#bruce has basically had a sidekick for his entire existence

[evilwickedme]

The problem that basically every 21st century adaptation of Batman has is that they've failed to understand that Bruce's "I work alone" schtick is a character flaw

[artbyblastweave]

🔥 Sidekicks?

Sidekicks are interesting because they were genuinely a very common type of character for a while- almost every cape in the golden age had one- but they've kind of been a dead horse trope ever since Spider-Man demonstrated that you could straight up mainline a teenage hero without making them the ward or pageboy of a thirty-something masculine power fantasy. Almost every example of the type at DC or Marvel has been allowed to age out of the role, and every contemporary sidekick character I've seen in Indie stuff is a riff on Robin specifically- the sole surviving example where they've done the legwork to justify the continued existence of that costumed identity within the fiction. I've got mixed feelings on that, because the titanic presence of Batman and Robin in the cultural imagination means that that'll basically always be a relevant target to take a swipe at, but at the same time, we get it. It would fuck you up trying to live up to the expectations of the senior superhero in the partnership. Half of all officially published plots involving Robin is about how it's fucking him up (whoever he currently is) to try and live up to the expectations of the senior superhero in the partnership. Yes there's a weird age gap, yes it's child endangerment, we get it. This is covered ground.

The controversial element is that years on, I'm still kind of fascinated by what The Dark Knight Returns has to say on this topic; despite that comic's many flaws, I'm willing to extend a handicap to a lot of its deconstructive ideas simply because they hadn't been done totally to death yet at the time of the comic's publication. I inherited an older edition of the book from an uncle, and in that edition Miller discusses in the introduction that an impetus for the comic was his realization that Batman, the thirtysomething paternal figure, never gets old or weak the way real fathers do, never receives the scrutiny a fifty-something receives from their grown children regarding how they were raised. And this line of thinking is so so visible in the book proper- At the start, Bruce is emanating intense "divorced dad who knows perfectly well why his adult children aren't calling him" vibes. The fact that Dick is clearly alive but wants nothing to do with him, just hanging over the book as this unseen presence, is really interesting (until Strikes Again came along and fucked that right to death.) Jason's involvement in this lifestyle got him killed (years before they killed him for real!) and that was a bucket of cold water that snapped Batman out of the fantasy for about ten years- but ten years on Bruce has Jason on a pedestal in his inner monologue because the dead can't question the project or distance themselves from it the way that Dick has. There's something very deliberately uncomfortable, too, about the progression of Batman's relationship with Carrie Kelley; sure, she's living out every kid's fantasy of riding out on adventures with Batman- giving children in the readership the ability to project themselves that role is the entire reason Robin exists, metatextually- but we also see in real time how near death experiences are cutting through the fantasy to fuck her up, and how there's an uncomfortable co-dependency kind of thing that's quickly forming between her and Bruce. The comic doesn't pass a clear-cut judgement on this dynamic; personally I find it difficult to cleanly separate what's deliberate commentary from Miller's habitual Weirdness About Women- but I'm compelled by it regardless.

[terrestrialnoob]

Danny was far to used to needles to flinch when Mr. Alfred stuck him. His stupid DNA wouldn’t stay in tact long enough for them to verify his story, so he suspected either this would knock him out and he will be taken back out to where they’d gotten him or they’re being nice and putting him out of his misery quickly. If it’s the former, then he’ll have to find another way to survive- or a nice place to die. He didn’t get a lot of time to wander around Gotham before going to the GCPD, but dying in his… original’s city would at least be thematically valid. That’s what Mr. Lancer said about Danny’s analysis of Hamlet, that his “unique interpretation was thematically valid”, meaning Danny was wrong but did the work and would get a passing grade for turning it in. At least keeping it together long enough to continue existing would be the last thing he failed to do and his teachers wouldn’t have to worry about grading his thrown-together-at-the-last-minute bullshit.

“So, basically, since the only way to get a good sample of your DNA is to stop it from degrading, this is going to be a kind of two in one solution.” The man – teen? Red Robin didn’t seem that much older than Danny but it felt wrong not to think of him as an adult or at least older. He was obviously more experienced, smarter than Danny, and had been chosen as one of Batman’s sidekicks. “If you’re B’s clone, this modified, uh, kinda virus type thing will infect your entire body and basically, like, re-instruct your DNA on what shape it’s supposed to be. You know, Batman shaped. If you’re not B’s clone, then it will... do nothing and we’ll have to come up with something else.”

Danny stared at him, then at the band-aid now on his arm where he’d just been injected. “What?”

“Yeah, it’ll probably take a few days to actually be sure it’s working and we might have to re-administer it depending on your immune system’s reaction. But, if you’re telling the truth, then we did it!” Red Robin gave a little celebratory jazz hands.

Danny stared at Red Robin, then at the band-aid again. Something dripped into his arm and Danny was suddenly aware that he was crying. He hurried to wipe his eyes with his hand, “I – sorry, I wasn’t – I wasn’t expecting…”

“It’s alright. This has been stressful for you.” Danny heard Batman say and someone managed to put a tissue in his hand to clean up his face.

“I’m not going to die.” Danny didn’t even realize he was talking.

It wasn’t loud and it wasn’t clear through his shaking breath, but Batman responded anyway. “You’re not going to die.”

Danny just kind of, curled up in himself, his face completely hidden behind his legs and arms, where the heroes of Gotham couldn’t see to hopefully save at least a little of his dignity. He wasn’t going to die, he was going to keep living. He didn’t know what to do now, but he was alive! He thought he could feel it already, that the aches and pains that had been slowly growing more intense over the past few months – his entire life – were fading. He could go back home to his friends at least, tell them the truth about why he’d left, let them know he wasn’t going to be more dead than he already was, give Jazz a hug and let her know her little brother wasn’t going anywhere. The Fentons – he could talk to them when he was ready.

It took him a few minutes to get back in control of himself, but once he was able to breath without shaking he looked up again. Red Robin and the guy who’d been with regular Robin where gone. Robin was still there, staring at him from across the room, and Batman was a few feet away, working on something else.

“Master Bruce,” Mr. Alfred said, but Danny was the only one who looked at him. “I’ve prepared a guest room.” The older man then turned to look at Danny. “Have you eaten dinner yet?”

“Um, no?” Danny’s voice was hoarse from crying so much it made his face blush.

“I thought as such. If you’ll follow me, I’ve already prepared a small meal for you...” Mr. Alfred said with a small bow and then turned to almost fully face the back of Batman and spared a glance at Robin. “...all three of you, since the two of you left to meet with Commissioner Gordon before dinner was properly served.”

Danny cringed at having made them leave before they’d been able to eat dinner. He watched as Batman seemed to ignore Mr. Alfred, but Robin looked like he at least heard what was said.

“We’re going to-” Mr. Alfred cleared his throat making Batman stop and sigh, then he stood up from his amazing computer that Danny low key wanted to play with.

He slid the mask off his face. “We’ll be up, give us a minute to change.”

Danny tried not to stare at Batman’s bare face. He didn’t expect to see it, though he guessed he can understand why. It’d be Danny’s face eventually, but it still felt wrong. Danny was already being given so much trust; they’d brought him into their lair, weren’t being careful with names anymore, and now showing Danny this, letting him know Batman’s true identity, it was too much. But maybe- maybe Batman didn’t think the virus thing was going to work and Danny wasn’t going to live long enough to share it. Red Robin had said something like that. That they really weren’t sure their injection would work at all or that it might only work a little bit or maybe it reset the degeneration or something like that. That really made more sense than Batman trusting Danny this much. Still...

Danny followed Mr. Alfred to a small elevator that could hold two people comfortably, or four people uncomfortably. And Danny turned around to see Robin still directly glaring at him as the doors shut. There weren’t any buttons in the elevator, but it moved very fast and they were at the top in seconds. It opened to what looked to be an office with a big desk with a computer and bookshelves, but there were also two couches facing each other with a coffee table in the middle – so it was like an office slash meeting room.

Mr. Alfred stepped out in front of Danny and motioned for him to follow. “This way to the dining room, I’ll be sure to give you the full tour once everyone has had dinner.”

“You really don’t have to. I don’t want to take up too much of your time.” Danny said, following behind him and trying not to get distracted by where they were. It was a big house, much bigger than his home – than the house he grew up in. And the further they got, the more it looked like it might be somewhere close to what Vlad’s house was. Maybe not the Cheese Castle, but the “little” mansion he’d gotten in Amity Park.

“It’s not a waste of time.” Mr. Alfred said and they started down a big staircase. “I think it will be important for you to become familiar the manor and grounds. It’s quite easy for people to get lost here.”

Danny wanted to say it wouldn’t really matter, that he was only staying long enough to satisfy their observation of him- make sure their efforts didn't go to waste. But, the tour would mean that Danny would know where he was and wasn’t allowed to go and he’d be able to stay out of the way easier while he was there.

They soon entered a large room with a giant table in it. There were several plates set and several dishes. “I assumed you have the same allergies as Master Bruce, but are there any extra dietary needs you require? Master Damian is a vegetarian so there are already options for it.”

“Oh, no, I’ll eat whatever you give me.”

Mr. Alfred nodded and pulled out a chair for Danny. “There is roast chicken and baked marinated tofu, rosemary potatoes, steamed broccoli, and a wild rice salad with tomatoes, red onion, red bell pepper, pine nuts, and a honey-lemon dressing.”

“Thanks. This all looks great!”

“It does.” Batman said as he entered the room. He was wearing normal clothes now, just a black sweater and gray pants. Robin came in behind him, he was wearing a dark green long sleeve shirt and normal looking jeans.

Danny suddenly realized he was in the seat next to the head of the table and that was obviously where Batman sat down. Robin sat across from him, still glaring, but Danny was starting to think the other kid might just have resting bitch face and Danny would either just get used to it or see Robin so little it wouldn’t matter.

Danny must have sat frozen for a little too long there, because Mr. Alfred leaned over the table. “Here, I’ll get you started, but usually this is a serve yourself household so that everyone gets what they want and as much as they want without shame or embarrassment.”

Danny just nodded and let the man do as he pleased. It felt kind of weird, sitting at a table and eating with his… He wouldn’t have said family, but that is technically what they were, right? Danny literally had Batman’s DNA in him, and Robin had called the man Father with a capital F, so that kind of made them brothers? Cousins? Uncle and nephew? Or father and- Danny cut that line of thought and grabbed the nearest eating utensil to focus on eating instead.

“Holy shit, this is good.” Danny said before he realized he’d said it. He looked at Batman. “Oh, sorry, I didn’t mean to swear.”

Batman shrugged it off with a smile, “It is good food. I often forget how spoiled I am with good food.”

Mr. Alfred hummed at that and, Danny felt more than saw, an exchange of looks between the two older men. Mr. Alfred probably deserved more appreciation for cooking like this and Batman didn’t think he needed to vocalize the appreciation, that it was simply understood he loved Mr. Alfred and all the work he did.

“So, you eat meat?” Robin asked. He seemed a little off-put by Danny taking some of the chicken after getting some of the tofu.

Danny shrugged. “I mean, I’ll eat anything that doesn’t attack me.”

Robin narrowed his eyes. “So should I attack you so you don’t eat me?”

“What? I’m not cannibal? What?” Danny said and looked between the other people in the room. Batman looked exasperated and Mr. Alfred looked half amused at Robin and half offended on Danny’s behalf.

“Then why do you need to specify that you prefer your food doesn’t attack you?”

“Because I... don’t most people prefer food that you don’t have to kill first?”

Robin gave him a sardonic look. “You have to kill all meat before you eat it.”

Danny shook his head, “No, I mean like – when you eat it. Like, you sit down to eat and then the hot dogs grow mouths and teeth and attack you so you have to kill it before you eat it.”

Robin’s glare turned into a shocked stare, and Batman and Mr. Alfred joined in staring at him. “What?”

“What do you mean “what?”?” Robin was annoyed at him. “Hot dogs do not come to life and attack people.”

Oh fuck. He’s ruined it. He doesn’t know what he’s ruined, but he’s too weird for The Batman. Danny started shoveling food into his mouth so he’d stop talking and freaking out Batman.

“How does that happen?” Batman asked and there goes Danny’s hope of being less weird.

Danny swallowed and waved his free hand around a little bit. “I – it’s just that my- the people I lived with before weren’t very good at keeping their specimens quarantined, and they also liked to experiment with food. So, just, sometimes the hot dogs or a turkey or other foods would just, come to life and we’d have to kill them.”

There was a beat of silence before Mr. Alfred asked, “And did you eat this experimental food?”

