danger and on top of that has an ugly design, sorry for those who like it but I hate his design... most of the time his hair looks like mushroom style and thick hipster glasses are just not for everyone, Barbara Gordon can pull it this guy can't, I once saw an illustration of him that looked like a pink haired with glasses angry Karen and I just can't unsee it... Seriously he needs another haircut at the very least... Ok back to the Bi Robin...

Ok so it could not be Conner it had to be a civilian, the thing is there was another character they could have used: Cullen Row! The very first appearance he made he stated to be gay and being very interested of in Tim and at the very least he has the minimum importance of being the brother of a known vigilante character, Harper Row. And Cullen and Harper are friends with Steph so I'm sure Cullen would have scolded Tim for how he treated her and pretty sure he would have threatened him to tell his sister to taser his ass if he doesn't make things right with Steph, she didn't deserve to be ghosted! To be treated coldly out of the blue without giving her a reason! Or for a good reason at all. The point is that this was an established gay character interested in Tim and knows the vigilante life, that already make things easier and also is a good excuse to see Harper Row more often even if she gave up vigilante life, it would be nice to see her again but NOOOOO we pull a forgotten character out of nowhere and without development 🙄😑, they shouldn't have slapped us with all this at once in just one pride special, they should have left hints or showing us something in the regular issues, I don't like things happening just because, ok? representation matters but that doesn't mean we have to accept lazy tacky wattpad shit, that's called pandering! why couldn't they take their time to built properly the relationship just like they did with Poison Ivy and Harley Quinn? Like I could see the process of Harley and Ivy liking each other, we also saw the process of Steph and Tim liking each other but they never showed us why Tim and Bernard like each other, what does Bernard has that he destroyed Tim's madly love for Steph so easily? Why does it feel that they weren't on the mood to work on the relationship and simply put a text saying "they've been talking to each other again after Tim and Steph broke up" And boom! They are on a date and the whole story turns into a story about Tim's sexuality 🤦‍♀️🤡, that's right his new boyfriend is a character that is nothing more than a walking proof of his bisexuality, literally that is his one and only purpose of existence and Tim went from being: "the Third Robin" "The smartest Robin" "The true perfect Robin" "The best detective that could best Batman" To literally being known as "THE BI ROBIN"🤡🤡, now the only thing that matters about him is that he was dating a girl and now he is dating a boy... (And same with Jon Kent, he is now just the Bi or Gay Superman, ajjj just make him go back to be 10 years old DC, he was more interesting as a kid with Damian) This is just how badly DC handled this in my opinion because I don't remember Batwoman to be known as the Batlesbian and Harley and Ivy are simply Harley and Ivy they aren't the Bisexual Gotham sirens and we all know Constantine is a manwhore who even banged a embodiment of a whole City but people doesn't only know him because of his sexual orientation, these characters just happened to have this sexual orientations but who they fuck isn't what makes them good characters.

And to make things worse and cringe, because yes this can get worse, on top of making Tim treat Stephanie so badly just because, they denigrated her by not allowing her to feel like a normal human being with feelings who was dumped for no reason, ghosted without a reason and easily forgotten by someone she considered her first true love would feel, you know... Sad, dejected, hurt, angry... Nope. Some idiot thought that she could only do that if she was replaced by other girl but if she is replaced by a boy she has to be nothing but a cringy supportive fangirl ex- girlfriend 🤡🤦‍♀️, that's right Tim decided that the most "sensitive and thoughtful" thing to do with the person he dumped out of the blue for nothing, and ghosted for nothing and tried to ignore her and avoid in her face when she finally confronted him until his friends forced him to behave like a minimum decent person and TALK to her was... Introduce her to his new boyfriend WITHOUT ASKING HER OR EVEN WARNING HER 🤬🤬🤬

and the result was the absolutely cringy shitty wattpad reaction of her hugging Bernard saying "i finally get to meet you, this is the best day ever"💀💀💀💀 excuse me? The best day ever for her is the day she meets her ex's new boyfriend? After everything Tim put her through? Can someone explain to me the need of this? The need to denigrate and ridiculize Stephanie Brown? Hasn't this character suffered enough humiliation?😡😡You know Tim? Superboy at least told Cassie that she deserved a better first love than him and you see I think he never was as bad as you were to Stephanie... 😒😒 in fact I can't simply not understand the incoherence of their conversation... He literally told her: "my feelings for you, I never lied about that you were always what I wanted and more" "It wasn't about your gender, I don't like only girls" (Then he introduces her his brand new boyfriend 🤪) You were madly in love with her, she was what you wanted and more... THEN WHY THE FUCK DID YOU DUMP HER?? THERE'S NO ACCEPTABLE EXPLANATION OF THAT!!! They just said he was on a journey to discover himself phase or some shit bad executioned idea but dude even if discovering you are Bi was part of it that doesn't mean you had to end your relationship... 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️, he later tells to Connor Hawke who is also struggling because he doesn't know how to tell Green Arrow that he is not interested in banging anyone ever (he came out as asexual) that Stephanie was a reminder of his old self that he wanted to let go, suuuuure nice try to make up for a good excuse to be an asshole with her🙄😒.

You know what's funny? I think Steph is bisexual too and I'm not saying this because of her relationship with Cassandra, I'm saying this because when she was talking with Harper Row about Catwoman she was thirsting over Selina's buttonless shirt and later when she was dating Tim she met Zatanna and the first thing she said was "wow you're hot" 😂😂😂 and THAT, simply as it is... Is literally the only proof I need of her being bi, I didn't need her to break up with her boyfriend to be with Cass or Harper (hey, they kissed in that failed show Gotham knights) to believe it, you just need to show interest in both genders 🤷‍♀️, use flirt, use blushing, use a comment mentioning it... You don't need to destroy a relationship!! 🙄🙄🙄 but what is done is done, I'm so tired of Timsteph, I give up I'm sorry fellow shippers I really I'm but this treatment to Stephanie's character is my limit. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH 🥲🥲

And I apologize for this long long long rant but I needed it to get out of my system 🥲🥲 well, like I said Tim wants to stay with his walking Bisexuality proof NPC boyfriend PERFECT, but I need a compensation and I don't want Steph to have nothing to do with that Kyle Mizoguchi, he is as irrelevant and boring to me as Bernard and Jay Nakamura 🥱🥱🥱 I want a proper compensation so I want Steph and Jason Todd to have a slow cooked Romance. Yep you heard me, I demand JAYSTEPH as a compensation for all this mess!!

And of course I plan to make a thoroughly long post like this about why I want Jaysteph to have a chance and with nothing more to say, Bye bye and thanks for reading my post 😘😘😘

[redlittlebird]

So maybe I just feel like ranting. Tim Drake has been my favorite character for as long as I can remember, he’s the character that I’ve found myself relating to the most my entire life. That includes my bisexuality, when I was coming to terms with my own sexuality I saw myself more and more reading this character I loved as bisexual. It was something I identified with and thought it fit him. So when I saw the DC was making him bi, I got excited. Confirmation! Hurray!