Danny half shrugged, “There wasn’t really anything else to eat, so yeah.”

Mr. Alfred hummed and it sounded like he might be worried. “I can assure you that nothing like that has ever happened here.”

“Oh. Okay. Cool.” Danny said and, again, tried to eat his way out of the conversation. But it was too awkward. “But, Mr. Alfred, your food is way better than any of that stuff.”

“I would hope so.” Mr. Alfred said. “And feel free to take as much as you want, we have plenty.”

Danny hadn’t even noticed he’d cleaned his plate already. He was about to refuse, but the look on Mr. Alfred’s face made it feel like it would insult the man if Danny didn’t get seconds. So he did.

“What are their names?” Batman suddenly asked.

Danny glanced at him. “Who’s names?”

“You’re… creators.”

The one question Danny hated above all others; ever since he was a little kid who realized that his parents were the town weirdos and that their status as the town weirdos had spread to Danny before he even knew how to walk. He felt the unfortunately familiar mix of the heat from embarrassment and cold from the rejection experience made him know was coming. He wanted to look anywhere but at someone. “Why do you want to know?”

“They made a clone of Father.” Robin said with disdain, and yeah, Danny should have known that. He knows how much it hurts to be cloned. “What if they try again?”

Danny tried to sound as matter of fact as possible. “The Fentons, Jack and Maddie. They’re married to each other. And yeah, they do want to try again, but they used up all their Batman DNA making me.”

“They want to make another one?” Robin was somehow even more annoyed.

“Well, I mean, their first one was such a failure…” Danny half mumbled then sighed and added. "It’s why they want to autopsy me. So they don’t make the same mistakes twice.”

Danny spared a glance. Now Batman was glaring and Danny couldn’t blame him. He doesn’t know how widespread the Fenton name is, but if anyone knows them, it’s not because of how caring, thoughtful, or altruistic they are. And here Danny was, his very existence a violation so deep he wouldn’t blame Batman if he kicked Danny out right that second.

So Danny decided to give the man the opportunity to do that. “How long is the observation?”

Batman’s face quickly changed from angry to confused, so Danny reiterated. “You know, for the kinda virus thing? How long do do you want me here under observation?”

Batman still looked a little confused but went along with the change in topic. “It should take somewhere between two days and two weeks to be certain of it’s effects.”

Danny nodded. “That’s the range they estimated it would have taken for me to completely destabilize, so I can go back once it’s confirmed.”

“Go back?” Batman seemed more confused.

And that made Danny confused. “It’s not like I can stay here forever.”

Batman frowned at that, but Robin spoke first. “You want to go back to the people who want to autopsy you?”

“It’s either them or that guy I told you about earlier.” Danny said and indicated to Batman cause he thinks Robin might have been too far away to hear that part in the cave. "And it's not like they actively try to kill me - I mean, well, usually anyway. It's more of a -if I just so happen to die- type thing."

“Why not stay here?” Batman asked.

Danny couldn’t help the look on his face. Stay here? With Batman? The man he’s been secretly measured against his whole life? The person he’s failed to be time and time again? Danny’s not sure he could take that. “No, you don’t want me here.”

“Should you let us decide that?” Batman gave Danny a pointed look.

Danny shouldn’t answer that. He knows they wont want him. No one wants him. Even Vlad; he doesn’t really want Danny, he wants Maddie’s Son, he wants to steal Jack’s Son, he wants The Other Halfa. Danny knows that he’s just going to burden Batman and his family and the other vigilantes. But he’s not going to say that. He knows better than to argue about where he belongs.

What are you? A ghost trying to fit in with humans or some creepy little boy with creepy little powers?

So Danny folded immediately. “Sorry, you’re right. You get to decide who does and doesn’t get to stay in your house.”

Danny was looking at his mostly empty plate and didn’t see that statement earn him a frown from everyone else in the room.

Danny sighed and glanced over to Mr. Alfred. “I know you said you wanted to show me around, but I’m really tired. Can I just go to bed?”

“Of course.” Mr. Alfred said and motioned for Danny to follow him.

Danny didn’t talk, though Mr. Alfred gave him general direction on how to get from the dining room to the bedrooms, pointed out whose rooms were whose, let Danny know he had an en suite and a dresser full of clothes the other boys didn’t wear anymore. Danny hadn’t realized that Batman had such a big family and he wondered how they would feel after learning that Danny existed. He doubted any of them would accept him. He could hope one of them might want to be his friend, but he knows who he is, what he is. He wont hold any of their feelings against them.

Gut Feeling

DPXDC

Commissioner Jim Gordon meets an odd kid in the precinct.

--

“Come on, you really don’t have a way to directly contact Batman?”

Jim smiled. Kids came to the station and asked that all the time. Usually, it was just curiosity and showing them the signal was enough to get them to sign up for the Junior Police program. This one looked a little older than most, teenagers were often “too old” to believe in Batman, but again, give them a little faith now and they’ll never loose it.

“Lookin’ for the Bat, kid?” Jim asked, knowing he was about to make this kid’s –

Jim froze. The kid turned to face him and it was Bruce Wayne. Not playboy billionaire Bruce Wayne, but freshly a teenager Bruce Wayne. The Bruce Wayne who Jim had checked in on time and again from age eight until he ran off on a globetrotting trip to find himself. The little Bruce Wayne with too pale skin and dark bags under his eyes, and not enough love to make up for all the grief weighing him down. And he didn’t look like Damian either, where Bruce was obviously his father but there were distinct traits from his mother. This was a carbon copy of a boy Jim remembered vividly.

“I am.” He even sounded like teenage Bruce. All business, like he was on a mission.

“I might be able to help you, but it’ll take a while.” Jim said and the officer the kid had been talking too gave him an odd look. He waved her off and told the kid to follow him to the commissioner’s office. Normally, he’d be more dramatic, put on more of a show for the kid, but his gut told him this was different, this was important. He offered the kid a styrofoam cup of water then closed the door behind him. “So, what do you need to talk to Batman for?”

“It’s personal. I need to talk to him in person.”

Jim took a sip of coffee from his cup. “He doesn’t appreciate me calling for no reason in the middle of the day.”

“So you do have a direct line?” The kid nearly jumped out of his seat. “If he’s upset, it’ll be my fault, just call him, please.”

“Who should I say wants to talk to him?”

The kid hesitated. “He doesn’t know me, but I have to talk to him.”

Jim frowned. “What’s your name, kid?”

He swallowed and looked like he wasn’t going to answer for a moment. “Danny.”

“Danny…?” Jim wanted a last name but Danny kept quiet. Jim sighed, “He’s likely not going to show up until sundown.”

“I can wait, as long as you guarantee he’ll show.”

“And you’re not going to tell me why you need Batman?” Jim just got a glare in response. “What about one of the other heroes?”

“Only Batman, no one else can help.”

“You sure about that? Not even Superman?”

“Not unless Superman can get me in the same room as Batman.”

“Why’s it so important that you meet him in person?”

“It’s personal.”

Jim liked this less and less by the minute. “Do your parents know you’re here?”

Danny looked away but right when it looked like he wouldn’t say anything he mumbled. “They wouldn’t care anyway.”

After another moment to give the kid time to reconsider, Jim pulled out the Bat-phone. It was a normal Wayne-Tech cell phone, but Jim had been given very specific instructions on how and when to use it. The phone listed all the Gotham Vigilantes without visible numbers so they couldn’t be copied and handed out. He pressed the one for Batman.

“Stand outside, would you?” The kid gave him a look, but followed the request. Jim could see his shadow in the door’s window, not so subtle eavesdropping.

It rang a few times, and Jim sat there awkwardly with a teenager listening to his every move. Finally, a familiar voice picked up the other end of the line. “Commissioner Gordon.”

“Sorry to call you out of the blue Batman, but I’ve got a kid here who needs your help.”

“Who?”

“Says his name is Danny, that you’ve never met him but you’re the only one who can help him.”

“Why?”

“Refuses to tell me.”

“What’s your best guess, Commissioner?”

Jim looked at Danny’s shadow, it looked like he was straining his ears to try and hear what he was saying. Danny had given him almost nothing to work with. Just his name, that he’s never met Batman but needs to talk with him in person. But Jim was here because he listened to his gut. A feeling like when you see a random rock on your neighbor’s doorstep but you’d never go in without an invitation. A feeling like you know what’s in the present and are preparing your surprised face. A feeling like when you cheated on your wife and you know she knows.

“He looks like Bruce Wayne.”

A beat of silence. “What?”

“Danny looks exactly like Bruce when he was a teenager. Exactly the same.” Jim hoped Batman would get it, feel in his gut what Jim felt.

“And he wont say why he’s there?”

“No, and he demands to see you in person.”

“I’ll be there in an hour.”

“10-4.” The line cut off before Jim had finished saying it. He called Danny in again. “He’s on his way.”

Danny glared at him. “If he’s not, if you called some social worker or something, you’ll regret it.”

“I’m sure.” Jim sighed and downed the rest of his now cold coffee.

The sun hadn’t set, but only just barely. Jim ended up taking Danny up to the roof in the end after all, if only to save his window from being broken into. The kid had a red hoodie on, but he was still shivering in the autumn chill and it was just going to get colder by the minute as the sun made its way behind the horizon.

Jim checked his watch and, at exactly an hour from when he called, he acted surprised when Batman and Robin appeared out of nowhere. “Bats.”

“Commissioner.” Batman greeted but his eyes went straight for Danny. “Danny, I assume.”

“Yeah, I…” Danny hesitated, looking at Jim and Robin.

All it took was four words from Batman. “What do you need?”

The kid held out his hand with a flash drive in it. “I’m your clone. My par- The people who made me wanted to make a stronger version of you, but they got ahead of themselves. My DNA is degrading and I’ll die if I don’t get your DNA to stabilize me.”

Holy cow.

“You don’t expect us to believe that, do you?” Robin sneered at him.

“The flash drive has all the info on it. All the data about the cloning process and the, uh, relevant experiments after that.” Batman gave the kid a look. “I didn’t want to waste time on unnecessary data.”

“If what you’re saying is true, why are you here, alone? Are they working on a different solution?”

Danny’s shoulders hiked up. “I’ve been a failure for a while now, I’m not worth the resources and they’d learn more from an autopsy.”

Oof, kid. Jim looked at Batman who seemed to feel the same… if Jim was reading him right.

“So, you wont object to a DNA test?” Robin asked with a cocky head tilt, at least he was relatively easy to read.

“You can try.” Danny said, and then realized what that sounded like. “I mean I wont stop you, but my DNA degrades faster outside my body. You’ll have to take me to whatever lab you plan on using.”

“Then we will.” Batman said and jerked his head towards where they’d probably parked that ridiculous car of his. But then he looked at Jim with a nod. “Commissioner.”

“Batman.” Jim returned the nod. “You’ll tell me how things turn out, yeah?”

“I’ll give you a report.” Batman joked – Jim could tell, it was gut feeling.

[sunnie-angel]

Part 2 oh my god, I can't believe we get to be blessed with part 2!! You cannot imagine how I practically absorbed this into my very being. Thank you so, so much for writing a part 2.

The very beginning shocked me to my core, because we get a child death. I haven't seen that in fics, but I like how you start it out at this point. Getting to see the Reader (which, I cannot relate to at all, except for the fact that the Reader loves Jason) at this formative age, to see how they behaved is such a smart move. Especially with the Reader's background as an (I assume) orphan. NOT TO MENTION THAT JASON KNEW OF THE READER WHEN THEY WERE KIDS?? HELLO???

That shook me to my very core. I was not expecting that, or that they knew each other. Yeah, I can already see why the Reader, who I'm naming R from now on, may be with Jason. He protected them from a really awful kid and her friends, made it easier for them sometimes. (Not all the time, because R says Lucy was always worse when Jason wasn't around.)

R (correct me if I'm wrong here, I may be reading this wrong) having their father get held up on an embezzlement charge and then moving to Crime Alley.....interesting. R is taken out of the glitz and glamor of the Diamond District, of privilege and comfort. And then Jason "dies" at 11, taken out of the Alley, now in the very privilege R had been forced to leave behind. (Side bar here, but there is something wrong with R. Yes, technically, a version of Jason had gone away when Jason became the second Robin, the second son of Bruce Wayne. But he didn't die. We know that, of course. Too bad R doesn't. Then again, we don't see if R tries to reach out to Jason, if they make contact with one another at all.)

"The red rimmed eyes of Bruce Wayne on the staticky screen of the common room television confirms what you already know: Bruce Wayne is the Bat and he has killed your friend twice over."

You have no idea how much I wanted to scream from that. Sincerely. Especially when you basically wrote that Jason's second death is the reason R is taking on the criminals that Batman won't take out permanently. They want a permanent solution, they always have, no matter if it was for dealing with Lucy Nesbit or for dealing with the man who would take more than his fill of the city.

Oh wow, R is a court stenographer?? I love that choice. Oh, they bought the house with the purple windowsills. And yet, it isn't enough. Fixing the house, removing the old flooring is not enough. The stability of the government pension is not enough. It should be, as you wrote. But it isn't.

I think that detail about the asshole who hits on R at the bar was so well written. It gave me the heebie jeebies, and I hated the guy as soon as you described him.

R is...definitely a serial killer, though no one else knows it. The issue is that we have to wonder about the ethics behind all of these killings. Because there are two sides to this.

In many ways R is right to hate Batman. Their best friend left them behind after being adopted by Bruce Wayne, and dies as Batman's sidekick. Maybe things would be better if R didn't figure out Bruce and Batman are the same man. But they did. That brings us to the issue of Batman being a reason as to how crime has changed in Gotham. As far as we know, in this story at least, people like Poison Ivy and Mr. Freeze did not exist when Bruce was a kid. It was just typical robbers and muggers. But now, people with clown gimmicks, people who spray a toxin that makes you witness your worst fears, people who can freeze the entire city or butcher you while wearing a pig mask run amuck. Like moths to a flame, Batman attracts some weird people, has romantic relations with them, and allows children that he adopts in his civilian alter ego to fight by his side against them. He brings a lot of harm to the city, he is a motivator for who R becomes by the time part 1 occurs.

But he also brings a lot of safety. Some of these villains would still be in Gotham, with or without a Batman. And that would leave them to the government. That's not to mention that some of these villains would also be worse without the intervention of Batman. It would also, possibly, leave Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, and Tim Drake as orphans, since Bruce being Batman in no way interferes with each kid's parent's death. These kids would end up in the foster system, but even that isn't safe, we know that based on real life and with what R dealt with. Sure, Jason may not die as Robin, but he could die even earlier because of what goes on in the Alley. And who knows how R would turn out in this hypothetical.

Wow this really got away from me. Whoops.

Anyway. R is already losing their footing, and by that I mean, they're killing people who don't even pop up with a record. They're losing their motivation a bit, and it's interesting to see. What's more interesting is seeing the Red Hood come back to R. We don't know if it's on purpose, not yet. But we know that even though Jason wore his domino mask under his helmet, R knows their boy.

I cannot get over the line, "He kisses you, and the axis of your world shifts." Oh my god. How can you get away with writing that. It shouldn't be allowed, now I'll hope that I get to experience a kiss that shifts the axis of my world. There are lines that stick with you forever, and this is one of them.

Seeing R and Jason together is saccharine in the best way possible. I mean, Jason is able to show every part of himself with R, he can let "The cracks show through. Violence drips out of his every pore despite his hand wringing to you late at night. You are his confessor and absolve him of any sin." (Another fantastic line, oh my gosh.)

The way you've written their dynamic is balls to the walls insane, in the best way possible. I can't imagine hearing Jason's story again and not feeling the way R does. But at the same time, R is manipulating this poor boy. (Good riddance to the Joker. And the foster father. God. Why is Gotham a spawning point for trashy people.)

Batman coming after them was expected, yet somehow I'm in shock about everything?? Which is so funny, in terms of what I'm feeling, idk. Anyway. Bruce fights his son, R gets handcuffed. I'm cheering for Bruce, though, because while R and Jason are cute together, R has a high body count (not like Jason doesn't) for a civilian. They've manipulated Jason, but they love him in their own way.

You truly hit it out of the park with this. Your fics are always a treasure to behold, but I love the way this feels, the way it reads. Thank you for writing a part 2. You definitely didn't need to write it (unless you wanted to), but you did and I'm forever grateful we got a part 2 and an in-depth look at the relationship you teased in part 1. Have a good week!! (Side note but I always write these little asks in my phone's notes app, and this took 9 pages for the note. Oh my gosh.)

I’m getting so emotional that you wrote a 9-page love letter about a fic that I wrote.

From the beginning, I knew I wanted to start with the death of Lucy Nesbit because it communicates to the audience that really anything is on the table. It seems like I just can’t resist writing friends-to-lovers with Jason, so they are childhood friends, and in a way this sparks Reader’s possessiveness of him. I meant for Lucy to be the ex-Diamond District daughter, so that Reader’s later hatred for rich Gothamites getting away with terrible things makes sense.

The ethics of crime fighting in Gotham are so complicated, so with Reader I wanted to explore one way a civilian who has very little power might react. What does she do? Reader becomes a serial killer! She’s exactly the type of criminal Jason would stop permanently, and she knows this. Before Jason reappears, she is starting to slip and going after people for the power killing makes her feel; it becomes less about making the world better and more about making her feel better. With Jason, her (admittedly hazy) sense of right and wrong comes back into focus. Loving each other makes them both worse while making them both feel better, and isn’t that a helluva drug? When I was writing it, I didn’t intentionally make parallels between Reader and Bruce but now you’ve pointed them out I’m going to pretend that was my intention all along 😅. For Reader, manipulation is her way of loving Jason but that’s also the same trait in Bruce that she hates.

Thank you for taking the time to share such long, detailed comments. I love hearing your thoughts and reactions, they’re such a treat for me.

[everyscreentoobeseen]

I stg sometimes the vigilante route makes no sense because if John's "known issue" was holding grudges. Why didn't he hold a grudge against Harley???? He barely acknowledged her existence in the entire Episode??? He hated Riddler but didn't kill him.

(I know Riddler implied that John was supposed to alert the Pact about his plans but didn't. Therefore letting him get arrested. But I honestly think that was retconned cuz it was never explained later. You didn't even have the option to ask John about that.)

Even after that John didn't interact with Riddler's Corpse at all so... no pettiness there.

I know Waller tried to Shoot him, but John legit doesn't care about getting hurt. Willy tried to stab him and they're still freinds in the Vigilante route. Harley gave him a black eye and he still has Mad Love for her in the Villain Route. Don't even get me started on Bruce.

I think they realized DC Comics would be pissed if The Joker actually became an ally/sidekick for Batman, -

[Look up Gotham's Joker/ The Valeska Twins debacle TLDR: DC flat out refused to let Gotham have the rights to the name Joker so they had spend the entire show calling the Proto-Joker something else. DC can be very weirdly stringent with their characters]

and/or they didn't want to write a season 3 with John as a sidekick. So, they gave him a crappy reason to "go insane" and decided that Waller was the only person who could send John back to Arkham.

TLDR

So basically what I'm saying is, John was acting OOC during the Vigilante Route. I will die on this hill, bite me Telltale Games. I know I'm right cuz I've done the Vigilante Route 100 times and it still feels contrived.

[aspiring-wildfire]

I appreciate your post, but I think that, by avoiding one cliché, Jason being the angry Robin, you're falling into the trap of another one: Dick being the angry Robin. He wasn't more angry than the other ones. They all had their moments of great anger and of great controll over their emotions. Truth is, none of them fall into a neat little box and we should, imo, stop trying to do that. Let them be multifaceted. Tim was a jock at first, for instance and Dick was pretty nerdy.

hi! i totally get what you’re saying, and honestly the whole point i was trying to get at with that post was that they’re all more complicated than they often get treated (and that the roles they get slotted into often aren’t the right ones even if they were that simple) so i definitely don’t think any of them fall in a neat box. that said, this also gives me a chance to talk about my Absolute Best Boy dick grayson so buckle up y'all!! i love my boy and i am always thinking about him!!!

okay so first of all: i do think that, of the four of them, Dick has the worst temper. he canonically had a huge problem with his temper when he was younger, and i really think it does him a disservice to dismiss how fucking hard he works to keep that under control. that's not at all to say that the "happy sunshine boy with vague theater kid energy big brother figure" characterization of dick is wrong, though! he's both! dick feels everything so strongly and just fucking cares so much about the world and the people in his life, and that makes him incredibly kind and wonderful and potentially really fucking angry.

There's a reason he often gets referenced as kind of the gold-standard of the superhero world; in a lot of ways, dick is the embodiment of what a hero should be. he does what he does because he really cannot bear the idea of being able to help people and not doing it (ric grayson arc dni). there's a reason he makes lifelong friends everywhere he goes, and that's that dick is a paragon hero who draws people into his orbit by the sheer force of his compassion and charisma. that magnetism, the way he supports and inspires the people around him to do good, is so important because it's... kind of one of the backbones of the whole superhero community? depending on the timeline you're using, robin either already exists when the JL starts or gets established very early on, usually before identities get revealed, meaning that from whichever perspective you're looking at things dick was there very early in the creation of a superhero community, and on top of that had really strong personal relationships with all of the big 3 heroes. considering how close batman and robin were then (robin was really the only one of the younger heroes who had more of a partnership than a sidekick relationship with their mentor, bc he and bruce really needed each other in a way that wasn't necessarily true with the other heroes) and how fucking extraverted and adorable a baby dick grayson was, it's fair to say dick was one of the best-known and probably most loved heroes in the entire community basically from minute one, and as things expanded and other kid heroes started popping up- most of whom were directly inspired by robin- that circle only expanded. batman was the hero that kind of started the idea of heroes, but dick was the one who created the idea of younger superheroes and the vision of a superhero community that could grow and evolve.

bruce is a good man and a great hero, and he's the fucking batman, there basically isn't anyone more competent, but he's also haunted by his trauma in a way that prevents him from really being a symbol of hope the way dick makes himself right away, and bruce knows that. he's so fucking proud of dick (bad parent bruce arcs dni) bc he sees all the best parts of what he wanted to build without the pain and with all the best parts of dick grayson added in, and that's kind of the dream of batman? batman was created to make sure that no one will ever have to suffer the way bruce did ever again, but bruce is also way too fucking smart and frankly too emo not to realize that the "criminals are a superstitious and cowardly lot" and therefore could be easily terrified, and that that role is something he's just a lot more able to fill, especially super angsty young adult bruce who was kind of tearing himself apart before dick came along. robin though? robin was that light in the dark, because dick was that light in the dark. that's who he is and who he's always been, even as a kid desperately and furious and grieving. at the end of the day he's just a good person who does good things because he wants the world to be better.

obviously though, that's not to say he doesn't have flaws, and i personally tend to think that the biggest of them is easily his temper. dick has in a lot of ways had a brutal and very painful life, and the massive eldest daughter syndrome he's got kicking around plus his main emotional role models growing up being bruce and alfred means he's... kind of the worst at dealing with his emotions in a healthy way. 9 times out of 10, that manifests in self-destructive or self-sacrificing actions, but it also sometimes bleeds out as (sometimes justified, sometimes not so much) anger. he and bruce's partnership split up because it was basically immovable object meets unstoppable force- in other words, bruce's unparalleled stubborness and control issues didn't mix well with a late-teens dick grayson's irrepressible need for freedom and very touchy temper. dick has a lot of anger, but over time he works really fucking hard to get it under control, and he mostly does! even when he slips up, he almost always realizes and regrets it pretty quickly thereafter (the most notable time being when he literally beat the joker to death with his bare hands). i mean fuck, the fact that he and damian have the kind of relationship they do is a testament to how fucking hard dick's worked over the years to get his temper under control and keep himself in check, bc i fucking love damian but the patience you would need with that kid is UNMATCHED.

even setting aside his temper, though, he's still very much a flawed character, and when that doesn't manifest in a hot temper it can often show up looking a lot like bruce?? especially as he gets older and takes on more responsibility and becomes a leader for a lot of teams, dick grapples a lot with the ways he's similar to bruce and how that isn't always something he likes about himself- at the end of the day, dick is a genius level intellect with an incredible mind for strategy and hard choices and is as hypercompetent and skilled as he can be impulsive, but that strategic knack? the ability to make the tough calls?? yeah he doesn't love that! he can do it, and he's really fucking good at it, but he also hates that he can- he doesn't want to be able to look at people as pieces, he doesn't want to be able to set aside his love for his teammates and take a coldly strategic approach that could mean sending them into danger, but he knows he can, and he knows sometimes someone needs to, and there's no chance his hero complex would put that weight on anyone else's shoulders, especially considering the fact that, simply put, the best candidate for the job is always gonna be a bat. he won't make any of his younger siblings make those calls bc he knows how hard they are to live with, even as he hates the fact that he can live with them or make them at all. dick is absurdly good at what he does- he's better trained than nearly anyone, he's a natural leader who can always see the big picture, his gut instinct is unparalleled, and imo he's probably one of the best/most talented superheroes there is overall bc he's literally been doing this nearly his whole life.

tl;dr dick grayson is stubborn and kind and loving and brilliant and angry and patient and passionate and hopeful and tough and skilled and so deeply, genuinely good and i would die for him

[redplanetlobster]

I actually went through a couple different Fears for Jason before I settled on the Buried. Most of them I dismissed because I felt Jason would be more likely to be a victim of them than on Avatar (I mean the Buried isn't much different but there're a lot of ways I think Jason can enact the fear, unlike the others I thought about). The Slaughter wasn't actually one though, senseless killing definitely isn't his style. The Hunt definitely could be though. The pursuit of a goal that, once achieved (if it ever could be in the first place), would leave him still searching, still wanting, and ultimately unsatisfied? That sounds like him wanting the Joker dead but refusing to do it himself. That sounds like his wanting of Bruce's approval without the willingness to change himself. That sounds like his fruitless goal of ending crime and violence with crime and violence.