At least that’s what it was like in the beginning, now I just tend to get frustrated. I want it put on record that I don’t hate Timber, I don’t hate Bernard. I hate that I feel like Tim got put with Bernard to check a box. Increasingly I feel like Tim’s relationship with Stephanie Brown was cut short because DC just want to make him date a boy to prove he was bi, and honestly? That’s just such a crushing feeling. When I’ve dated guys, that has not made me any less bisexual. When I’ve dated women THAT HAS NOT MADE ME ANY LESS BISEXUAL. It’s just a trend I feel like I’ve seen over and over again, if a character is bi, they have to be in a same sex pairing to prove it, and it just feels so unbelievably reductive to the bisexual experience. It’s treated so often like if you’re bisexual and dating someone of the opposite sex you’re not being true to yourself, or they’re not what you really want, and that is just so biphobic on so many levels it makes me want to puke. You can say what you want about the rocky road Tim and Steph’s relationship has been across their decades long history, but when they were broken up off screen it was a gut punch. It was such a blow because nothing in their recent writing indicated they were going to breakup, let alone so suddenly. For the answer to why to be shown over and over again by DC as “Tim just couldn’t be himself with her” is just such a shallow take, and terrible reason for me. Maybe it’s just me but I’ve found Bernard while cute and loving to Tim, to be a largely empty character with little substance. This lends to me feeling like Tim was put with him just to prove a point, so DC could say “See? He swings both ways!” doing so at the cost of a relationship that had been written for years at that point to be very loving and supportive.

I love this character, I loved Tim with Steph, I just wish that DC could have had Tim come out without falling back on so many harmful stereotypes with bisexual people, including the most harmful, that we will just drop our partners because they aren’t fulfilling us as bisexuals, that we’re shallow and confused, and can’t be our true selves unless we prove that we’re bi. I’m happy for representation, especially from my favorite character, but damnit I just wish it was treated with more tact and respect for what actually being bisexual is like. It’s not something we need to prove, it’s who we are, and that doesn’t mean we have to be with someone of the same sex and just happen to like the opposite sex as well. It’s not incidental. We don’t hurt the people that love us just to explore, and it’s damaging to frame it that way.

[dairy-farmer]

>:Dc

You know~ I was a pondering~ the FASCINATING plot potential of Pink Kryptonite on an ALREADY Hella Bi Kon? When I realized! Why not make it SPICIER~♡?

Because I DO so enjoy? That "thrill and danger of sleeping with a living God. A man who's very body is so strong it not only can crush you, but they have to ACTIVELY try NOT too. Who you touch and it feels like touching living marble." Vibe~! On TOP of Alien Sex and good ol Wholesome Kent Boys!

Because yes PLURAL!

What IF? Suspect research facility? What they up too *suspicious squint*? Why your building lead lined? Gasp! Kryptonite research! Luthor! Fuck, not AGAIN! They are trying to make artificial Kryptonite, because (for obvious reasons) the Justice League keeps finding and DESTROYING any natural supplies.

Infiltration Time.

Superboy(Jon) is NOT allowed to come. But Kon can. In fact, he insists. And? It would be good bonding? Clark is trying to be better. Is still awkward around him. But there is improvement!

Kon, of course, brings Tim. For hacking and mostly emotional support. Also Kryptonite containment if they find any. Batman is somewhere in Prague. Let's go team!

Honestly? It was a terrible fucking idea. Clark should have asked someone NOT deathly allergic to this specific rock to do it. Tim carrys the mission HARD. They destroy stones. Destroy chemical supplies. Research gets copied and obliterated. They barely manage to avoid a few "evil superman" scenarios. Stressful all around.

0 out of 10 stars in Tim's book.

But there is one building left. Well separated from the others due to a heavily redacted "incident" Tim doesn't have the time to decrypt. One left right? And at least they KNOW it's not Red in there. Let's go.

And, see, neither Kon nor Tim have ever SEEN Pink Kryptonite before. Only Clark has. The NATURAL crystals? Made him a rather flaming Queen for a while. He hit on Jimmy. And? The solid, dull, magenta BLOCK of rock in the lab they find? Deeply artificial. Clearly meant to try and REPLICATE Pink Kryptonite.

Hits Clark like a magically backed punch to the lower gut. He can see Kon stumble out of the corner of his eye. Everything feels... warm and pleasant against his skin. Tingly. Oh... oh no.

Kon's hair suddenly looks so nice. Soft and fluffy. Clark's eyes are being dragged over his figure almost against his will. No.. NO! That is his... his SON. Cousin? Clone! Blood! S-stop that! He wrenches his gaze away and... oh.

Oh, Tim grew up WELL, didn't he?

He's leaning over to examine the block. Unaware of two sets of eyes locked like hunters onto him. Effects like Pollen, that he can not feel. It.. IS weird that Kon has stopped chatting though. He was making fun of the lab, wasn't he? Hey, Superboy, what's uuu-? Uuuuh you guys... good?

Tim contains the rock. Quickly. No dice. Apparently the exposure was enough. Will need to wear off. He inches around the two fixated Kryptonians to a computer console. What the HELL is going on? He finds out. Compares it to Bat computer notes. Mixed compound? Likely lack of impulse control...

Well... Shit.

Okay. Okay, don't panic. Just call Lois for Clar-! Tim is airborne. Heeeeey, Supes! Wanna put me down? Gonna just call your wife real qui-. Nah. Clark wants you. He hugs Tim like a teddy bear from behind, carefully of course. Steel bands would be easier too escape. Clark rubs his cheek against Tim's hair and neck. Soft~

Kon? Well HE always really, REALLY wanted to eat Rob out. The guy's super squirrelly. He legit thinks a few dozen orgasms might fix like... SO much about his life. Or at least would help with the constant STRESS. And he LOVES the guy. Plus Kon is GREAT with his tounge! He's been practicing. Getting tips.

And for some reason? He can't think of a reason NOT too right now.

So now Tim is in the air, feet not touching the ground, trapped between two drugged out Kryptonians, and getting his PANTS undone. Kon? Kon, buddy!? Next thing he knows, his legs are being held in place by immovable hands, tossed over his friends shoulders, and Kon is dipping forward.

Hot and wet plunders as it pleases, making him jolt and squirm. But he can't escape. Can't get any leverage. Even if he could, he's being held by SUPERMAN, what good would it do?

Kon's tounge is less relenting then a human's. It's almost like being teased by the wet drag of a toy. Clark is kissing his neck. Holding him easily with one arm, now. The other working open his uniform. His powerful hand sliding in to run lightly, so very lightly, across Tim's chest.

And from what feels like an iron bar digging into his back? Clark has completely forgotten the "no threesomes unless I get to be apart of it and/or watch" rule that Tim is technically not supposed to know about. Lois is going to murder him.

He'd care more, if there weren't fingers carefully working there way into him. Distracting him and starting to melt his brain. Kon CHEATING, using his stupid TTK to run hands that aren't there over skin and press kisses everywhere. And when Kon fumbles open his costume, desperate, hands hovering but not touching. Trying not to GRAB because he's so, so turned on and doesn't even trust himself right now?

Clark just rumbles "I got you" from behind Tim like this isn't surreal. Like he's not about too-. And Clark just crowds closer and slides Tim ONTO Kon like he's some sort of shared toy. Because, Tim is vaguely and hysterically aware off, if KON slide home? He might accidentally break Tim's pelvis! Or worse!

And Kon is gripping Clark's arms hard enough to bruise. Hissing through his teeth as he makes himself stay still. Because Tim feels so, so damn good. Clark is rocking him, steady and perfect as you please, a waterfall of murmured praises falling from him.

Then, when Kon's shuddering apart? His grip relaxing and control returning? He helps Clark. Pulls Tim into HIS arms. Lifts him up and slides him down on to the wet dream of most of the planet. They take turns. It's hours before Tim touches the floor again and by that point they've flown back to the Nest.

Tim seemed tired, after all.

Tim manages to distract them with Needy Demands from their almost medically exhausted fucked out Robin. Manages to army crawl across the bed to a silent alarm. Nightwing, bring the GREEN Kryptonite and red sun lamps or so help me, you'll be down a brother.

*near immediate sound of nearby window crashing open*

FOR FUCK SAKE, I HAVE A DOOR!

Just? The spirit is willing but the flesh is squishy Human, guys. There are two of you. You are both LITERALLY super human! It's in your ACTUAL CAPE NAMES. P-put down the Tim... w-we can talk about this! *ravished like a romance novel Protagonist* oh nooooo~♡ lol

Kon feels moderately bad about it. On one hand? Mmmmmm~♡ Tim sex. Nice. But on the OTHER? Big Oof. Leaving your bed partner one big bruise from Too Much Sexing is BAD. Deeply conflicted.

Would delicious take out from that place you like in Italy and all the oral you desire help? *interested Tim noises*

Clark? Hunted for sport. Lois? Terrifying but moderately understanding. It WAS Kryptonite. But BATMAN? You fucked his baby boy, Clark. Didn't even take him out dancing first. You, a married man, old enough to be his father, FUCKED HIS BABY BOY. *smashs bottle and menaces with the jagged edge* Run.

-🐼🐼🐼

bruce would NOT let clark know peace 😭😭😭

[laylawatermelon]

70.6 - 7.07 Speculation/ Buddie Meta

I am a writer y'know hehe

So, Buddie is happening.

Now let me explain.

Bi buck always existed, but the problem is that most of his consistent emotional relationship one could argue realistically romantically has been with a man he's known for years.

But has always been bi yes, but he's also been in love with his best friend for a really long time.

Friends to lovers where Y'all at? I see y'all madney truthers

Anyways I understand but what has kind of been bothering me is the fact that Buddie the ship has been abandoned/negated as not an important past of the puzzle for bi buck realization despite the fact that Eddie is physically present throughout his entire relationship/storyline.

I could argue that because they're mirrors to each other (corny soulmate type shit is perfect for network tv) this is the best way to ease people into it.

Buck and Eddie are the two beloved firefighters (and respective sex symbols). They have an appeal for the straight audience for that reason.

Lou already spoiled it but he's only here for a while.

There's been almost blatant explanations and dialogue that leads to the fact that this relationship is going to directly lead into buddie one way or another.

Tommy has from the beginning suspected that Buck (I'm calling him Evan in my head in regards to him and it's so weird 😖) and Eddie have an unusual relationship or that Buck is in love with Eddie at least.

(MY attention? is the biggest example.)

My prediction is that their mirrors of each other, the parallels, and red flags pop up too often now.

I know they're still writing the show and are likely watching audience engagement and ao3 (I'm watching you Tim ik you're here I'm new but ik you got shooters out here) for where to go with the story.

In Eddie's (frankly oddly portrayed) plotline is related to his Catholic guilt and his nonexistent relationship with Marisol (no last name?). As the episode maybe suggests they don't know their partners well enough.

Shame to Eddie because it's been months in universe like come on man. In Buck's it's literally been a few weeks, and most of the time Tommy spent with Eddie and not with him.

I like them as a couple and find them affordable. I can't quite bring myself to ship them or be as enthusiastic as others and that's okay.

I still admire the relationship they have and won't bash others for enjoying it.

Hell they still have Taylor and Buck enjoyers and maybe even Abby (i assume I haven't met any honestly).

The reason why I'm a bit confused on why Buddie isn't being all that embraced as a vital part of the storyline is because in a way it is.

I think it spurred the writers on to lean into it heavily due to the actors chemistry and portrayal of the relationship.

Now I'm not saying he wouldn't be bi regardless, because he's always been written that way.

His interactions with worm guy, a gay married couple, Carlos (who I've been waiting to say this but I can't hold myself any longer is Latino, shorter than him, brown eyes, dark hair - Eddie lite/he had a bit of a type aka cute guys.)

I clocked him flirting with him with his cute fact spilling as a way of affection because I do it to to people I love. (🤗i love my ADHD rep!) When he saw him look at the girl he became more platonic in his interactions. Then there was Eddie.

And Eddie honestly is the biggest part of the puzzle.

Yes he likes Tommy, and I don't deny he likes strong confident (suspiciously Eddie shaped 😂) guys.

He has always been attracted to strong personalities regardless of gender.

I do think he did pursue him and I think because Tommy is gay he recognized the flirting Buck does with both men and women as that, flirting.

Eddie doesn't count cause he has a whole can of worms he gotta figure out himself.

If Buck had consistent scenes with an out queer man on the show he'd have been at least clocked. (Eddie was kind of in the way with Josh and the Dispatch crew/his gaydar pinged a lil around him)

I've been saying that now that he's canonically bisexual and it's a known fact, you can't deny he's quite literally been flirting with his best friend the entire show (as a coparent??? Idk man they both said they skip steps/impatient 🤷🏾‍♀️).

When new fans watch it it's obvious, when older fans recall it it's either enlightening or redefining that relationship regardless.

The red flags that are coming up is Eddie's statement of moving too fast and Buck literally moving to fast with his second date (i assume idk how in world time works it's a tv show 🤷🏾‍♀️) being his sister's wedding.

Realistically I know you only invite people to events like that if you're fully committed to each other for a long term thing.

I'm not saying that he's on his wheel but in a way I'm tilting my head at some similarities of Tommy and his past relationships and Buck's tendencies.

Buck will be Buck.

Tommy knows him as Evan, and calls him such.

Which didn't get me wrong cute or whatever but rubs me there wrong away, because we know he prefers Buck as it's his chosen name for a reason. It's defined him and been contextualized and even accepted by his parents.

I believe in calling people the name they choose to be called and I just don't like when that's ignored.

It also doesn't help that he continues to call him that in an episode called You don't know me (you can Even tie it in to Marisol No last name) that deals with identities and lack of knowledge.

Buck has spent most of his remaining twenties with that identity and has defended it so the casualness of him calling him that unnerves me.

It's meant to close the distance and be portrayed as romantic but it can also be interpreted as him seeing Evan, not Buck when with him.

But I did see a post that changed my perspective on calling a name with love instead can recontextualize the meaning of it and I found that sweet and fitting. In that case I can swing either way about it.

If it does make him more accepting of that side of his identity that's great that he's beginning to heal from a path when his name/personhood was used as a weapon or item.

But, I also still feel a bit iffy that it's not interchangeably used with Buck because his family and everyone he knows calls him that. Even his previous romantic partners did and I didn't mind him being called it but I would like it if both names would be used as that is the new part of him where Evan exists as well.

Also narratively they spent too much time on defining his name and what it means to him and everyone around him to not show the importance of his identity being acknowledged in a new unfamiliar relationship.

(whew i think I'm just mad at the writers or this may just be on purpose who knows 🤷🏾‍♀️)

I'm getting to the meta I promise I'm just finally processing what's been plaguing me about this relationship and i gotta let the monster out

That would also explain why he doesn't know the ADHD rants that Buck blabs on about.