Some of the other Fears I thought about:

Flesh: I'm a huge fan of the hc that Jason has some wild body dysmorphia after his dip in the pit (plus the Flesh is my favorite fear). Unfortunately not many things for him to torture other people with. His low self esteem maybe?

Lonely: Jason woke up in a world that had moved on without him. Everything was different: his family, his city, hell even the Manor was different due to the events of No Mans Land. I wouldn't fault him for feeling completely isolated as the world, as he knew it, just doesn't exist. (I've got a note somewhere in my docs about a fic where Jason gets put on Martin's/a Lonely domain in general. The domain is just the empty Manor (rebuilt after No Mans Land, so remodeled somewhat) with people leaving rooms just before Jason entered because they heard him coming and just couldn't stand to be anywhere close to him for one reason or another)

Web: Jason absolutely loves making plans and getting other people to follow them unknowingly. The entirety of UtRH he was kicking his feet and giggling every time Bruce did the exact thing here planned for.

End: He died. He's literally a zombie. There's not much more to it than that, pretty basic lol. Ultimately, I don't think Jason is patient enough to be an End Avatar.

Now the reasons I think the Buried fits him best (the bullet points are only a suggestion of putting this into coherent ramblings with separate ideas and reasoning lol):

The thought of a man, deathly claustrophobic and physically can't stand the scent of wet earth because it reminds him of the time he had to claw himself out of his own grave, having to dedicate himself to the concept of being buried alive in order to survive is very funny to me. When the thought first occurred to me I had a little chuckle to myself before actually I took a second to think about it.

I think the influence of the Buried would have been with him for his entire life. He grew up in poverty and was orphaned and homeless at a very young age. Jason is very and always has been very aware that the only way for him to go in life is down. Sometimes it is better to be dead.

During his tenure at the Manor, Jason never thought of it as relief from his hardships of the streets. He was just trading them out for new ones. After all, the only reason Bruce took him in was so Batman could have a Robin right? When he couldn't be a good son for Bruce he couldn't be a good Robin and if he wasn't Robin he didn't have a place in Bruce's house now did he?

Robin itself brings a whole lot of weight on its own. Jason was handed the mantle of the first sidekick and told that he could fill his shoes, that he might even be better. He was handed a mask at 13 and told that he was one of the few people standing between a city and its death and destruction.

Warehouses are quite heavy and asphyxiation sounds like a horrible way to go.

Jason had to dig his way out of his own coffin while still suffering from all of the injuries of his death.

Uhhh... I don't really have anything for Lost Days or the UtRH arc. Mainly 'cause those feel like they go pretty firmly into the reasons for Jason to be an Avatar of the Hunt.

When Jason chose to go back to Crime Alley he also chose to take on the weight of it. He chose to take the many problems of his people, many of which you can't actually solve with a gun, make them his problems. He chose to make those problems his.

Jason returned to the Alley, the first place he felt the oppressive but comforting weight of it, and did the only thing he knew how. He went down and shouldered the responsibility of fighting against the system that doomed his home.

Those last two bullet points are dangerously close to me fully writing this au out/getting really into the changes that I think Avatarhood would have on Jason and how I think he would feed on the fear, so I need to stop here. But yeah, I really think that the Buried fits Jason very well.

I've some very sophisticated thoughts about a TMA and Batman crossover but if you ask me any questions about it I'll only be able to tell you about Buried Avatar Jason.

[rchardgrayson]

ok ok. ive been writing in my own doc abt it now bc i cant stop thinking abt it but i think it boils down to the fact the robin anniversary shouldve overall been about dick being robin and what it means to him specifically. and how robin has evolved from being his nickname from his mom to being a legacy he’s had to share. and all the stories within the anniversary shouldve been about dick and the different stages in his life..

kind like of the ga anniversary had stories from basically every era of green arrow and the arrowfamily. robin anniversary shouldve had that (but all *mostly* from dick’s pov) vs what we actually got which was literally three stories about him and the other seven were about the other robins. like hello..

and honestly as for the other robins i think one or two stories about them would’ve sufficed, and it should’ve been about dick being a mentor and again his thoughts on sharing a legacy that was never meant to be a legacy.

ok FINAL thought and there should’ve been an entire story dedicated to his parents!!!!!!! because they are the reason robin exists!! there is no robin without john and mary grayson!!!!! and i have my own ideas personally on how i would write a john&mary story for the anniversary too but this ask is so long omg im sorry i appreciate u letting me share :3 now tell me what u think!!

I agree sooo hard omg it would've been so good to have a bunch of stories throughout his life like as robin (like they're doing in robin and batman now - kinda robin: year one-esque) and then becoming Nightwing and the history behind that - like, the origin of the name and what drove dick to become Nightwing etc.

They coulda included the other robins in how dick interacted with them when they were robin (like dick giving Jason his blessing and trainjumping blindfolded with Tim and giving robin to Damian) ik there's nothing for Steph there but ya win some ya lose some.

I'm reading this thesis rn that was written last year about dicks integral importance to the DC universe and comic books as a media in general because he was the first ever sidekick and we've seen him grow into his own man and face many trials and tribulations along the way and how he's been a mentor to sooo many others. They're just such important points that weren't really discussed in the anniversary because they made it about the mantle instead of dick as a character and even then they didn't even truly explore the mantle that well.

And yessssss. I imagine many writers find it boring to write abt dicks life in the circus cause there's no dark gritty heroes there (i.e why they added the court of owls to his history which is 🤢🤮) but I would LOVE to explore that more! I'm totally not writing a fic rn where dick is confronted with a world where his parents didn't die and are still in the circus . I think the lost carnival graphic novel was a nice look at what a teenage dick could be like with his parents in the circus and honestly it should be explored more in main continuity because dicks parents and his upbringing pre-bruce are fundamental to his shaping as a person and character.

And this answer got so long sjhdjdj because there are SO many thoughts in my head but yeah sjhdjdh please DC could have done SO much better smh

[ellana-ravenwood]

The Batfamily TV show I wish existed but that will most likely never be (wecanhopethough) :

I’ve been fantasazing a LOT lately about a Batfam centric tv show. Not a story just about Bruce and then the kids are somewhere in the background, or just about one of the kid, or one character of the ���extended family”. Nope. A TV show, that would focus on everyone. And here’s a few of my thoughts haha :

We’ve seen enough of times Bruce’s parents murder so no need to have a scene of that again. Even people who never read a Batman comics or watch a movie/animated show, sort-of know how he ended up being Batman ya know ? It kinda became a trope, a classic scene, to see little eight year old Bruce screaming above his parents’ bodies, in an empty alley...We really don’t need to see yet another one of those. We all know the story. And for those who are not up to date, there will be hints of what happened dropped all through the show. Because it’s still about Batman.

The Robins and all though, often people don’t even know there’s more than one Robin ? Or at least don’t know how many there are really...So here how I would love for the show to start/be : 

The first few episodes would only be about ONE kid, and ONE “extended family member” (Like Babs, ya know ?). My absolute biggest dream would be to have the ENTIRE Batfam represented (or most, there’s some members from alternate timelines/world that I’m not sure would appear...or maybe just as a cameo ?), and each of them would have their moments, and be just as important as the other. My perfect Batfam TV show would portray how they are all linked, how they’re a family (albeit not always a very functional one) So. Here we are. Longer episodes than normal shows,more mini-series sort of things than the traditional 40 minutes episodes. I think an hour would be a good timeframe, at least for the “origin story” episode...so, yeah, longer-than-usual episodes about all the origins of the kids and all.

First episode start with Dick coming in young Bruce Wayne’s life. We quickly understand that Bruce just came back after years away from Gotham (and that it was to train to become Batman). He’s been back for less than a year, and already started to be a night vigilante...And here he comes. Little Richard Grayson. A boy in which Bruce sees himself a lot (because of the way he lost his parents). And so Bruce makes the crazy decision to adopt the kid (yeah yeah I know “ward”), and it literally changes the way he lives. And boom, Dick’s origin story. Maybe a little shenanigans across the Manor. Dick’s difficulty to adapt to living with Bruce now, and not having his parents. Showing how he can get so angry at times ! And how he isn’t just that jolly little boy who jokes around and hugs everyone he sees ? Basically, an episode that could show every faces of Dick Grayson. Because he deserves to have a show where an entire episode is JUST FOR HIM, and how he is.

Second episode would be Barbara Gordon’s introduction. Pretty straight forward. Who she is, daughter of who, how she came to become Batgirl. Her close relationship with the Batman and his sidekick(s). Showing all the dimension of Babs, her intelligence and such. She isn’t just “a badass girl” (she’d only be a girl at the beginning), but an extremely intelligent one who’s able to turn situations around that look desperate, thanks to her analytic brain etc etc. She’s essential in a lot of Batman stories.

Third episode would be Jason’s arrival. Completely different from Dick’s. the episode would focus on the few years he has with Bruce, and where he comes from. How Jason hasn’t always been “the rebel of the family” (and how actually Dick has that role more than any of his brothers really...in this episode, probably there will be a quick mention of how the “previous Robin” is sort of a taboo subject because he left Gotham to go with the Teen Titans and Bruce is still not over it...). How he’s actually really sweet, and so SO happy to be Robin, and finally have someone that cares ? Which will explain why he became Red Hood later on...The episode would end on his death.

Fourth episode would start with Bruce being depressed, still not over Jason’s death. It would show how he became even more violent, which he has fights about with Dick...At the same time, Dick came back to Gotham as Nightwing after Jason’s death to still be there as a support for Bruce. Dick is always there when his friends or family members need his help...Doesn’t mean they don’t fight though. Bruce is even tougher to get through to than he used to. Jason’s death really hardened him further, the guilt not helping, of course. And then...Here enters little Timothy Drake. “Hey, I know you’re Batman !” he tells him, smiling widely...A few of his (baby) teeth are missing, that’s how young he is. The episode would be about how Bruce refuses to take Tim in as first (even more so since Tim’s parents are still alive by then), and would show their relationship evolves, all the way up to Bruce officially adopting Timbo.

Fifth episode : Hey is that Stephanie Brown we see ? Yup it iiiiiis !! Her story. Her background. What’s up with her. This episode is all about her. How she’s an important part of Bruce’s life, however isn’t one of his adoptive kid (it would be weird anyway...it would mean she ends up dating her own brother...). I always viewed Steph’ as an important member of the “Batfam”, but not as one of Bruce’s kid ? Like, she’s most definitely cared for and loved, but she doesn’t permanently live at Wayne Manor, and isn’t officially his ward or adopted kid etc etc...Doesn’t mean she isn’t included and not sort-of-family ! But, ya know what I mean, extremely close friends can be family too (remember : this is only MY opinion and how I view the characters after I read comics with them, you can totally disagree...in that case do it nicely, please).

Sixth Episode would be Cassandra’s. Bruce is fighting against her father, and that’s when he finds that young girl that appears mute, and that just killed a few men in front of him. He learns of her story, how her father tried to turn her into a weapon since she was born, via some audio recordings he found in one of his hideout. And he feels utterly disarmed. What is he supposed to do ? He can’t let such a dangerous person out, at the same time, she looks so young...And it’s not quite her fault, according to the recordings...He can’t just leave her there, but he’s also sure that locking her up would do more harm than anything else. So he takes her in. Ensues the beginning of Cass’ evolution (the rest will be in other episodes).

Seventh episode would be the one where Bruce discovers that Jason is still alive, and that he HATES HIM. Fighty fights fight...Oh shit it’s my son. Flashback of how Jason got resurrected and his short time with the Al’Ghuls, and a little speech about why he hates Bruce so much. Very “Under the Red Hood”, I guess. Ends with a heartbroken Bruce, and an even angrier Jason (because he saw Tim and Cass and can’t believe Bruce still enrolls kids to be his little “child soldier”...of course, it’s more complicated than that).

Eighth episode, Damian’s dramatic entrance. “I thought you’d be taller”. He tries to fight every single one of his siblings (that he most definitely not consider as such yet) (and yes I’m including Cass because I want her to be part of it all...), and it’s obvious they let him win. Sure, the kid trained since he was born...But they’re all pretty old now, and trained by the Batman too. Damian couldn't overpower them that easily (yeah it’s a canon thing I’m not a fan of...). In any case, Damian’s first few days in the family are tough af...

Then after all those origin stories, a lot would happen before Duke’s episode finally comes (because he appears quite late in the Batfam). So an explanation about how he came to get in, what happened to his parents, etc etc. An episode about Duke ! He might come in only like, in a later season (again he comes really late into everything, although he appears before). But when he comes in, Damian is less of a brat now, and considers everyone his family etc etc.

I know there’s a lot more people that are friendly with the Batfam (like Luke Fox and all) HOWEVER, I wanna talk about the “core” Batfam, Bruce and the kids and all. Family. Now of course, Kate Kane would appear. Maybe have her own part of an episode about how at first she decides to become Batwoman of her own volition and isn’t even affiliated with Bruce. Her story at her military school. Why she decided to get into this business etc etc...Probably things about Jim Gordon too. Oh, and the villains ! But really, only full episodes about the ones that are really...family. Like, Kate is Bruce’s cousin and all, but...they always kinda had their own things going on. Now as I said, she’ll appear, but you know what I mean. Basically, allies and friends will most definitely appear, but they won’t all have a full episodes about them ? Maybe a story revolving around them, and therefor we learn the essentials. Also, lil introductions to all the pets the Batfam has (of course we’d have Batcow, Titus, Ace and other Alfred the Cat hehe). 

The narrator would be Alfred Pennyworth, because he’s the one constant in every story. He’s always there (or almost). First episode would start with Bruce as a little boy, after his parents’ death, training around the house, and then as the episodes unfold, more and more members appear, training with him (opening credits).

We’d just have episodes about their domestic life AND their detective life. A perfect mix of both World. And after all those introduction episodes, that would be all interesting because we all know those peeps have some wild backgrounds, then the audience would know everyone ! Now, it’s a lot of characters, so, once they’re all introduced, they don’t need to always appear. There would be episodes of all of them together, and sometimes of just two of them bonding over whatever ? Like, Dick and Jason. Tim and Damian. Etc etc.

And every episodes would talk about all the different facets of their personalities, and not only focus on stereotypes (like it’s often the case :/). Like, NONE OF THEM are one-dimensional characters. So, let’s show that Bruce is a caring man but also a total jerk sometimes, that Dick is the “carefree” one but also the “angry Robin” more than Jason is, that Jason isn’t just a killing machine and a rebel, but also very sweet. That Tim isn't just that coffee addict boy who never sleeps, but a selfless man who’s in it because he thinks he does the right thing. That Damian isn’t just a brat who hates everyone, but tries really hard to better himself and is actually extremely scared of becoming like the Al Ghuls and turning bad etc etc...Show their complex personalities, and not just boring and lazy cliches. 

Are you starting to see why this show would be impossible to exist, wether live action or animated ? Haha yeah, it’d be like, 300 seasons long hahahaha. Because there’s so much material ! ...But I’m pretty sure so many of us fans would watch every single episodes.

PS : This is an “adaption” I imagined, so of course not every subtlety about everyone are in the short synopsis of their episodes I gave, and there would be much more than that. And some aspect of the stories are switched a little. And it’s only snippets, small portions. My idea would be much more worked on. I just wanted to share the little things I thought about ^^. '

[bigskydreaming]

remember when devin grayson wrote about green arrow flirting with teenager dick grayson and then bruce and dick have an incestuous relationship............................

Listen, I have no idea what this ask says, I just see a string of random letters followed by dot dot dot. 

In completely unrelated matters, the only dynamic between Dick and Ollie I abide by is one where the nicest thing Dick’s ever said to Ollie is something like “hey why does your face look like you killed a squirrel and glued it to your chin, is that what you were going for or do people just not like you and so nobody ever told you til now that that’s what it looks like.”

And even there, that’s still just the best Dick could manage (or was willing to even aim for) after Bruce gave Dick a totally and one hundred percent genuine and sincere Talking To about how he needed to be more polite to Ollie. Cuz the way I envision it, all that’s after Dick initially opened with something like, idk, “hey wanna hear a funny joke, it goes “what do you call a known Errol Flynn fanboy who thinks putting on a domino mask when he fights crime with a bow and arrow like, magically makes his goatee invisible? A dumbass who doesn’t get how secret identities work, that’s what. Get it, its you, you’re the joke.”

LOL for the record, I don’t actually hate Ollie and have no really strong opinions on him one way or another, it usually just depends on how he’s being written in whatever story or issue I’m reading with him. Its just canon that Ollie is like, one of the few people that Dick just openly can not stand, pretty much, with this stretching back far enough that personally, I like to headcanon it goes all the way back to even before Ollie took Roy in and has absolutely nothing to do with Roy whatsoever.

Idk, its just really fucking funny to me to picture that like, for whatever reason, ten year old Dick Grayson decided upon meeting the Justice League that they were all awesome except for Oliver Queen. Dick doesn’t know why, he doesn’t care why, he just knows that like, “I do not care for that Oliver Queen guy, not one bit, and no, I am not open to constructive criticism on this matter, UGH BRUCE STOP TELLING ME I SHOULD AT LEAST TRY AND BE NICER TO HIM, I SAID HE WAS A BUTTFACE AND I MEANT IT, WHERE’S THE CONFUSION.”

Because see, while Ollie is not Actually The Worst, he IS one of the League heroes who is prideful and petty enough to like, absolutely take offense to someone hating his guts for no discernible reason, while considering this more than reason enough to hate their guts right back. Even if that particular someone happens to have both miles and years left to go before they hit either puberty or the top side of five feet tall, and thus in the meanwhile, Ollie must literally lower himself in every sense of the word in order to return fire at his pint-sized and prepubescent critic.

Like, if Dick for whatever reason decided he just doesn’t like Superman or the Flash and he’s not gonna and you can’t make him, then I mean, Clark or Barry or someone else along those lines would just be like, oh, okay, that’s fair I guess. No, its totally fine Bruce, the adorable little human incarnation of glitter, cotton candy and all things Cute and Precious and Wee that you just took in is allowed to hate me if he wants to, its absolutely *wheezing sob* not a big deal. I’m a big boy, I don’t need you to intercede on my behalf with him. Now if anyone needs me, I’ll be wallowing in my room for the next 84 years, trying to figure out if I was some kind of monstrous puppy-kicker in a previous lifetime and that’s why my fate here in this one is to be despised by a ten year old with the superpower of Absolute Preciousness. Its my punishment, clearly, for being just the worst kind of monster to ever exist, the only kind that could actually be hated by someone like your adorable little Fun-Sized sidekick of joy and sunshine and l-l-laughter......no, don’t look at me, I’m hideous! *bursts into tears and scurries away to hide from the light*

But see now, Ollie, on the other hand, like.....he’s not a monster but he’s not about to let even some paragon of preciousness go around painting him as one. Why the fuck does he spend so much money on publicists if he’s just gonna roll over belly-side up the first time one of the people bad-mouthing him just happens to be like, a toddler instead of the usual TMZ?

So Ollie’s not about to admit that he’s actually miffed and even a little bit wounded that this cherub who seems to like even most supervillains more than he likes Ollie, just like, can not seem to be in his presence longer than sixty seconds before drawing his weapons and stabbing Ollie with words that hurt, dammit, because he has feelings too, y’know, he spent a lot of money on pricey therapists figuring out that yes, those are feelings he’s feeling and he can even name some of them.....

Like, he’s not quite on board with actually ACKNOWLEDGING that hey this stings, and that he really just wants to know what the hell this kid’s deal is and why don’t you like me, tiny human, what did I ever even do to you??? But all of that is like......Advanced Level Therapy stuff that he hasn’t quite gotten around to finishing yet at this point in time. Like yeah he’s already dropped a mint on the A-list of the head-shrinking world by now, but apparently he was supposed to keep coming back or something like that, they all keep making a really big deal about that for some reason, and look, he’s been busy. So he really just hasn’t had the time to finish up the course on How To Make Peace With the Fact That Sometimes Tiny Humans Don’t Like Me Even Though I’m A Fucking Delight, Dammit.

But even if the why of this kid getting under his skin so much eludes him for the nonce, Ollie is perfectly clear on one thing: he doesn’t typically go around making enemies of the twelve and under set, but if you prick him, he doth in fact bleed, you little prick. So if this knee-high nightmare is gonna keep coming at me and trying to start shit, then I am more than willing to throw down, is basically Ollie’s take here. 

“He wants to dance? Then c’mon, let’s do this thing. We can dance if he wants to. I’ve got the time,” Ollie says to himself and any other nearby Justice Leaguer who might be looking at him with that swiftly-becoming-familiar expression of mingled judgment, pity, exasperation and something a bit more ambiguous but which probably lands somewhere in the ballpark of “We honestly don’t know what to make of all of this but we’re all a little concerned This Is Not A Good Look, Bro. And also, we would like to formally request by way of this petition with all 200+ signatures of Leaguers and auxiliary members and support staff: please don’t escalate this into something where Batman might actually kill you, because that’s definitely not gonna make any of this less awkward for the rest of us, and uh....not to be indelicate here, but all those times we’ve all said things like no Ollie, we don’t think Bruce is a better fighter than you and we absolutely agree with you, you could totally maybe take him in a fair fight if you had your bow and arrows on you and he had the flu probably.....like. Umm. How to put this....Okay, soooooo....here’s the thing. There may, perhaps, ever so slightly be a possibility slash definite hardcore certainty that there were fib-like qualities to those conversations. A little bit. Oh hey, look at the time, we gotta run, there’s a fire somewhere, hopefully. Lol wait whoops did we say hopefully, that’s so weird like where did that even come from. We definitely meant to say probably. There’s a fire somewhere, probably."

But look, at the end of the day, the thing is, Headcanon Ollie is not like, proud of any of this, but he’s not unproud of it either. He is hashtag justified and he wouold appreciate some validation of that Ugly Truth, even if it might go against the grain and not ever exactly be a POPULAR opinion with the “please don’t tell the ten year old that nuh uh, his face looks like a hairy butthole, nobody wins there, that is not the victory you are looking for” crowd.

Honestly though, at this point Ollie’s list of Big Asks is quite small. Miniscule, even. All he wants, all he really really wants, is for someone, anyone, to join him in grasping the one essential corn kernel at the heart of this whole clusterfuck. The thing that nobody but Ollie seems to get and that Ollie’s pretty sure would be enough to allow him to die happily, if he could just manage to find one other person to sign on to the one single extremely obvious observation he keeps trying to point out to everyone, with a whole lot of nada to show for it:

Because see, the one thing about all of this that drives Ollie just absolutely up a wall, is that for some reason he can’t seem to get anyone to understand that like.....this whoooooole ridiculous mess, just like, even in terms of its very existence in the first place?

None of it is Ollie’s fault.

Dick started it!

Mere moments after frustratedly trying to convey this to Dinah for the umpteenth million bajillionth time:

“Okay, could you at least say something?” Ollie asked exasperatedly. “Anything? Seriously, I would take you counting to ten in Cantonese as an acceptable response at this point.”

“I’m just trying to decide which concerns me more,” Dinah said at last. Several epochs and the equivalent of the entire Jurassic Period later. But whatever, its not like Ollie was holding his breath at this point or anything. “The fact that you are genuinely trying to find and occupy the moral high ground in your feud with....a ten year old. Or that you actually think you’ve found it. That this is it, this is what that looks like. ‘The ten year old started it.’”

That was apparently all Dinah had to say. She fell silent again, and said silence lingered through a recreation of now the entire Cretaceous Period, before continuing into a revival of the whole Paleozoic Era from start to torturous finish.

“Well?” Ollie said with a patience that belied the urgency of the many pressing matters he had to attend to. Like the vanquishing of a ten year old archnemesis most foul.

Dinah just continued to frown pensively.

“Hang on, I’m still deciding.”