But then again the episode is called you don't know me and they weren't even friends he just jumped into a relationship.

(ps you can just start dating someone and learn as you go I'm just saying 🤷🏾‍♀️)

The biggest problem with their relationship is that he's in love with his best friend.

He literally only began to open up and flirt when he realized that he wasn't a romantic threat to his family.

(Which trifling Buck! Your man can't get wined and dined?? He deserves love too!/j)

He literally relaxed/his shoulders open up when Tommy assures him that his son still loves and idolizes him and that Eddie still likes him and he's irreplaceable in his life.

After that's secured he begins to make his move and become more flirtatious (cough sexually open cough) to this confident man in his kitchen in the dim lights and glowy atmosphere.

Damn I'd kiss him too 🤷🏾‍♀️ (if I was a guy ofc)

I also didn't like the parallels of Buck being left (which has happened with his female love interests) and then Buck still having to reach out.

I don't think Tommy is bad for Buck, but I'm still not convinced that he's 100% good. But then again he's been here literally a two episodes and barely any screentime.

And the one he does makes it seem like he's interested but not too invested.

(which makes sense and I will elaborate a bit later in the meta speculation)

The Tommy that everyone is talking about exists solely in fan spaces and head canon and that's why I think I can't get into it. The facts of him are plain in the show but in the fan spaces he has a different image.

Which valid, once again he's almost a blank sheet of what we wish a Buck gets and deserves in a love interest but that's what he is as of now. A blank-ish sheet. Kind of like a projection sheet for movies.

Tommy seems like a caring partner and sure of himself. He's shown himself to be funny, considerate, and as unhinged as the rest of the 118 (ah the fruity fire badasses).

Also i wanna point your Buck likes em a lil older sometimes haha

But back on topic, I can see Tommy being like Natalia (which makes sense as that storyline could've been used) In the fact that he sees that the space in his life is occupied and respectfully backs out.

My meta for 7.06 is this.

Tommy helps out somehow. Buck is ecstatic rightfully so.

They kiss dance and are cute.

The family is very welcoming, the 118 is still loving, but then he sees something that affirms his suspicions.

It's a normal scene for us.

Either Buck is taking care of Chris and then talks to Eddie.

He sees the look in Buck's eyes and the fondness there. He looks at Eddie and sees the same on his face.

He notices how they work together and laugh, them at the family and life he's built all around him, and decides he can't be apart of this. There's no space for him.

It feels too real too fast and he'll only end to heartbroken because he's just interested, not invested yet.

So he gracefully bows out and let's him know that he has enough love in his life if he'd just look for it.

(i also found out he used the word interested in the cafe scene where i recognized it as the ana date. Also Buck was wearing a white patterned shirt and i had a heart attack because it wasn't great the last time he wore it 😬)

Then it leads into ghost of a second chance.

(now imma say this i will be posting more specs about the these episodes I'm just on my buddie storyline juice rn)

This is now Buck trying to salvage/figure out what went wrong and maybe try to contact him again.

In the case of Marisol it's safe to assume they break up, the reason why isn't clear.

It could be related to his sisters disapproval of their relationship (as they're supposed to be coming out did the show forget??) or apprehension towards her as they've been raised/watched him grow up.

They know what makes him happy.

For ghost a second chance I didn't have much buddie assumptions but I'm pretty sure that one is more in relation to other members of the cast most likely and maybe Buck trying to salvage his relationship.

7.08-10 isn't complete so who knows🤷🏾‍♀️ how they must switch it up for more drama?

But I will say, we gotta dive into the Eddie of it all.

Y'all thought I forgot about him?

The bi Buck storyline isn't complete without Eddie either romantically or platonically.

In real life their queer storylines were always interchangeable and they're both feeling out the GA and fans reaction.

Buddie not going canon doesn't make sense because realistically it's one of the biggest ships and the most talked about things for the online fans.

It's a good reason many fans started (me included🙋🏾‍♀️) and stay (if the beautiful found family didn't hit it for them).

The way that they were both discussed and Ryan is fine with Buddie still kind of matches his character honestly. Demi Eddie is a head canon and honestly Eddie would only be comfortable with dating a man at this stage of his life if it's someone he loves already aka Buck.

There could be other reasons but as a Buddie warrior truther (as they named it which is still so insane) as his old interviews alluded to the fact that he loves Buck so much he can't really see himself with another guy he just met like that.

He also maybe wanted a easier storyline as he had always been a bit of a heavy character.

For women it's easier as he's raised to do it and it's "natural" or right for him to do so.

His parents said it, the church says it, God says it so it must be right.

He loves commitment, has said he's a nester and constantly yearns for a family unit.

The only family unit he knows of it feels is acceptable due to his upbringing is man, woman, child.

Not that he's homophobic cause duh, HenRen is literally there, but his standards and pressure doesn't even let him fathom it for himself.

It's also likely if the demi part is true, he's highly unlikely to be like Buck and view others sexually and even realize he's able to have a family/relationship with a man.

I suspect no Buddie this season. I actually hope and pray for it.

Because from both a business and story point it's best to keep the will-they won't-they into season 8 to keep viewers engaged/tuning in and not to rush the story and get some really good emotional moments.

I won't lie I miss the angst we got in the other seasons and as a result the show's identity with Eddie has faltered a bit.

I didn't love episode 5 but I didn't hate it. I still enjoy the show and if they feel a bit unusual it's okay.

There were still some great moments in it.

Eddie's character is now happy but as a result he's also somewhat unfamiliar (that speaks to the whump heavy storylines he has) as he seems less mature. You can argue now that he has a stable support system he's able to let loose because he knows his needs will be covered.

That's also a great point and easy way of showing his development.

His Catholic guilt now that it's been introduced will have to be deconstructed as he will have to redefine his life, what he's looking for/allow himself to be and dare to dream of a life not given to him by someone else or pressure.

This season he's only just started to accept things that make him feel good (which for now is Marisol) and be open and honest about it.

I can argue it is a great sign of improvement of his character.

A bit ooc portrayal yes, but the message of looking deeper still applies.

This can apply to Buddie probably leading through the next half of season 7 by being ramped up and then going full speed ahead season 8.

At the time though since they're still writing they may take a hard right turn and keep it platonic (😭).

But what would be inevitable is Eddie's coming out/self discovery arc that isn't tied to the church or sense of duty.

Which yay! More self discovery I love the message of finding yourself lasts throughout your life and due to life's unexpected events you can change to be a better version of yourself all the time.

We got bi buck (which evidently was influenced by Eddie in some way) now let's free Eddie to even if they didn't do it for Buddie (once again😭😭😭).

Now that I've got it mostly off my chest I'm definitely gonna do an analysis of the parallels and the way it's played pt.2 (and more as seasons passed cause Ryan and Oliver 😘 muah 10/10 no notes).

Okay bye.