[heroicadventurists]

DC Daily S1 E303 James Tynion IV transcribed interview pt 1

On his Detective Comics' run issues 934-981

Amy: In anticipation of your 2020 Batman book, we wanted to celebrate your Detective Comics run here on the show. What mark did you want to leave on the Batfamily with this run?

James: I started about the book wanting to pull together a Batman team book, which really hadn't been done before. Because so often in Batman stories, you see all of the sidekicks and partners in crime, and other people fighting crime in Gotham City, and Batman tries to shut them down. Sometimes he'll have a Robin at his side, but aside from that, he doesn't want anyone else on his turf. And I really wanted to change that. I wanted to start a story where rather than Batman saying no to everyone, Batman says yes. And Batman basically says okay, if we're going to do this, I'm going to bring you in and we're going to train you and we're going to make sure you do it right. And I'm going to bring in Tim Drake, Red Robin, and Batwoman, Kate Kane, and have them really train this team and develop a new generation of crime fighters in Gotham City. And that was really the goal of what I wanted to do. It is something that I had been pitching to DC for a long, long time. And ultimately, they made the decision that we would be doing it and we'd be doing it in the pages of Detective Comics. And it's honestly, I still can't believe that they let me get away with it.

Sam: I feel like there is so much about this concept that goes back to Batman learning how to trust. Something he's not good at. Am I wrong?

James: No you're not. Honestly, that really is the core dynamic. He has trouble letting go of control, and that's something that, it was something that I wanted to examine in him but also examine in the people who are working directly under him, because Tim Drake is also someone who feels like, if someone's going to do the job, he could do it better so he needs to step in and do it. And so does Kate Kane, Batwoman. So you have these sort of three personalities who are all kind of control freaks in different ways, and they are all trying to kind of guide the future of what the Batfamily could be and what Gotham City could be. And really getting into Bruce's head about how he sees the family and what the function of it is to him.

Amy: So what was striking to me was how different and well-defined each member of the Batfamily is in your run. What stood out to you about them and their motivations?

Whtiney: Honestly, this is the first time I had read this run, and I was blown away. I love every moment with Cass. I'm so enamored by her in this story, and especially, honestly, it wasn't any one character, but at the beginning when they're all together and they're kind of discussing what to do with Batwoman, it was my favorite because I feel like I don't get to see that enough, everyone interacting together in the same room and deciding what to do. I love that part.

Amy: They all disagree but they all sound like themselves. Which I'm sure is just as easy as it looked.

Sam: Well, I'm going to make a stupid comment that team dynamics are important to team books. But you could really see how when they work so well, how amazing it is because you established a core dilemma around which each character could have their own opinion. And each opinion was different. There are some overlaps and Venn diagrams there, but like you said (Amy), each character had an opinion about that was native to who they are as people. And it was such a great way, a high stakes way to reveal character, and I just loved it.

James: That issue in particular, because that was issue 975, I believe, and that was the one I had been wanting to do for a long time because honestly, part of my whole goal in writing that book is I was pulling together a lot of the secondary Batfamily characters. And here they are in front of us. But we had some former villains like Clayface. And we had characters like Batwing who existed more on the outskirts of the Batfamily. We have Batwoman who's never really been right at the center. Tim Drake has been more of the center but the team itself was not the core Batfamily. So the moment that something really went wrong, that Batwoman overstepped in a big way and actually appeared to kill one of the villains they were up against because there seemed to be no other path forward, and Batman brings together the core Batfamily, the original family that everyone knows and loves, all of the Robins and Barbara Gordon, the original Batgirl. And we have them sit and decide what they're going to do. And having that moment, the voices of the characters, I wish I had a better answer about how I got into each of their heads. Honestly, it's because I've been reading their stories my entire life. Their voices live in my head. And getting to bring those voices into the book and say something, especially in a series that was always about the Batfamily but didn't really feature the core Batfamily, that was really powerful for me, and that's one of my favorite issues in the entire run.

Hear the rest of James Tynion's experience on Detective Comics and the longevity of Batman on DC Daily

[coldtomyflash]

What do you think of Dick's portrayal in the various tv and movie adaptations? I first saw him in Batman TAS and loved him from the start. But the reboot came around and Tim replaced him as deuteragonist. Also the fallout with his relationship with Barbara (which I once loved) got even worse in Batman Beyond (in which he never appeared on screen) and the comic with the Bruce/Barbara/baby storyline. In the end it was like the writers hated him and in recent movies he takes a back seat to Damian.

“various TV and movie adaptations”

... movie adaptations?

We haven’t seen Dick in a movie in like 20 years. Unless you mean DC’s animated films, like Justice League: War, and similar?

But okay, what an awesome question.

If you check out my previous post (here), you’ll discover quickly that pretty much one of my favourite portrayals of him is Young Justice. I thought they did an amazing job in Season 1 with showing the depth of him (and of most of the main characters honestly) and all the different layers he has in terms of identity, including with his friends, with the league, with leadership, and with Bruce. The time-skip from him being Robin to him being an adult, self-assured Nightwing was a bit of a letdown because that transition is messy, but the characterization was still great.

I also loved him in Batman TAS but I haven’t watched that in so long. Definitely what go me originally into superhero media (well okay I remember being 4 years old and watching the old live action Adam West Batman but like, does that count? I guess it has to, because Dick is straight up hilarious in that, but like, characterization wise idk what to even say about that version). Anyway in TAS we get that whole tension of Dick’s role and identity vis a vis being Batman’s sidekick and I’m really into that. That portrayal is probably like the foundation, stone number one, when it comes to understanding Dick Grayson.

As for Batman Beyond - okay I love Batman Beyond, really and truly, but tbh I kind of think of it like... an alt-universe, almost like a... fic. I think of it like someone’s Batman AU in which they created an OC as a protagonist. And I’m into it! But I don’t really connect it with the rest of the Batman or DC canon if I’m being honest. Terry is great, I adore him, he actually reminds me a lot of Dick, but yeah wtf is going on with the implied fallout between Bruce and Dick and Dick not even being in the show. Idk. Doesn’t count. Side-step that weird non-canon.

(I mean, fucking tell me they’re not basically writing Dick with a different name here.)

Don’t touch Bruce/Barbara. Stick your fingers in your ears and sing la la la la la la at the top of your lungs until it goes away. Do not pass Go, do not collect $200. Do not let DC continue until that storyline is wiped from the face of the earth.

As for the recent animated films, typically they’re not focused on Dick but they do a half-decent job with him. I do like the Son of Batman (or whatever it’s called) animated film where they introduce Damian to the plot; Dick is pretty good in that even though his role is more minor. I haven’t watched the one with Harley Quinn yet where she’s helping Bruce and Dick but I really want to, it looks like it has some potentially entertaining Dick content in there.

(except that hair. What did they do to my handsome boi?)

What I tend to like about the modern animated films is that they get the snark right? They have these people make fun of each other and themselves, they get to be deadpan, they take the comics storylines and bring them to life in bite-sized chunks that are easier to digest. They also tend to have awesome voice-acting. They’re very much designed for pre-existing comics fans and are light on exposition as well, which makes me a good target audience. So I don’t tend to get too annoyed with the characterization in any of them, in part because they’re often pulling directly from pretty good comics arcs.

So the comics - (whoo boy this is getting long!)

I am in the small and Unpopular camp of people who kind of liked the entire goddamn mess that had Dick’s identity revealed to the world in... was that New 52 Forever Evil? i think it was; I have it on my shelf. I mean - we got some of Bruce and Dick’s dynamic and how much Bruce cares for Dick, and I’m all about that, but it was also like a shockwave in the Batfam because holy shit.

That being said, I’m not sure how much I like the direction taken, with the spiral agents and all that. I mean - Dick is Nightwing. And while him going undercover or being a spiral agent is kind of fun, the inherent problem with the identity reveal that they can’t really take back is that he can’t be allowed to be Nightwing anymore. So in that sense I also really fucking hate it. 

And then Dick being Batman for a while when Bruce is off being Not Quite Dead? I like Dick and Damian’s dynamic (kind of) but again it seems like backtracking to me. The way I interpret Dick is so much as his own person that for him to put on the cowl feels... wrong. Like he specifically doesn’t want to be Batman? And it feels like this authorial obsession with Batman, and with their always being a Batman. Like - Gotham needs the Bat fam, not just the Bat man. Y’know? 

I don’t mind the recent focus on Damian, though I think my biggest issue with it is that it kind of felt for a while like “ah yes, Bruce has a true son now, time to give him all the narrative weight, who cares about the rest of these former Robins” and I wasn’t in to that. Which is nothing against Damian. 

(I want more batfam hugs! not just Damian! but also yes this is cute)

But the Batfam is only as interesting and their connections to each other, y’know? I’d love to see more focus on Tim, tbh, on Tim and Jason, on that whole mess and its resolution, on Jason and Dick, on Dick coming to terms with his family colours being passed down, on what it meant for him when Jason died, on what it meant for him when he met Tim. Let’s explore more of that in the movies and animated series, please!!

(I guess we get some of that in DC’s Titans? I hope so. I need to catch up. Dick so far seems complex and angry, which I’m into, but also like... Dick Grayson is a beacon of hope, okay. That’s who he is. A version of Dick that isn’t inherently trying to help and save everyone is kind of hard to wrap my head around. I’m not fully sure how I feel about him yet, but I do like the series).

Oh I totally forgot to talk about Teen Titans. I haven’t watched Teen Titans Go, but boy howdy did I love the original Teen Titans. I was just the right age when it came out to be the target audience and I very much enjoyed Robin in that series, at least as well as I can remember. And Lego Batman which is hilarious.

Okay that’s all for me now. I’ll go back to pretending I’m a Flash blog or something.

[thattimdrakeguy]

Yikes

I blocked the anon, because I got the feeling that they don’t wanna chat, they just wanna rant at me (I’ve dealt with anons before that’s had the same type of language used, and it never ended well before), but there’s a difference between development, and just ignoring how the character is to do what ever you want.

The early arc of Red Robin was character development.

I didn’t like how they tried to develop it, I felt they did for reasons that wasn’t benefiting the actual character in the long run after a while, I felt it only happened because the people that run DC seems to be obsessed with the edgy and wanted to change Tim more into their ideal, hence why my blog doesn’t focus on it despite being Tim and I love Tim, but that early arc is character development.

Had a reason, a spawning point, felt connect to Tim’s past, it’s character development.

Tim had to deal with a lot, he had a mental breakdown, he felt he was losing his sanity, but he was hopeful deep down on his belief that Bruce was alive and felt he could find Bruce, and got a little darker in the process because he felt that’s what he had to do to find him.

He’s been shown to act out before in times of high stress, and this is just that but amplified. 

When Bruce betrayed his trust after having to deal with a bunch of other bull, he got violent on a crook, and after an hour he was over it (mostly), but the events that made Red Robin happen was more than an hour, this was a life changing event, and he changed for it, but there was a spawning point for that type of behavior.

It was character development.

Rebooting the entirety of the DC universe and being unable to understand the basics of the character and instead doing what ever you want isn’t character development.

Tim’s original origin is being a naive, (mostly) neglected kid that was there when the Flying Grayson’s dropped, and later on seeing on the news that Robin was able to do the same exact trick Dick could do, put the pieces together. Later on after following Batman and Robin’s journey on the news and in the papers, he realized Batman got more violent after Robin disappeared, and Jason died. So he sought out Dick to hopefully convince him to become Robin again, and when that didn’t work out, he became Robin, because he felt Batman needed a Robin. A somewhat naive belief, but it is comics, where a man dressed as a Bat is enough to terrify criminals into crapping themselves and not just being strangely confused.

Tim’s New 52 origin is that of an Olympic level gifted athlete and hacker that came from a supporting family that had the desire to go beyond Olympic level athletics because it wasn’t enough for him and wanted to become Batman’s sidekick because he figured he could do it, so he hacked into Penguin’s bank accounts to get back at him, and that ended up with his parents nearly dying from his gang. Making his parents have to go into witness protection, and allowed Batman (who was paying attention to him and his athletics) to make him his new sidekick.

It’s an entirely different origin.

That’s not character development.

Tim’s behavior stemmed from being naive and having a big heart. Even when he got older and more mature, there was still that naive part of him that believed stuff he probably shouldn’t have. His naive judgement was just something he occasionally got lucky on like Bruce, and was more intense like with that and believing he could clone Conner back into existence. It was just more intense from spawning from depressed and miserable feelings.

On the flip side, new 52 Tim showed apathetic behavior on a few occasions, and seemed to believe he was always right no matter what. Making them quite different characters.