[cuephrase]

What are some things introduced new52 to current day that you like and think are an overall net positive for batfam continuity? (As in, it's not uncommon for me to see fan things that mainly focus on post crisis/pre flashpoint stuff but still incorporate new comic aspects, such as slightly changed family dynamics/new developments, and it's interesting for me to find out what different people think is and isn't worth keeping from what got added after the reboot)

ooooh this is a fun question!!

i was going to say i haven't read that many n52 and onwards runs, and then i realized i have actually read most of the ones i want to, i just haven't read any batman/'tec/batgirl/or duke's runs yet. (i read like...half of We Are Robin, Joker War, and i've read batman from where zdarsky come in so like have also read Gotham War.) (might read Catwoman?? not the point.)

since we're sticking strictly to net positives, i'll include something that i like, even if i have criticisms of it, but i won't get into those criticisms so we can stay positive!! (future cue, so this is kind of a lie but i swear i didn't go overboard.) i'm going to include stuff as minor as like costumes bc why not. also nothing is going to be in order of like what i like the most to what i like the least, just fyi. also, probs not definitive, knowing me i will forget something lmao

New52 Era-

tim's red robin costume. that suit is *chef's kiss* imo. i love that he has wings. i...i don't know if i necessarily want it back rn bc i am sososososo in love with his current robin costume, but i do adore the n52 red robin suit

i personally like that they went ahead and made jason less villain, more anti-hero. i think him trying to reintegrate with the batfam creates some very compelling crises

dick as Agent 37!! which...okay, no criticisms nvm. michael janin's art tho >>> okay well actually maybe sometimes i wish this was like elseworlds/black label instead of mainline but

might be a bit of a reach, but i really enjoy the first handful of arcs in n52 b&r and the relationship dynamic they established for bruce and dami

i like that tim and jason are somewhat friendly. i think it makes sense. for a lot of reasons. this is a somewhat controversial opinion, which i understand. but this is where i stand

did i like anything else from this era specifically?????????

OH

DUKE!!!!!!! i loooooove him very happy he was added

Rebirth Era-

the outlaws, specifically jason's relationship with bizarro. (i enjoyed artemis a lot too!! tbh, haven't read these guys outside of this run tho so zero clue how accurate these portrayals are, so grain of salt?)

the return of dick's fingerstripes!!!!!!! best part of tom taylor's run /hj

TIM'S ROBIN COSTUME AHHHHHH. i'm sorry i love that suit way too much

love damian's current robin costume, although...does he have combat boots rn still? can't remember. if he doesn't, they should give those back

damian + jon's relationship, ik it gets obliterated by the stupid age up, but super sons is still very special to me

tim being bi!! now do kon dc you cowards

alfred's death. i refuse to elaborate. i could, but i shan't (this is not alfred hate tho i swear)

i'm forgetting something rn i know it

oh yeah, i do like tim being robin again. IK. IKKKK. no, i don't think he should be robin forever. no, i don't think dami is a bad robin/shouldn't be robin.

um...i liked dick getting shot in the head. the ric era is not how i would've wanted the aftermath but

i don't want to comment on anything super recent, but i do think there's stuff going on rn that could end up being net positives

the titans being reassembled. jury's out on their location but, i do like that they're back

i'm not counting yj because they're not doing anything with them rn, but they should ugh

i think...i think that's it? there could honestly be a lot more that i'm forgetting. i hope this was interesting!! if there's anything i didn't mention that you're curious about, or something i did mention that you'd like a more in-depth answer about, please feel free to ask!! i'm curious what you consider net positives anon, you should shareeee

[lover-of-mine]

okay so I had a really terrible thought and I’ve been following you for a while and I wanted to hear your thoughts (maybe i’m just in a place of doubt rn) BUT

since they’re basically writing the episodes as they go, and are seeing fans reactions (and possibly taking them into consideration as they write), do you think if they see such a positive reaction to buck/tommy, they’ll make him more long term (and possibly endgame)…? again, I could be overthinking it but I’ve been seeing a tON of buck tommy stuff and idk if they’re going to consider that when they write the upcoming episodes for the rest of the season…like buck/tommy is cute ig don’t get me wrong bc we see bisexual buck and him enjoy his first male relationship and like i’m so proud, but…i’m an eddie-girl and buddie has always been my endgame

Okay, hi, ngl, I had this exact thought too when Tim kept insisting there's no plan. But the thing is, I don't believe him. I believe he doesn't have the full plot locked and loaded, but I doubt he doesn't have any idea where the story is gonna take him. Personally, I doubt that a few weeks of excitement over Buck being bi will be louder than 5 years of people BEGGING for buddie to happen. Buck and Eddie have a compelling relationship that's been cultivated for YEARS. And, look, far from me to make Buck's bisexuality about Eddie, but making a character who's HEAVILY shipped with another man for years queer in season 7 while having no plan on following through with the love story they've been building for 6 seasons would be dumb. Buck with a new guy and Eddie doubling down on being straight and ending up with some random woman is the worst case scenario here. This fandom is weird in the way that most of it is mono shipping. It's Buck and Eddie together or nothing. So they would piss off the homophobes, who are already pissed, and a solid amount of the people who have been following buddie for years and that's bad for business. They have the power to have a ridiculously compelling queer love story that's built on a foundation that's been there for 6 seasons. Buck and Eddie getting together could be EPIC. And they made the move to make Buck queer. They didn't have to. I love that Buck is getting a queer storyline, but if we are going there with Buck, what's actually stopping them from going there with Eddie? I don't see how you can have one of them being queer and not go there just because people are excited that Buck is bi. Tim can't say it's gonna go there. That would be a spoiler. A huge spoiler. But narratively speaking, or from a business perspective, Buck being bi has to mean buddie getting together. Because that's what people have been wanting from them. And honestly, if they wanted to play Tommy as having any chance of being Buck's endgame, he wouldn't have so many parallels with Taylor. The TK of it all, the helicopter of it all, the kiss that happens because Eddie is injured, Buck is even wearing a shirt that looks like the one he's wearing when Taylor comes back, like, seriously, what the fuck? And that's not going into the symbolism they have to know is there on the way the loft itself is a symbol of romantic doom, because Buck got it in a relationship that instantly Ended and the 2 times he started something there it went up in flames, so like 🤨🤔 I'm curious to see where it's going, but, personally, don't see them actually lasting the rest of the show. At least that's what I'm telling myself to calm down when I panic and trip into the bad place lol

[tarucore]

DC has once again accidentally given Dick Grayson an interesting character trait by being repressed bigots and I can’t stop thinking about it

Specifically this time I’m thinking about how they keep queerbaiting Dick but it actually makes sense with his character if you think about it for two seconds

Because No, I Don’t Think That He Would be open about his sexuality with others, if he has come to terms with it at all

While I’d love to talk about the history of queerness in comics, I don’t have the energy for it right now. What I will say however is that modern day Dick Grayson is written as a very millennial character, in both fan-spaces and modern comics despite whatever age the retcons have set

I think people forget how far queer acceptance has come in recent history, twenty years ago, even ten years ago, we were not at the place we are now, it’s honestly insane how quickly things changed from 2015 to now

Like, No He Wouldn’t be ‘out and proud’ in the Gen Z sense, most older gay people that I know are private about their gender and sexuality, either because of bullying when they were younger, abuse, or the media never picturing queer people as anything other than villains or jokes

He’s had constant media pressure on him from an early age, in both aspects of his identity, his ethnicity already makes him stray from the ideal cishet WASP that a private school and Bruce’s social circles would want him to be, even as he got older his love life was in the public eye when he dated Kori as Dick Grayson

And that’s not even getting into how his relationship with his sexuality would be affected by his history of sexual abuse

Him appearing on pride covers/events or openly supporting queer people in the text is different from him turning to the audience and saying “Hey, I’m bisexual,” or “Did you know that I’ve always been demisexual and biromantic?” or even a “I like guys too,” and frankly it would be out of character for him to say so

For some people, being out to close family and friends is wildly different from ‘coming out,’ especially for a public figure like Dick Grayson or Nightwing is in his world. And I feel like that could make an interesting dynamic with a member of his family like Tim, who is out publicly as Tim Drake-Wayne. Tim who is written as a part of Gen Z in his early twenties or something rn (even though 90’s kid Tim will always have my heart)

And this is a personal anecdote but I’m thinking about how my little sister and I were standing in the checkout line one day and she starts talking about how gay an outfit that I tried on looked, and how quickly I changed the subject. She about nine years younger than me but old enough to know that we live in a conservative area. It was a bit panic inducing, and it’s so interesting to think about how even though I’m on the older side of Gen Z, I was still raised in a culture that said we don’t talk about these things especially not in public. Like I was still called a dyke in middle school but when I hit junior year all of a sudden it was trendy (if a bit fetishized) to be bi. She, thankfully, never really has to deal with that

So whenever he’s on a pride variant cover and people are complaining about a lack of formal representation, all I can do is seethe bc yes it’s completely in character for him but obviously detective comics comics isn’t doing it on purpose

[baddygab-bi]

Honestly, even setting aside the whole Buddie of it all, it all sounded like such an out of the blue, poorly conceived idea. So she might have been a nun and he’s got a problem with that? Is it because he hasn’t bothered to get to know her and now he’s shocked she didn’t tell him something and he doesn’t actually know her? Or because they in theory can’t fuck? Because both of those are questionable at best.

I agree with you about how the show just made Buck bi, so they are likely to double down on Eddie being “straight,” and in theory they have kept her around for SOME REASON because she’s had what five seconds of screen time and a couple mentions that she babysat Chris. And yet she’s still “there.” They actually did more to develop a relationship between Eddie and Tommy in one episode than they’ve done to develop the disaster with Marisol the whole time she’s been around. So who knows. It’s really late in the game to try and develop this now. They had chances and didn’t take it. So how would you ever get the audience on board? Tim already stated he doesn’t like relationships where the love interest can’t be involved in the story other than being a love interest. Idk it all seems like a waste of time to me lol

As far as the Buck coming out to Eddie scene, imo calling him brother (and hugging him and telling him he loves him brother - also in the supposed script) really seems like it could be Eddie reacting in a “I have to make this okay and reassure him of our unending connection” and that’s the only language he has for what they are atm.

But who knows if any of it is actually real. They change things all the time anyway.

I just think they could do a couple having intimacy issues without it being based on something super religiousy, you know? Like fine if it is, but also, it would show her more as a human if she was like “Yeah, you know, I’m just scared of being that vulnerable with someone.” Boom, we’d have character for her, which as of right now, we have none of.

I don’t think they know how to develop her character, and with that, the fine details of the relationship, with the lack of time that she has. We know she spends a lot of time with Chris, and that she and Eddie are close enough for her to be around all the time for stuff, but that’s about it. If they had built her like a real character I think I’d give more of a shit about her.

Dude, I swear when I wrote my brother examples I wrote “I love you, brother” first but then erased it because I thought it was too on the nose. Glad to know the writers and I are writing the exact same show when it comes to dialogue. I think that as of right now, the show is making Eddie straight just to make him straight. But I think in season 8, if they want to (pleaseeee) they could easily walk back Eddie calling him brother. It just feels very pointed that Buck is now bi and Eddie calls him brother when they haven’t ever called each other that (since early season 2) before. Almost like the show saying “look, Buck can like guys, can kiss guys, just not this one.”

Season 7 is fully written. But season 8 hasn’t even been started yet. We can only hope that they don’t do anything irreversible to Buddie this season.

[pluckyredhead]

Shipping ask: Tim/Bernard?

Hoo boy. Don't ship it, alas.

Why don't you ship it?

Listen. I WOULD LOVE TO. I am thrilled that Tim has finally been allowed to come out after being really really queer for...oh, 33 years? But DC has just completely dropped the ball. @irolltwenties said a lot of what I'm feeling here, but I'm opinionated so I'm gonna say it myself, too.

The short version: DC refuses to let Bernard have a personality or let Tim have any relationship with him beyond the most superficial, empty window dressing possible.

The long version: I remember Bernard, y'all. I'm an old lady who was actually reading his original appearances when they came out! He was a weird, annoying kid who thought that being aggressively "quirky" made him cool when it actually just made him obnoxious...which allowed him to circle back around to being endearing. He liked to hear himself talk. He enjoyed being a tour guide, gossiping, and conspiracy theories - he's the guy who likes to know things, or at least seem like he does. Whether you liked him or not (I liked him), he was specific.

Now? The only thing recent comics will tell you about Bernard is that he's blond. Tim might as well be dating a cardboard cutout, or a post-it that says "Boyfriend" on it. Is he gay or bi, or does he prefer a different label, or none at all? Did he always have a crush on Tim, or is this new? Was his vocal interest in Darla and Tim's stepmother Dana just performative, or was he actually into them? What does he do when he's not smiling blandly under a narration box full of exposition? Does he have hobbies? Does he have a personality?

I do have to disagree with my beloved @irolltwenties on one thing: I don't think Tim is getting all the development in this relationship. I don't think Tim's gotten any, either. He told Bernard that he wanted to date him in August of 2021, but have we progressed in any significant way with his character since then? He spent three issues of Urban Legends agonizing over his sexuality in a way that was so repressed he wouldn't even admit that was what he was doing, but how does he feel about it now? He hasn't said in a comic whether he's gay or bi or pan or even queer - and look, I'm not saying he needs to know what label he prefers, or whether he needs to use one at all. But that should be a character choice too! We don't know if he has an identity he's comfortable with, or isn't sure yet, or is rejecting all of them, or is refusing to think about it. We literally don't know anything about Tim's sexuality except that it includes Bernard, including how Tim feels about it.

We also haven't gotten to see him come out to a single person. Again, I don't want to reduce queer narratives to cliches, but like...it's very weird that it's happened off-panel repeatedly? With Bruce, with Steph, with Young Justice. I'm assuming the rest of his family knows, based on...exposition about Damian that doesn't even make sense. We don't get to see this fucking conversation with Dick? Are you KIDDING me? Some of us have been waiting literal decades for Tim to come out and we get absolutely zero of the emotional catharsis of that? It feels like we're being cheated, honestly it does.

And speaking of being cheated...we never did get to see that Tim and Bernard date. Or a conversation about their history, or liking boys, or literally anything ever. When was their first kiss? I WOULD HAVE LIKED TO SEE THE FIRST TIME TIM KISSED A BOY. I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE WOULD HAVE LIKED THAT. We don't even know how long they've been dating - Tim's current mini said it's been "months" and "a month" in the same issue. Go, DC, give us nothing!

I don't know why Tim's sexuality and his relationship with Bernard are being handled like this. Is it because they're afraid that if they allow it to be three dimensional it won't be sealed in its "unproblematic queer rep" mylar bag and board anymore? Is it because they're trying to get credit for Bi Tim while leaving it as vague as possible to not offend homophobes? Is it because they're just doing a crappy job? It's so strange to me because that first Urban Legends story was so good, and I really was rooting for Meghan Fitzmartin because it is so, so hard to be a woman in comics. But so far, it's just been a disappointment.