There isn’t even the excuse to add that it was a different time. Batman having to turn campy in the 50s and 60s was because it was a highly sensitive time to allow their kids to see and read such violence, hence it was calmed down. Even from all the way back in the 30s, the reason why comics began to slowly become more sophisticated art was because people’s tastes where becoming more sophisticated.

There was no reason like that for changing Tim’s personality and origin, only from lack of care or understanding, A.K.A. not character development., or even changing with the times. Just neglecting to care enough about the character to understand them and how they function. 

Which is why I make posts in a negative light about it, because it’s not a positive thing, and I personally feel that the character deserves better, and that DC needs to hire better writers, or at least use the right writers for the right jobs instead of continuing to not care as they seem to do.

and reading the anon ask back I’m not sure if this was even the point they were trying to make.

They seem to believe that because I like 90s Tim the best, that I ignore everything after and call it trash, but I don’t. I’m well aware I mostly talk about 90s Tim, and that is my blog theme, but that’s because that’s what I like the best. It’s not a statement on everything that came after.

My statements on the quality on the things after stem from the specific things I state the shortage of quality comes from.

Like New 52 Tim, Rebirth Tim, out of character moments, etc.

but I’m assuming this guy wanted to take it the wrong way enough to send me an ask to insult the character I like, and make irrelevant statements as if they sent it to the wrong guy.

and if you don’t like Tim as a character.

I genuinely do not care. I don’t think someone that’s gonna send me a snotty as that doesn’t understand the person they’re talking too’s reasoning is gonna make me really question my opinion as much as you try to gaslight me.

There’s a difference between a disagreement, and just saying buzzwords and insults stemmed from your subjective viewpoint to try and upset people that happen to disagree with you.

I just genuinely think Tim’s a great character.

There’s something about a character who’s just trying their dang best to make people that they adore happy, even when they don’t have the natural talent because they think it’s the right thing to do. To see a kid and his naive beliefs get tested as he goes on life threatening adventures, is very interesting and fun to read for me. To see how this insecure dorky kid deals with not being the best fighter in situations that require good fighting, can be fun, and to see how he deals with failure when he has so much weight that he puts on his shoulders is interesting for me.

To see them struggle to do what they want, trying to move along despite the pains their personal life can give them, all while being a relatively normal kid with school and friend groups that adds light drama on top of it, is something that I enjoy reading, because it gives me something to attach too and read forward to see more of.

He’s like Peter Parker in a lot of ways, does what they do because it’s the right thing to do in their heart, they’re geeky so they’re relatable to the audience that can either look back on their time as a kid and relate to it or are still a kid, they have their personal lives that get in the way of their hero life which causes some headache inducing problems for them, but despite the struggles they continue to try and move on as it takes more of a toll on them.

Peter Parker’s still snarkier, Tim’s more internal, Peter’s more confident as Spider-Man, Tim’s more insecure, Peter’s normally by himself with no one to look up too besides his Uncle Ben, Tim looks up to two heroes that are always looking out for him and have legacies he has to uphold.

But in the ways that made them engaging reads for people, they’re similar, and Tim back then was very successful, even if he was just a sidekick.

You just don’t seem to like that kind of character.

Or you couldn’t attach yourself to Tim the way I have.

and you know what?

That’s okay.

People have different tastes all the time. Some people like edgier characters, some people like the more cartoony ones, and other ones like the obscure versions of characters that don’t correlate with the rest of their character history.

It’s just how people are.

But don’t come into my ask box to come off like you’re acting like you’re superior for saying a couple of vague statements that are completely irrelevant to me, just to insult my favorite character in the end.

You won’t see this, I blocked you, but it’s a nice lesson to learn about how to act to people online.

You aren’t superior because you treat yourself as so.

You’re just another guy online without a face people can see.

[why-this-kolaveri-machi]

dick grayson fic rec post

i’ve read a fair amount of dick grayson/nightwing-related fic over the last few months–and have so many favourites that i revisit frequently!–that i thought it was about damn time that i made a rec post. feel free to add on any gems that you think i’ve missed.

s/o to @cautiousamber who actually inadvertently got this ball rolling, and who is just awesome in general.

-

these fics are listed in no particular order. almost all of them are sourced from ao3 and a lot of them feature dark themes, blood and violence. i’ll put fic-specific warnings next to each title, but make sure to check out the tags on the fic itself before reading in case i missed something that you’d rather not read.

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like a rubber band until you pull too hard by @perissologist Summary:  Morgaine le Fey curses Dick Grayson to absorb the pain of everyone he loves.

Warnings: Violence, blood & gore, whump, some swearing. Also, it’s Jason Todd/Dick Grayson, tho that’s not the focus and more or less subtext until the last few paragraphs of the fic.

this is a gloriously simple h/c premise that packs in so much potential that i’m still kicking myself for not thinking of it before. the writing is wonderful, the interactions between dick and his family are heartfelt without being sappy, and the writer treads a fine, fine line between jason’s general standoffishness and the aching core of his love for his family so damn well. 

Half Lost, Half Found by takadainmate Summary:  Driven underground, Batman fights to keep Nightwing alive.

Warnings: Violence, blood & gore, graphic descriptions of injury, some swearing. And it’s, uh, incomplete, and likely to remain that way.

this… THIS is the fic that truly inspired me to make this post, because everyone needs to read it. rich in detail and full of glorious h/c, it manages to give us a nuanced, dynamic portrayal of bruce and dick’s relationship even while ratcheting up the tension as batman struggles to keep a gravely injured nightwing alive and save them both from Peril. it lacks the final chapter where (presumably) they are rescued and finally get a chance to recover, but i would 100% recommend reading what’s there even if you aren’t a fan of incomplete fics.

Black and Red by Eboni_A Summary:  Jason Todd is the Boy Terror to Dick Grayson’s Boy Wonder and proud of it. Where Dick is graceful, Jason is brutal, but they work together like clockwork. When a serious illness takes Dick down, Jason makes it his duty to watch over him. Jason loves his adopted brother and will kill to protect him.

Warnings: Violence, chronic illness, blood and gore, swearing, dick is fourteen and jason is twelve and they go through a lot of Shit. first person perspective.

this is nominally set in the young justice universe but there are a lot of changes–with jason todd adopted far earlier than he has been in other batman media and working as a batman sidekick of a different name while dick is still robin. given i’m not a big fan of reading robin-era fics (literal children in Peril makes me squirm) or first-person perspective, this fic still managed to win me over with how well-rounded and sympathetic it made an angry and prickly jason todd feel. dick also has to deal with a fairly serious medical issue, but despite spending most of the fic in hospital, his humour and charm and bravery shine through.

Collar Me (Don’t Collar Me) by CaramelMachete and spread_my_wings Summary:  A basic patrol ends in a common injury. However, complications may turn a simple broken arm into something potentially career-ending. Dick copes as best as he can. Until he doesn’t. His family tries to help.

Warnings: blood and injury, serious complications of said injury, descriptions of surgical procedures and discussion of permanent disability. some swearing. a work in progress.

i am obsessed with this fic. spoiler: the complication is compartment syndrome, and the way the fic approaches not just dick’s ways to cope with this, but other members of the batfam and several of dick’s friends ring very true to their characters. it’s emotional without being melodramatic and wonderfully written. an update on this fic ranks among the highlights of my day, honestly.

through sandstorms and hazy dawns by Makalaure Summary: “Robin,” Bruce grinds out, “stop talking. You need to stay sharp.”

Dick knows he is walking a fine, fine line. “Aw, come on, B,” he says, going for cheerful but feeling like something in him, something he has kept carefully in check till now, is about to snap.

Warnings:  mature themes, mentions of forced prostitution, homophobic language, implied paedophilia, implied past abuse, and exoticisation. panic attacks.

this is a beautiful fic, dealing with all the highs and lows of the earliest stages of bruce and dick’s relationship–both of them utterly out of their comfort zones but learning all the same. being batman’s first robin is so much more of a struggle than dick ever lets on later in his life, and in spite of everything, their growing love for and wonderment at each other shine through like a beacon.

Yellow Submarines by jerseydevious Summary: A collection of Batfam prompt-fics.

Warnings: there’s some swearing, violence and blood in some fics, but mostly harmless, i think.

not all of these are dick-related, but each and every one of these 52 fics have made me cry like a lost child. i love this author’s batfam–they’re softer, more open, and utterly unafraid to love each other with all their heart. it helps that the writing flows so well, too–there are some phrases here that will stay with me for a very, very long time.

Atropa Belladonna by Embleer_Firth0323 Summary:  A routine traffic stop sets off a domino effect that will forever shatter Officer!Grayson’s entire world–transforming a once temperate existence into a lurid nightmare of obsession, deceit, violence, and finally murder.

Warnings: Rape/non-con, abuse, suicide. suicidal thoughts, violence, blood and gore, multiple character deaths (none of the batfam), discussions of pregnancy and miscarriage, swearing, first person perspective. i’m sure i’m missing some warnings; please check the tags for the fic. there are also chapter-specific warnings in the notes that precede the chapters.

HOKAY. this is a VERY long, very soap-opera-y retelling of the infamous tarantula arc from the comics. somehow, it is even darker, but hopeful in that all of the damage it inflicts on dick and those close to him is actually acknowledged and addressed. the world around this particular version of dick is rather nicely fleshed out and full of likeable people… bar catalina, of course. catalina flores plumbs the depths of awfulness and digs even further when it comes to her relationship with dick, but even at her worst, her anguish and trauma is always palpable. it’s a long, difficult, but extremely engrossing read. 

i would recommend reading this author’s other novel-length fics as well, but beware that they deal with very, very heavy topics, and not always with the deftest or most sensitive hand.

Come One, Come All and The Only Thing To Say by incogneat_oh

both of these are really cute fics where members of the batfam care for/spend time with an injured!dick. they are sweet, rich in detail, and honestly a delight to read. warnings-wise, i can’t think of anything beyond the odd swear-word.

Little By Little by paramountie Summary:  Six times Tiger found himself stuck in Bludhaven.

Warnings: swearing, blood and injury, mind control, violence. Tiger/Dick. 

this fic builds on all the the strengths of the Grayson comic series–a breezy tone, spy/thriller content, and tiger and dick’s fun dynamic. this fic is very funny and kind of heartbreaking in turns. my only caveat is that this dick tends very much towards the happy-go-lucky, quippy, emotional, a-bit-of-a-disaster characterisation that tends to plague him in fanon–but to be fair, that is the persona he put up while at Spyral in Grayson.

O Clouds Unfold by lowflyingfruit Summary:  Over the years, Alfred tries to introduce the younger members of the Batfamily to the noble sport of cricket.

Warnings: none that i can think of, really.

THIS FIC DELIGHTS ME ON SO MANY LEVELS. little snippets of alfred bonding with bruce’s adopted kids over the years by trying to introduce them to cricket–alfred’s voice is consistently amazing, and it is charming af from beginning to finish. 

i’d recommend all of this author’s batfam fic tbh.

Tectonic Doom by paganpunk2 Summary:  Dick and Tim head out for a week of brotherly bonding in the wilderness only to find themselves caught up in a scheme to put humanity on the ‘extinct’ list.

Warnings: violence, blood, injury and gore, minor character death

this is a lovely, long, plotty fic–with a wonderfully imaginative premise that’s brought out in rich detail, with so much glorious, glorious Dick/Tim bonding. there are way, way too few fics that focus on these two.

Ducklings on the Freeway by pentapus Summary: Jason worries about the younger Robins. He doesn’t worry about Dick – Dick’s untouchable, and even if he wasn’t Jason wouldn’t care.

(Or Dick gets hurt, and it freaks Jason out more than he expected.)

Warnings: swearing, injury. Jason/Dick, but more subtext than anything.

jason’s voice in this fic is so perfect–the tentative ways in which he reconnects with his family, and especially dick, while still dealing with a fuckton of trauma and resentment ring very, very true. and tired-but-knowing!dick is a delight as always.

-

this is maybe ~33% of the recs i had in mind, but this post has gotten long and i’m tired, so. i’ll add more later. if you have anything that i’ve missed, please feel free to add it to this post!

[deanky]

Total - C. Martin Croker Q&A

Total TV: I know you were already an animator before you got involved with Space Ghost. But did you also know that you had this great talent for voices?

Clay Croker: I used to work out at the laser show way back when. Ten years ago. It's out at Stone Mountain Park, this giant granite mountain that sticks right up out of the ground, and they project laser shows up against the side of it. That was my first animation job. I created a character right when I started out there, they had this bear character and they wanted a sidekick for the bear. So I came up with a Possum character that they called CW, which stood for Civil War, argh. [mimes vomiting] I didn't come up with that part. But I also wound up doing the voice of that character too. So I was doing voices for laser show characters a decade ago. And I'd always done goofy voices on my answering machine and stuff, and I was always a fan of Zorak from the original Space Ghost.