2. What would have made you like it?

If we had actually gotten weird, annoying OG Bernard, I feel like that would have been very entertaining - Tim is such a reserved character that I always enjoy seeing him play off against someone chaotic (Steph, Kon and Bart, even Jason to an extent). Also just like...seeing the actual relationship on the page??? I'm begging here, DC.

3. Despite not shipping it, do you have anything positive to say about it?

I am strongly in favor of the concept! Tim dating a boy is long overdue. I just need DC to give me specific characters in a specific relationship, ON THE PAGE.

[buddiebeginz]

WHY DID THEY SHOW EDDIE WATCHING BUCK REPEL DOWN THE CLIFF?! Choices and so early on too 😩

I'm assuming you're talking about this gifset I reblogged. Honestly I think that Eddie was supposed to be queer from the beginning. I know people think Buck was but I'm not sure if that was necessarily the writers intention. It might have been Oliver's intention to play him that way, I can't remember what he said word for word but I think it was something about how he's always seen Buck as bi. But I think in scenes like the season 1 tapeworm episode where Buck seems to bond with the gay couple it's supposed to come off more like Buck is just being his himbo self more than anything else. I mean I do think when we're looking back on the show there are definitely signs of his bisexuality (the tapeworm scene being one) but I don't know that the writers wrote him at the time with that intention.

But I think there's a good possibility that they brought Eddie in always wanting to have him be a character that comes out eventually. I mean look at how we're introduced to Eddie. Then look at how everything with Shannon was handled. They easily could have kept her around longer and turned their relationship into a will they/won't they. They could have made it so we saw how in love with her Eddie has always been but that's not what happened. They let us know right away that the main draw to that relationship for Eddie was familiarity and the fact that Shannon is Chris' mother. These factors have continued to come into play in Eddie's other relationships too. Like with Ana there was a familiarity in that she was Chris' teacher and Eddie was mostly looking for someone to fill the mother figure role for Chris.

While I think that Eddie was always intended to be queer I don't think they wanted him to come out immediately like they did with a character like Michael. I think the plan was to tell his story slowly and have him come out later. The Ana storyline I think was supposed to be the lead in to having Eddie come out. The main reason I believe this (apart from just look at how that storyline was handled) is the person on twitter with inside info to the show said as much.

I also think that around s3 they started to really notice the chemistry between Buck and Eddie and how much people were shipping them because that's when we got scenes like "there's no one in this world I trust with my son more" and "you want to go for the title" and the grocery story fight which totally read like a lovers quarrel. Or how they had Eddie seeing images of Buck flash in his mind when he almost died in the well. Or having Buck scream for Eddie when he almost died in the well.

I think by the time they got to season 4 there were serious discussions about putting Buck and Eddie together. We know from Oliver that the plan was originally to have Buck come out in s4 and presumably Eddie in s5 along with Buddie going canon. But Fox put a stop to that. If you go by what the insider said and by how season 4 was handled especially the shooting (which is incredibly romance coded) there's no way that Buddie wasn't in the plans by this point.

Plus you had Tim leaving around this time likely at least in part because he was frustrated with how Fox was stifling his show. You can also see remnants of where the story was supposed to go in s5. All that stuff with Eddie and Ana and the panic attacks and Buck being worried about him that was definitely supposed to be a part of Eddie's coming out arc I'm positive on that. I also think that Taylor (when she came back in s4) was originally just supposed to be a friend who helped Buck figure things out but instead Fox pushed for her to be a love interest. This would explain Oliver's dislike of the relationship and complete lack of supporting it. Similar to how he's been with B/T.

Anyway sorry I went off on a ramble. I could talk about these guys all day. 😅

Oh and I leave you with this anon Eddie in s3 checking out a hot guy's ass. (and Chimney clocking him doing it😝)

[leandra-winchester]

sorry in advance if i come off degrading or rude here (not my intention at all) but i'm sending this to you because you mentioned fictional narrative re: buddie, so i wanna add my thoughts about plausibility in relation to narrative format and medium conventions. long rant & full disclosure, i just watched 911, so i don't know how the conversation around this was pre-tommy but i don't understand how people thought/think it's a slowburn romance arc they were building with buddie that could actually happen. literally no romantic relationship on this show has been slowburn because it's just not how procedural shows of this kind are written. bathena barely interacts in s1 and were put together in a couple episodes. madney are only friends for five episodes or so. none of buck and eddie's relationships have build-up that lasts more than a few eps. the closest i can think of is buck and abby and even that wasn't much. i just don't think it's the nature of these type of shows, with the exception of something like the show castle where two main leads are set up as one day becoming romantic, to give breathing room for romance to go from zero to established. they're written in on-average 6-episode arcs and planned according to audience response, this is basically how every aspect of these shows work including the romantic plots.

which brings me to my second point you already touched a little bit: medium conventions but especially in relation to queer rep. when we have queer rep in these type of mainstream shows they're rarely stories about bi/gay awakening. double gay awakening? honestly, i don't remember a single show where something like this happened. i'm shocked we even got bi buck AT ALL because nominally straight hot guy main character getting confirmed as queer rarely happens. i kinda find the notion of people genuinely expecting this to happen with two main characters over seasons-long burn kind of laughable. and don't get me wrong, i understand why people love the idea, i'm myself a slow-burn building-a-bond-before-romance type of gal but i just don't think that type of queer story would ever work in a format like this, considering the average audience. look at something like 911ls for example, carlos and tk are both openly gay and start having sex on ep 2 and are boyfriends by ep 10 - that's the space queer stories currently hold in mainstream media. where it's made clear from the start and executed quickly over a few eps (not saying there's no further story with them, i just mean the relationship development). so yeah i don't think buddie was ever an option for the writers beyond being aware of the interest in it which is objectively very small compared to the millions of people watching this show. tldr: i think being ship-baited by a mainstream procedural show on fox is like going to the hardware store and asking for milkshake.

Okay, so I don't agree that slow burns aren't possible at all on shows like 911. Afaik, that popular ship on the Rookie also took several seasons, and there are many more shows that had a "will they, won't they?" situation with two main characters. Sure, it's much more difficult to write, plan and pull through, but it does get done.

Many people were hoping Buddie was FINALLY gonna be a queer version of that trope, and the thing is, there was enough subtext in the previous few seasons to support it. There were scenes that were shot and composed with commonly used cinematographic and contextual tropes that are usually used for romantic couples; there was all that stuff with Eddie having panic attacks over Ana, seeming very distanced with her, Carla's "Make sure you follow your heart, not Christopher's", and much more.

I do believe that backdoor was always open a tiny crack wide, and the writers were aware of it being a tiny, tiny option and therefore included all these little bits that would later make it plausible. There were interviews in the past with Tim where he even hinted at something like that, or left the option open; and there were other writers and directors who also subtly confirmed some subtext. It was never explicitly spelled out but hinted at.

So I'm pretty convinced that it at least was some level of consideration, in the past - always with a tiny probability to become possible, but it WAS there. (And before anyone reading this says "oh so that WAS ship baiting?" Nope, it wasn't. Giving yourself the option to maaaaybe do something in the future as a writer is normal procedure.)