Oh, really? So this was like a deep-seated desire?

Oh, yeah. They started rerunning Space Ghost in 1978, when I was in high school. And we'd all talk about it at the lunch table and stuff. And there would be friends of mine who'd be like, Brak's my favorite, he's the coolest, he's that Tiki cat kind of guy. And I was going, oh, man, Zorak blows 'em all away. You don't know what you're talking about. So I actually did like a Zorak answering machine message probably while I was still in high school.

God, it'd be great if you still had a copy of that.

I may. I may. I save everything. I have answering machines tapes going back to '80. So when Space Ghost was pitched to Design Effects, where I was working, I had to kind of horn my way in. 'Cause they were just gonna make it a designer job and not have any animators in on it. And I was like, wait a minute! What do you guys know about Space Ghost? You know about any of the villains? And they were like, well, maybe we should have him sit on this. So I wound up actually suggesting that Zorak be on the show, 'cause I was such a big Zorak fan. I was going like, we gotta have some villains on the show! Zorak would be perfect! And [Cartoon Network programming head] Mike Lazzo agreed. He said well, Zorak was always one of my favorites too.

But I was dismayed when I found out they weren't going to use the original voices. 'Cause I thought, Oh boy, we're gonna be working on shows with Gary Owens doing the voice of Space Ghost and Don Messick doing the voice of Zorak Then I find out no, no, no, we're just gonna go with local guys. And I was horrified. I was like, oh, man, here I thought I was giving Zorak a career boost. And there was a point in a meeting where they said, hmm, well we're gonna have so and so do Space Ghost, so that solves the Space Ghost dilemma. Who are we gonna have do Zorak's voice? There's this long silence, and I'm like, well, it's now or never. And I just said, Well I can do that voice. And they were like, do it. So I just spat out one of the old lines I remembered and they were like okay, you're Zorak, that solves that problem.

What about Moltar? Did you have any affinity for him?

No. Zorak I really wanted on the show. And then we started reviewing Space Ghost cartoons at Design Effects, and the first cartoon we looked at was "The Evidence of Moltor." They changed his name between first and second season, I think they probably just couldn't remember what he was called. Originally, they had Andy [Merrill], who does Brak's voice, come in and read for Moltar. He sort of did kind of what wound up being Brak, sort of the same crazy inflections. And they were like, I think that's a bit strong. And then right before the show went to final edit, they said we want you to come in and read for Moltar. Can you do like a Ted Cassidy kind of voice? And I went [switches to sonorous basso] well, sure, I think so. And they said, well, go on in there and do it. So I thought what the hey. But, you know, the rest is history.

Do you ever get confused going back and forth?

At rehearsal. That's the only time I get confused sometimes. LIke I'll have Zorak and Moltar arguing, and sometimes I'll wind up starting to do the other character's voice and inflection. I'll see the word and think, Oh, this is a Zorak line. And it'll wind up being the other way. Sometimes I have to go, "Wait a minute, wait a minute, okay. Start the clock again."

Do you ever get up in the morning and feel like it's a Moltar kind of day? Or a Zorak kind of day? Does the identification ever go that far?

Well, the cool thing about Zorak is the fact that I can pretty much say what I'm thinking if I say it with Zorak's voice. Like at conventions and stuff, when overbearing fans get in our face I'm like, [in dismissive Zorak voice] "Yeah, yeah, yeah."

People love to be insulted by Zorak.

Oh yeah. Well, it definitely makes it easier to deal with some of the fans. We get some pretty rabid fans for Space Ghost. To me it's like, you know, it's just Space Ghost. But we've had some people that are just absolutely, like, crazy for the show. And being able to deal with them as Zorak does make things easier, because you can be like, [in nasty Zorak voice ] "Yeah, well pipe down, sonny, I hear your mother calling you." And they're like [breaks into rabid-fan chortling].

Do people assault you with their version of Zorak's voice?

Usually not. I think, you know, they would be too self-conscious about it. But we always get the guys who come up like with buttons all over their shirts and stuff, and they'll be like, [switches into moronic stoner voice] "Let me be a character on the show, come on, I do good funny voices." OK, we'll get your card and we'll call you. But in answer to your question, the only time I really feel like [a character] . . . I actually feel more like my other alter ego, who's the cartoon series that I've got on the side burner, which is Mr. Angst.

Mr. Angst?

Yeah, and I very often feel like Mr. Angst, a lot of the time.

How does Mr. Angst speak?

Oh, I'm still working on that, but it's somewhere between like Lenny Bruce and someone that has screamed till they're hoarse.

That sounds a little bit like Brak.

Yeah.

At least the screaming end of the spectrum, not the Lenny Bruce end.

Actually the guy that does Bird Man's voice I'm thinking about using as a character. But I think I'm going to use him as Mr. Angst's pal Crude Dan. He was based on a real guy I knew called Crude Dan.

What's Mr. Angst look like?

Let's see, well he's sorta kinda like . . . I don't want to say Danny Kaye because that involves a lot more connotations, but a lot like Danny Kaye gone bad, sort of.

The vessel with the pestle has the pellet with the poison.

So he pretty much just looks like this. [starts to sketch] One of these days . . . I've got some pencil tests done of him already, but with all the animation realism shows that are being worked up now, like King of the Hill and all these more reality-based shows . . . I've been wanting to do that for like . . . I mean I've had this character on the back burner since like '91.

Wow. He looks like a bit of a hipster.

Yeah. Oh yeah. Well I mean he's about like 35 to 38, somewhere in there, and like really into barbecue and bowling and all kinds of stuff like that. Oh, and he's always got to have that un-PC butt hangin' out of his mouth. [sketches it in] So he would be like . .. oh, I forgot all the . . .

The angst lines.

Yeah. [sketches them in]

That's really cool. Mr. Angst. Can I keep that?

Certainly.

Maybe after this big push for the new Space Ghost Coast to Coast episodes you'll have some time.

Well, the thing that's cool is because there's been so much Space Ghost stuff going on I've been able to ramp up my production. I've been able to like get more desks and pencil test machines and all the other equipment that I need when I eventually start doing something other than Space Ghost. But I've also heard rumblings that there's already something besides Space Ghost waiting in the wings, so we shall see.

Beyond Cartoon Planet?

Yeah. Yeah.

I love Cartoon Planet.

Oh yeah, me too.

And Zorak's Horrorscopes.

Yeah, Pete Smith wrote all those, they were a blast. I think we've done like the entire zodiac.

Pete wrote a bunch of, like, wacky stuff, a lot of the songs the Cartoon Planet Band sings on the show. Are we still recording?

Yeah.

I just wanted to like get the process down from the start. We read through the script, we make notes, I come up with a thumbnail story board, I show that to [line producer] Jim Fortier and then I work up the actual first draft of the boards. Then we have a meeting and go through basically all the boards and say, well, we want to use this, we don't want to use that. Then I work up the final boards, they get approved and then they start being animated. So that's how the process gets rolling, as far as like where all the new art comes from.

And that's basically your domain, the new art?

I do all the new animation for the show. I run my own animation company, Big Deal Cartoons. I actually run it out of my house, I have a studio set up in the basement and have freelance animators, all of which have 9­5 jobs in this town, doing animation because there's been such an explosion of the art form in the last year or so I can just get them at night. Right now, we're mostly working on Space Ghost needs.

What exactly do you do here in the Flame Room, Clay?

Tear our hair out? [laughs] This is where we do digital ink and paint. And then composite those new cells into other scenes. Which in this case is all the scenes of Bird Man sitting at the desk, stuff that did not exist in the original Bird Man universe. We do new animation compositing, rotoscoping some of the existing animations from the '60s and take Bird Man and Space Ghost and other characters out of them. We cut 'em out of their original scenes, give ''em new backgrounds, put 'em into a set.

You actually cut them out digitally?

Frame by frame.

That sounds pretty time-consuming.

It is. The show's kind of like a waking hours thing. While I'm awake, I'm thinking about the show. Before, up to this point, we'd been on the air almost three years and put out 33 shows. About a dozen shows a year. This year, we're doing 26 new episodes so it's a big change. As is usual around here, I'm booked in more sessions than just one at once. Right now I'm doing the Fred Flintstone thing at the drive-in and the bowling alley, where I'm like running up and down the hall all day long monitoring what's going on in ink and paint and what's going on in the actual composite, which is in here. So all the cells are brought in, we bring them in under the camera over here and shoot them directly into the paint box room. They digitally ink and paint them, like you're seeing an example of right now. Sometimes we add special effects. Space Ghost blows up Zorak in another scene, we have to paint him to make him look likes he's charred and burned.

Do you use like a stock image of Zorak charred or do you actually create that for every episode? 'Cause Zorak gets zapped a lot.

They have pretty much a standard few scenes where he gets charred, and they just use that over and over. In fact, they just made a new one. But yeah, we try to keep it as standardized as possible. We try to keep all the colors standard.

What about Zorak's boinks? Are the boinks new animation?

Where he bounces?

Yeah.

No, actually that's something that they digitally did. The first time I saw that I went, wow, what was that? They said, "Oh, that's something we were just messing around with." And I was like, okay. I just wondered, you know, 'cause most of the time now if there's new artwork involved in the show, then [senior Flame artist] Butch [Seibert] and I--or whoever is working in here, like putting it together, but most of the time it's Butch--we like put together all the new scenes. But every once in a while they'll come up with something and just go, "Oh, well that's a Tom thing," and they'll have [online editor] Tom Roche come up with something in final edit.

You guys have all these great names: Croker! Roche!

Yeah. [laughs] So I'll see the show and like all of a sudden see something I had nothing to do with and go, "Wow, what was that?" Well, too late to change it now. Watching it on TV.

That must also be kind of fun in a way. You get a little surprise.

Yeah, well, it's like reaching into a bag and getting, like, eeyew, noodles!

[starlight-storytime]

GOD it would be so funny to see the batfam treat Danny's admission of power like a joke for a while, then get their misconceptions smacked into their face by Danny pulling off an undeniably badass move in front of them. but do they learn their lesson that quickly? ofc not we need to milk this! After the initial shock, they think it's a fluke. that Phantom's training with them has paid off, or that he had somehow absorbed their combat traits through a kind of child-ghost osmosis/imprinting on Batman thing. that is until Danny gets genuinely upset that they're so insistent that he's weak that he pulls off something utterly incomprehensible to the cute and sweet image they had of him before.

desperately need Mr Bruce "Contingency Plan" Wayne to be hit in the face with the fact that the child spirit he had deemed a harmless nonthreat that doesn't even require weapons to be made against him is the fucking IMMORTAL RULER OF THE INFINITE REALMS. all Bruce heard at first was "this is a being who's continued existence in the mortal plane relies on him helping/protecting humans, so this child is basically created to be a sidekick, i must help him do small acts of kindness" but then months down the line Bruce is body slammed with the abrupt realization that you can not kill what is already dead, and his "silly new forever young sidekick :D" is literally KING OF GHOSTS AND MORE OP THAN SUPERMAN

bonus points if Jason - who didn't know the entire time, but did find out along the way and before the others - sits back and interchangeably switches between two settings. Defending danny's competence and capability fiercely bc he's a good older brother (who happens to rlly like arguing when he knows he's right lol), and adding fuel to the fire that "Phantom's just some random ghostling, it's impossible for him to be too strong bc he formed so recently :)" It's a toss up whether Jason's pretending to agree with the Bats or calling them all fake detectives for not realizing Danny being out of the zone for so long was a terrifying display of strength for such a newly formed spirit

Reverse BatFam Adoption AU

The BatFam believe that they adopted a random ghost boy with ridiculous power. They think they took in another lost soul, a poor kid trying to be a hero after his death.

Truth?

Danny saw a ragtag group of dressed idiots who tried to fight a ghost, and had no clue what they were dealing with.

A simple ghost. Kempler, Cujo, the Box Ghost, someone who isn't really trying to cause much damage, but gets more aggravated when dressed up idiots start throwing pointy things at them.

So, Danny decides to help out.

And in doing so, he realized just how defenseless a group of the best heroes were.

So he stuck around. Let them "train" him. Sneakily slid ideas and upgrades every where he can.

He thought it was obvious, he was the one helping them. He just figured their egos were to big to admit it.

Until it comes to light that they were no where near on the same page.

And Danny has to find the best way to tell these dangerous mortals that they were like a pack of stray dogs he took in.

In the least offensive way possible.