Also, just because something was never done before (i.e. a queer slow burn) doesn't mean it'll never get done. It just makes it a lot less likely and subject to MANY external factors.

But yeah, I definitely agree that putting TWO queer awakening arcs around main characters into the story is extremely unlikely to ever happen on a show like this. And actually, we kinda already had two: the show started with Michael coming out to Athena. So yeah, even though we were thrown into the last stage/aftermath of that arc in s1 rather than seeing it play out from the start of its development, we had that.

[kermit-coded]

for the choose violence ask game:

1, 3, 8, 10, 12, 18, 22

answer whichever ones you want, i'm really curious about your dead boy detective and fantasy high hot takes are lol 🫶🏼

i know you said fantasy high/dead boy detectives but unfortunately most of my fandom takes have to do with comics so here we go.

the character everyone gets wrong.

kristen for sure. a lot of people paint her as this silly, irresponsible person who doesn't care about the consequences of her actions, but that's so derivative. she was raised in a restrictive, bigoted cult and it informs how she acts!! she's a teenager learning how to make her own choices after spending her entire life in an environment where thinking for yourself was actively discouraged, if not outright punished, so of course she's going to be messy.

3. worst fandom take i've seen.

hoo boy.... when you're a comics fan you've seen some abysmal takes. gotta be the takes surrounding how bruce is a coward for not wanting to kill people. yes, even the joker. is he flawed? yeah, but not wanting to permanently end a life is not one of those flaws. full stop.

8. common fandom opinion that everyone is wrong about.

honestly anything to do with tim drake and to an extent all of the bat siblings. theres a reason why i stopped engaging with the batfandom on a larger scale and that's because it has a tendency to sand down any interesting character traits in order to fit them into a nuclear family-esque dynamic. i really don't see tim and jason ever being that close, and i think they don't really see each other as siblings. also, dick was tim's robin, not jason.

10. worst part of fanon.

i'm going with comics again because it's insane how many people not only don't read the source material but actively brag about it. i think if you are going to call yourself a comics fan, then you need to read comics. otherwise you're a fucking poser. also i hate the damage xfi did to shatterstar as a character. peter david turned him into a slutty bi stereotype when in x force 1991 he literally has a panic attack the first time he gets a boner and is very specific about the people he trusts. that's not someone who would be sleeping around a lot, and yet so many people buy into that version of him and write him like that in fics. demisexual shatterstar ftw.

12. unpopular character that i actually really like.

hmm, not quite unpopular so much as niche but amadeus cho. he's such an interesting character and he deserves more love. he's a fun little anarchist and he hates the avengers and is wracked by guilt over his family dying because shield decided that a thirteen year old genius was a threat to national security and bombed his house. really interesting guy.

18. absolutely criminal that the fandom has been sleeping on...

charles and his trauma. maybe it's the aro in me but sooo many people seem only focused on charles in so much as him being in love with edwin back and im like... he has character traits outside of that.

22. my favorite part of canon that everyone else ignores

EVERYONE GO READ X FORCE 1991. rictor and shatterstar my underrated x men beloveds...

🔥choose violence ask game🔥

[slothspamsstuff]

Okaaay....this is just my headcanon but but but here's a thread on each Batfam member's sexual orientation (some of them might be unpopular opinion but it's my opinion so...)

- Bruce Wayne is bi, he might have been bi-curious at one point if he is not 🥹 playboy, charming, flirtatious and rich, he's everyone's dream. And I don't think the Bat himself is in denial of his sexuality, in fact, though lowkey, he might just be casually talking about his flings to Alfred if he didn't consider feelings a scary thing.

- Please forgive me for saying this but Dick Grayson feels like a straight guy who's very comfortable with his sexuality that he doesn't mind the gay jokes and he himself would make non-homophobic queer jokes towards his friends (regardless of their sexuality).

- Jason Todd is either bi or straight, because of that Judd Winick interview and because he's giving major bi friend vibes (trust me I'm bi), who leans towards dating girls but he might have been too jaded or fearful of commitment to be in a relationship so he's still single til this day. But he might also be similar to Dick, he might be a straight guy who is constantly attracting queer friends and is ok with that. Maybe he just has a smart mouth and wants to tease or provoke other guys to the point that it seemed queer as a hetero man, like how guys irl do? I dunno, but he could either be bi or straight, he gives off both vibes to me honestly lol. I can’t decide on this one.

- Tim Drake, similar to canon storylines, bisexual, need I say more? Though I'd like to see them build Tim and Bernard more cuz Bernard is a bit too similar to Steph now, and Tim and Kon also have a very interesting dynamic so I am very conflicted. I like the fact that even though they've broken up, him and Steph are still friends. I really appreciate healthy relationships like that (i...if of course you look past the fact that he might have wanted to unalive her dad).

- Stephanie Brown feels like she could be pansexual, she's chill and she doesn't mind being in a relationship with someone of the same gender, of the opposite gender or genderfluids or trans. But to get the most accurate impression of her, I will spend my time reading Batgirls. For now, her vibes scream pansexuality to me.

- Damian Wayne is straight, but he is just not into relationships. Though I also like his dynamic with Jon, I can't see them as more than friends (but you're welcome to ship them, it's actually a cute ship but bc they're literally children so I just can't see anything more than platonic). I know the Asexual Damian trope is also very popular but to me, he seems like a straight guy who, like Jason, is not into relationships due to the nature of his worklife.

- Barbara Gordon feels like she could be straight or bi, that's up to intereptation, but for the most part to me, she seems to be straight, I mean she loves a guy named Dick so...and her interactions with BoP members seem very platonic to me. But other headcanons are also cool, please enlighten me.

- Duke Thomas is straight, he's like that one YA romance novel live action main character, an awkward teenager except he's a metahuman and also a vigilante. Yes, he's sassy and funny and nice, I know, but his vibe doesn't scream queer to me.

- Cassandra Cain is bisexual because of her interactions with Tim and Steph in the comics. She's the quiet bisexual friend/lover that everyone is comfortable with. And I love, love that about her. Yes, Cass seems to be the downright not heterosexual, hell, she might have been more into girls than guys.

- Kate Kane is 100% a lesbian, this is not a headcanon. She's so gay that nothing about her is straight, not even her name.

- Ok, weird one but I think Alfred Pennyworth might also be bisexual, he could have banged the queen as an agent in his younger years then started dating the prince a year later. Or he could be demisexual, who knows, maybe he loved someone when he was younger, then something happened and he can't find himself being in another relationship with anyone else, and also younger Bruce only had him so he didn't have time for dating.

Sorry, idk much about Harper so I can't say fo sho.

Edit: my take on Cassandra Cain before anyone comes at me with their extremist anti batcest bs again (and unless you're here for Bruce and Damian as a couple, I don't even think batcest is a word that should exist) and here. Don't go looking for dramas, be polite to other people please. Just because you don't ship it doesn't mean you should act like an asshole about it. Their interaction happened in canon and I simply stated the fact with pictures from the actual comics, I don't ship them as a couple because well, I just....don't? But it's not like I'd care or I'd be grossed out if anyone ships them because well, a ship doesn't harm anyone nor does it affect my life, but going for harassment and being aggressive about what other people like, that has nothing to do with you or your life... you're the weird one and maybe you should touch grass or get some real life friends to talk to because that's just sad.